Superpup/Aeropup

[Guest Curandero]

Just come on board. have Aeropup flying but had a long road and not happy re the 'cruise 100kts which is really 90 when all is going well and weights having to be added and assurance that 'anyone can build this kit' after I said I had no trade background. still, am flying but the 38kt stall is bull****. Mine starts falling out of the sky at 53kts!! Not happy yet. Maybe fixable

 

Curandero aka Paul Naughton

 

 

[Mark]

Hi Curandero & fellow Aeropup owners and builders. Like Brett I hope to get started soon. I have my order placed and paid for and hoping to hear from John soon about delivery time. Curandero makes some interesting observations. What motor option did you choose and what prop pitch and diameter do you have? Is 53kts with full flaps? Hope you can sort it all out.

 

Mark

 

 

[vk3auu]

Sounds like it might benefit from fitting some Vortex generators to the top of the wings to get the stall speed down to some more manageable level.

 

Mosy small aeroplanes seem to suffer from high sink rates well before the onset of a stall.

 

David

 

 

[Knighty]

Hi Curandero aka Paul Naughton & fellow pup followers

 

I've been given some ambiguous advice/directions regarding the proper CofG calculations for the Aeropup but have sorted it all out since through hard work and effort taking advice from other kit builders and manufacturers. Aeropup directs that the CofG should be between 19-27% aft from the leading edge. My original advice was to calculate the empty weight of the A/C and get the percentage smack bang in the middle of the specifications I.E. 22-23% and when the plane is fully loaded she should be apples. After doing this and placing a heap of lead ballast in my tail (heavy powerplant) I decided to weigh my plane with minimum useable fuel, pilot of 75kgs (ME!) and a recalculation placed my CofG well past the aft limit. I dummy loaded my plane to max of 544kg and discovered that the CofG was beyond 35%. My calculations revealed that 11% over the seating location transferred to the tailwheel. I removed 2/3 of the lead ballast and the planes CofG is now 26.5% @ 544KG PERFECT however this has been loaded over the seats and not the baggage compartment! I still havent conducted the test flight however will be doing this very cautiously with a considerable amount of fast taxiing and 2 footers before getting fully airbourn.

 

Now Paul, I'm just going to run some thing by you over the public forum and also PM you with my personal contacts if you like to contact me directly. You are claiming that you have a high stall speed, mmm not good! An increased aft CofG beyond the max of 27% would possibly cause that and also possibly give you an increased cruise as well. I have been informed that a load test had been unofficially conducted in a single seater supapup and loaded until its trim tab become inactive however no stall tests were conducted at the time, the CofG would have been greater than 35% I would imagine. I lay money on the odds that the clean stall speed was increased if tested at the time.

 

I know that another forum member had a few dramas in the early stages of increased stall speed VERY VERY SIMILAR to your claims and I am tipping its because of the same problem. If you like send me your weights over the 3 wheels (minimum weight of pilot @90kgs as per RAAus regs & unuseable fuel etc) but dont give me any further information than that, I will recalculate your W&B and send you back my results to compare with your original findings. Please dont expect the results straight away as I am a busy boy at present.

 

I hope with the assistance of the team on the forum we can broaden everyones knowledgebase and increase the standards of our flying fleet.

 

Chers

 

Knighty

 

 

[Guest Curandero]

Hi Mark, refer to vk3auu re sink rate and no, it was no a no flap day.

 

Curandero

 

 

[Guest Curandero]

Mark

 

Jab 2200 60 diam 42deg prop

 

 

[Guest Curandero]

Thanks Knighty. Am able to do this here in SA but was very interested in your 30, 11/9/ posting

 

curandero

 

 

[Guest The Bushman]

Interesting comments Knighty

 

No1 Supa-pup was tested to gain full GA Rego ie VH DZZ

 

Weight and balance was checked by Lame with vast experience in all Aircraft Tiger Moths Austers Etc Etc

 

I see by your Public Records

 

Airstrip Nil

 

Aircraft Nil

 

Occupation Nil

 

Experance Nil

 

Read a lot do you

 

The Bushman Builder of 3 Supa-aero-Pups

 

 

[Knighty]

Credibility in question???

 

Interesting comments KnightyNo1 Supa-pup was tested to gain full GA Rego ie VH DZZ

Weight and balance was checked by Lame with vast experience in all Aircraft Tiger Moths Austers Etc Etc

 

I see by your Public Records

 

Airstrip Nil

 

Aircraft Nil

 

Occupation Nil

 

Experance Nil

 

Read a lot do you

 

The Bushman Builder of 3 Supa-aero-Pups

Hi Bushman (James)

 

I've very limited flytime/building experience compared to yourself and others (only pilot in command for a lousy 500 hours and with the AUF for over 10 years)

 

1 Full aircraft restoration including major engine overhaul (Rotax 582)

 

2 Owner of Aeropup SN: 2002 and installed a complete new powreplant not offered by the factory

 

3 What I fly, where I fly from and what I do for a living is at my own discreation whether to publically announce or not.

 

4 I think there was some major airframe changes from the Supapup to Aeropup like widening the cabin and lengthening the tail section by about 2 foot? Not sure, only what I have been told by the aircraft manufacturer!

 

I'm not interested in a contest, just trying to help out when I can and with only the best intentions at heart!!! If a plane is stalling at 53 knots well that indicates to me there is something wrong, just pure common sense dont you think or maybe its an instrument malfunction, or the pilot is telling fibs?

 

Thanks for your post.

 

Knighty

 

 

[Admin]

 

Careful guys - no personal attacks or slandering or else a 2 week stint in the cooler :big_grin:

 

 

[TechMan]

Stall speed

 

If a plane is stalling at 53 knots well that indicates to me there is something wrong, just pure common sense dont you think or maybe its an instrument malfunction, or the pilot is telling fibs?

An aircraft stalling at 53kts will interest me also ,particularly if it is RA-Aus registered.

 

Chris

 

 

[vk3auu]

If you have an indicated stall speed of 53 knots, one would expect that either you have a very heavy aircraft or an erroneously reading ASI. I would suggest that you check both for a start.

 

P.S. Don't take any of the personal comments on this page too seriously, some us tend to have a rather warped sense of humour at times, and no malice is ever intended.

 

David

 

 

[Knighty]

Very right!!!

 

Careful guys - no personal attacks or slandering or else a 2 week stint in the cooler :big_grin:

Yep Ian, hear hear

 

Appologies to all forum members, one should not respond when steaming at the collar just turn the computer off and have a cuppa and watch the idiot box for a while, mellow out and smell the roses. Personal conflict and personal agendas is one of the reasons why we lost another forum not so long ago as I remember it as it was a "real slinging match". Will not happen again on my part!

 

2 weeks in the cooler hey, so I'm not the only one who watched Hogan's Army. Darn good show that one.

 

Cheers

 

Knighty

 

 

[Guest Dr Bob]

Tip 3 is Electric Flaps ???

Bushman

what are the advantages of using electric flaps on the Aeropup. What about ease of installation?

 

Dr Bob

 

 

[Guest The Bushman]

that is why we used Electric Flaps was ease of installation and easy to use as flap lever was prone to release and on short final was quite hairy

 

The Bushman

 

 

[Brett]

Bushman ,,,I was hoping you ask what your thoughts were on the differences between flying (mostly) and building the aeropup with the rotax 912 and jabiru motors ?? I am pretty much comitted to going with the jab motor but was just curious really...

 

 

[Guest The Bushman]

I thing the 912 has a better rate of climb if that is the 80 hp one and as we have no preferance for either motor, both are good but the Rotax is a bit of a tight fit and one bloke I know had a real bad time fitting his rotax and I think he removed it ? I think

 

The 100 hp is maybe a bit too much power for the airframe but as we say you have a throttle

 

The reason I like the jab is a I fly 3 differant types of Aircraft all fitted with jabs and as a direct drive engine, no water pumps and just a simple reliable engine best of luck

 

We have a aero-pup for sale at this time with 94 hrs on the clock jab fitted

 

The Bushman

 

 

[Brett]

G'day Mark,,,,Did you end up getting your wing kit delivered? Was just wondering how its going ? ;)

 

 

[Guest High Plains Drifter]

Has anybody tried tundra tyres on their Pup yet ?

 

 

[Mark]

Hi Brett, No not yet. I was speaking to John Cotton on the weekend and he was suggesting that issues with the supply of folded ailerons and flaps and welded fuel tanks were nearly resolved and so my wing kit was 'not far away now'. I guess I will just have to wait and see. The aerovee motor is sitting in a container on the wharf at Los Angeles and should be in Brisbane by the end of November. I expect that I will be underway with the project by December. Mark

 

 

[vk3eod]

New Builder

 

Hi all,

 

I have just purchased an Aeropup kit, hopeing for delivery in Jan..

 

Looking forward to chating to you all in the forum.

 

Paul

 

 

[Brett]

well done mate ,,,

 

hopefully when building we can all keep in touch about how its going and so on :)

 

I too am hopeing to pick up the kit in Jan ,,,not looking forward to the drive however from Geraldton

 

btw ,,,have you thought about what engine you are going to run?

 

 

[vk3eod]

yeah, it will be good if we can get a few builders together to help each other out. I'm sure there will be plenty of questions along the way.

 

I'm located at portland in vic. About 7 hrs from the factory. I dont envy your drive from WA.

 

On engines, at this stage I am leaning towards the J2200. Still doing some reasearch on all the options.

 

The things I like about the J2200 is the simplicity - no gbox, no liquid cooling ect.

 

I'm not sure about you but I have been working my way through the manuals. Could you download the operations manual? I could not - I have sent and email to John C, not sure if this is the same for everone else. Apart from that there manuals and sketches seem quite good and have plenty of detail.

 

Paul

 

 

[Brett]

Yes I managed to download all the manuals but had to save them to disc all individually. I however was "mortified" to find that they were in imperial measurments. Having never dealed with anything but metric I must say im more than daunted by the idea of building it in this scale. The pics do all look good ..Thinking I will start to convert all the measurements to metric and hoping I will not make a mistake converting any.

 

 

[Mark]

Hi Paul & Brett,

 

I purchased my order at the end of June and still no word from JC about a delivery date. There may be a message in that for us all. When I last spoke with John, two weeks ago, it seemed the wings were not far away. I was planning to freight this part of the kit to me here in Inverell NSW so that I could get started and then travel down to the factory in January to pick up the fuselage etc. My Aerovee motor is half way across the Pacific on a boat to arrive in Brisbane port at the end of November. It will be fun to track each other progress, I plan to post photos on this forum.

 

Regards,

 

Mark