Changes at Gympie

[SDQDI]

Well with logic like that why not make it mandatory for all of us to have a tcas? That would be even more effective than just a radio and wouldn't have the hassle of doofus getting the wrong frequency.

 

Anyway that was just a sarcastic comment pointing out the fact that further regulation is not always the answer.

 

 

[Pearo]

Well with logic like that why not make it mandatory for all of us to have a tcas? That would be even more effective than just a radio and wouldn't have the hassle of doofus getting the wrong frequency.

Anyway that was just a sarcastic comment pointing out the fact that further regulation is not always the answer.

People who refuse to use radios when they have them are half the reason we have over regulation. Society caters for idiots with law so they dont kill other people. Why is it so hard to make inbound and circuit calls? I often make position calls as well, only to have another aircraft pipe up in the same area on the radio. Its smart thing to do, and you can make short, concise broadcasts with out clogging up the radio (unlike a lot of idiots that I often hear at Caboolture who like to chat on CTAF about whats going on).

 

If near misses keep happening, then don't be surprised if TCAS does eventually become regulation.

 

 

[Roundsounds]

That is the dumbest argument I have heard in a long time. Aircraft dont fly on fixed 2d routes where you can expect traffic, and they generally fly a lot faster than your average vehicle as well.Also, what is wrong with the added safety of radio? I think it should be mandatory approaching and in the circuit. It helps paint a good picture of where people are. If I am flying into an airport where people are making the correct calls, I have a mental picture of what is going on, and how many aircraft are in the circuit. This also helps me decide on the best and safest way to join the circuit.

 

For those of us who have the luxury of visual traffic information systems, you will know that even when you have the exact location of an aircraft getting a visual on them is sometimes near on impossible. You would also know that quite often the first warning you get is from the TIS, not from your own flawed vision. I can speak to anyone I know who flies with TIS and they all say the same thing, its amazing what you miss.

The change in RT procedures and increased reliance on radio and other tech devices over the past 15 years scares me.

 

The recommended calls haven't changed, but the number of unnecessary routine transmissions have. Situational awareness is reduced when too many calls are made, as an instructor it is my practice to cease patter to allow both me and my student to hear and react to the calls. There are occasions where I can fly an entire circuit without being able to provide a student with feedback / input.

 

I have no issues with calls to avoid a conflict, but it's not uncommon to hear a pilot make the following routine broadcasts:

 

- taxiing *

 

- entering the runway *

 

- rolling

 

- turning downwind

 

- turning base

 

- turning final

 

- short final

 

- clear of runway

 

In the above case only the first two are recommended, I personally make a base call with intentions but the others are completely unnecessary if no potential conflict exists.

 

If you put say 4 or 5 in the circuit there's zero space for any other calls.

 

I've just returned from the USA and am pleased to learn they understand and apply correct RT procedures.

 

 

[Yenn]

I seldom make radio calls at my home field. I know there are pilots there who will not use the required area frequency and others who do use it. So I have to monitor and call on two frequencies, not possible with the Icom I have.We are also right alongside a discrete CTAF, which is another frequency an RPT regularly goes over at less than 5000' on its descent. I also don't want to clog up area frequency with calls and most importantly I can see what is happening.

 

Mandating radio use would be stupid for small strips, such as I fly from.

 

 

[johnm]

I don't think anyone here has suggested that planes that have radios ............... are not used ?

 

 

[Roundsounds]

People who refuse to use radios when they have them are half the reason we have over regulation. Society caters for idiots with law so they dont kill other people. Why is it so hard to make inbound and circuit calls? I often make position calls as well, only to have another aircraft pipe up in the same area on the radio. Its smart thing to do, and you can make short, concise broadcasts with out clogging up the radio (unlike a lot of idiots that I often hear at Caboolture who like to chat on CTAF about whats going on).If near misses keep happening, then don't be surprised if TCAS does eventually become regulation.

Making inbound and joining circuit calls are recommended, what is a position call? I can't seem to "position calls" in CAAP 166, AIP or the CARs.

 

 

[Pearo]

I don't think anyone here has suggested that planes that have radios ............... are not used ?

I am, because it happens. In fact one idiot once walked up to me and said "I dont bother using the radio" after he landed at Redcliffe. I walked away shaking my head.

 

Making inbound and joining circuit calls are recommended, what is a position call? I can't seem to "position calls" in CAAP 166, AIP or the CARs.

Positional Call, as per CAAP 166. Not also there that you should also make a call when there is a potential for a collision?? In fact it says if there is uncertainty, that you should make a call. This is not rocket science, its common sense and good airmanship.

 

 

[Roundsounds]

I am, because it happens. In fact one idiot once walked up to me and said "I dont bother using the radio" after he landed at Redcliffe. I walked away shaking my head.

 

Positional Call, as per CAAP 166. Not also there that you should also make a call when there is a potential for a collision?? In fact it says if there is uncertainty, that you should make a call. This is not rocket science, its common sense and good airmanship.

So you work on the basis that flying creates potential for a collision rather than stick to the recommended broadcasts? Additional broadcasts would only be warranted should another aircraft make a routine broadcast and you determine their flight path could create a conflict. "It's not rocket science"

 

 

[Pearo]

So you work on the basis that flying creates potential for a collision

Do you work on the basis that flying has no potential for a collision?

 

rather than stick to the recommended broadcasts? Additional broadcasts would only be warranted should another aircraft make a routine broadcast and you determine their flight path could create a conflict. "It's not rocket science"

Additional broadcasts are warranted when there is a potential risk of collision. For me personally, that is any area where aircraft converge, be that an airport, a lane of entry, a VFR route or any other area where there is frequent traffic be it in a CTAF area or not. Recommended broadcasts are exactly that, no where does it say "recommended but limited to", or if it does please point it out to me because I am unaware of it.

 

 

[snarf007]

Gympie needs it own dedicated CTAF frequency. 126.7 gets very congested and I have missed radio calls due to multiple aircraft transmitting at the same time.

 

 

[APenNameAndThatA]

anyone who thinks everyone should use a radio shouldn't be aloud to fly!

 

 

 

I think radios are a very important and useful tool but I think that there certainly should be allowances made for people to fly without them if they so desire, obviously not at every aerodrome but I think the current rules for radios are sufficient.

As a compromise, I'd settle for mandatory ADS-B and with cockpit traffic display. There! A compromise! All it takes is some communication. That wasn't so hard, was it?

 

 

[cscotthendry]

Do you think all cars be required to be fitted with two way Comms and make calls approaching intersections or when changing lanes?

Do you think that all cars should be fitted with turn signals and brake lights? Oh wait, they are!

Aircraft radio is the aeronautical equivalent of turn signals and brake lights. Why anyone would want to fly without a radio is beyond me. Many's the time I've been approaching a field and heard someone in the circuit and looked and looked for them, and not been able to spot them among the clouds or ground clutter, but at least I was aware they were there and could stay away from the circuit until I was sure it was safe.

 

Don't want to have a radio in your plane? It's OK to gamble with your own life, but don't gamble with mine thanks!

 

 

[APenNameAndThatA]

I seldom make radio calls at my home field. I know there are pilots there who will not use the required area frequency and others who do use it. So I have to monitor and call on two frequencies, not possible with the Icom I have.We are also right alongside a discrete CTAF, which is another frequency an RPT regularly goes over at less than 5000' on its descent. I also don't want to clog up area frequency with calls and most importantly I can see what is happening.Mandating radio use would be stupid for small strips, such as I fly from.

You didn't really make any valid argument. You should use the correct frequency. Just because you can't use two frequencies does not mean that you should not use one. (This is called making the perfect the enemy of the good.) Clog up? Is the radio so busy that it will be clogged up?

 

Re: "and most importantly, I can see what is happening". This is the most laughable of your comments, not the most important. You don't make radio calls because of what you can/cannot see. You make radio calls for other people.

 

 

[APenNameAndThatA]

I seldom make radio calls at my home field. I know there are pilots there who will not use the required area frequency and others who do use it. So I have to monitor and call on two frequencies, not possible with the Icom I have.We are also right alongside a discrete CTAF, which is another frequency an RPT regularly goes over at less than 5000' on its descent. I also don't want to clog up area frequency with calls and most importantly I can see what is happening.Mandating radio use would be stupid for small strips, such as I fly from.

I forgot to mention: how do you know that you see all the airplanes?

 

 

[Roundsounds]

Do you think that all cars should be fitted with turn signals and brake lights? Oh wait, they are!Aircraft radio is the aeronautical equivalent of turn signals and brake lights. Why anyone would want to fly without a radio is beyond me. Many's the time I've been approaching a field and heard someone in the circuit and looked and looked for them, and not been able to spot them among the clouds or ground clutter, but at least I was aware they were there and could stay away from the circuit until I was sure it was safe.

 

Don't want to have a radio in your plane? It's OK to gamble with your own life, but don't gamble with mine thanks!

I'm not suggesting no radios, just stick to the recommended broadcasts for routine calls. The verbal diarrhoea people go on with does nothing to increase safety.