Engine Failure Does Not Cause A Fatal Accident In An Ultralight Aircraft!

[turboplanner]

It sure does...nose down quick and keep the aircraft flying. Low level doesn’t give time to do much...carby heat, fuel tank, mags. Best glide may not always be sufficient and more speed close to the ground is your friend but treat the relationship wisely. Speed can be traded for height to clear an obstacle or even a turn if circumstances permit.

Practice the impossible turn at 3000’ and work out what height you need to land back in the opposite direction, crosswind or to complete a circuit. Add at least 100’ to it and imprint that as your decision heights for an EFATO. But you must know your aircraft and have a clear plan before you firewall the noise knob.

 

Be prepared to wreck the machine rather than attempting to save it. Stretching the glide can be fatal.

 

kaz

Good practice; I would add one element, and this one with an instructor to give you a random start signal. At the signal, count 3 seconds before doing anything, then start the EFATO. The three seconds is the "this is not happening to me period" delay which catches many people in all sorts of accidents.

 

 

[nomadpete]

Gliding taught me instant response to the "nose down" after loss of the/O thrust. There was no room for a wtf moment, it was a trained instant movement, perhaps a mental connection between hearing the windspeed, and the hand.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Gliding taught me instant response to the "nose down" after loss of the/O thrust. There was no room for a wtf moment, it was a trained instant movement, perhaps a mental connection between hearing the windspeed, and the hand.

That's good; teaching yourself subconscious actions triggered by an event, if you put it in your brain over and over again can get your physical reaction time down to between 20/100 and 60/100 of a second vs two to three seconds if you have to think about it and it's driven from your brain.

I was in a cable break in a Blanik, and by the time the bang had finished the instructor already had the nose pointing at the runway and the landing was 10/10.

 

So you have two reaction times - subconscious and when you have to think. The three seconds is still a good idea in case you have the third reaction "this can't be happening....."

 

 

[kaz3g]

The “bang” when a cable breaks is an automatic motion maker when you learn with a winch launch club like I did.

 

But so is the instinctive shove of the stick forward at the first sign of an incipient spin when you learn to thermal just a few knots over the stall at sometimes steep bank angles.

 

Thermals are like a top - narrow at the bottom and wider as they go up - so the temptation is to do tight turns at low altitude to stay inside the rising column of air. I won’t say I didn’t do it, but I was young and bullet proof then.

 

kaz

 

 

[Snoopy]

I've had 4 engine failures in an ultralight. One at 1000 feet AGL. 3 at less than  200 feet AGL. Flew home after a field repair after 3 of them, and trailered the plane after the other because it got too dark to fly. I do a short soft field landing nearly every time I land. Not because I need to but to keep in practice. Engine failure at 1500 AGL training did not prepare me, except for the stick forward as soon as the noise stops part. Being vigilant regarding wind direction and staying away from tiger country certainly helped. Practice practice practice landing without touching the throttle also certainly helped.  

 

As this thread states.  Engine failure should not reusult in a fatality as long as you prepare, train, and anticipate that it will happen to you one day. 

 

 

[turboplanner]

I've had 4 engine failures in an ultralight. One at 1000 feet AGL. 3 at less than  200 feet AGL. Flew home after a field repair after 3 of them, and trailered the plane after the other because it got too dark to fly. I do a short soft field landing nearly every time I land. Not because I need to but to keep in practice. Engine failure at 1500 AGL training did not prepare me, except for the stick forward as soon as the noise stops part. Being vigilant regarding wind direction and staying away from tiger country certainly helped. Practice practice practice landing without touching the throttle also certainly helped.  As this thread states.  Engine failure should not reusult in a fatality as long as you prepare, train, and anticipate that it will happen to you one day. 

Great record, and shows that doing what you do works.

 

 

[nomadpete]

I've put it to the test when I had EFATO at about 200'. The automatic reaction steadily pushed the stick forward, maintaining glide speed and committed to straight ahead landing off the end of the field. That was the limit of the automatic reaction. Then I had a big delay (probably only 4 seconds) while my brain did the wtf routine. Then it was way too late to do any engine check or attempt a restart. My cognitive reasoning kicked in and carried out the landing without incident.

 

After the adrenaline wore off I thanked my instructor. The training had kicked in as it should.

 

 

[dsam]

Somewhat relevant to this topic - The Dynon Skyview displays a “glide ring” over the Airservices moving map display. It offsets according to wind aloft, and is terrain & altitude aware, for flights over the high country. If you should encounter engine failure enroute, you know instantly what is in range for your glide.  I always keep an eye on this glide ring, noting potential forced landing sites & wind directions as I fly. 

 

 

[Jaba-who]

I think both ozrunways and avplan will do the same, somewhere in the bowels of the setup menus. 

 

I was in Oshkosh 2014 and a mob had a set of  smart glasses linked to an ilevil brand module which gave you highway in the sky set of boxes in the glasses. 

 

You had during set up put in the  parameters of your aircraft, it knew the winds and stuff and  if you had an engine failure if you flew through the boxes it took you to final on the nearest. If there were none it gave a warning and left it to you decide where you’d go. 

 

I must admit haven’t seen anything of them since so maybe not as good as it was painter by the sales guy but it was claimed to work. 

 

 

[dsam]

It sure does...

...Be prepared to wreck the machine rather than attempting to save it. Stretching the glide can be fatal.

 

kaz

My 15 year old self watched a draggy 2 seater training glider stall & cartwheel into a paddock trying to stretch a glide over a dirt road & telephone wire back to the airfield. They luckily only had minor injuries, but it left an indelible impression on me, especially as I was scheduled as the next student to fly in that (now wrecked) glider!

Far better would have been if they had recognised they set up the circuit too low, and made the decision early to land short in the (perfectly usable) stubble field short of final!

 

 

[dsam]

I think both ozrunways and avplan will do the same, somewhere in the bowels of the setup menus. I was in Oshkosh 2014 and a mob had a set of  smart glasses linked to an ilevil brand module which gave you highway in the sky set of boxes in the glasses. 

 

You had during set up put in the  parameters of your aircraft, it knew the winds and stuff and  if you had an engine failure if you flew through the boxes it took you to final on the nearest. If there were none it gave a warning and left it to you decide where you’d go. 

 

I must admit haven’t seen anything of them since so maybe not as good as it was painter by the sales guy but it was claimed to work. 

OzRunways had this glide-ring feature several versions ago, but they dropped it... perhaps they were worried of legal action??

AvPlan does still have this, but like the Dynon, you need to enter your aircraft glide speed & glide ratio data correctly. AvPlan’s glide ring allows for terrain & altitude, but unlike the Dynon, I don’t think it has accurate compensation for actual calculated wind aloft.

 

I’m happy to be corrected on this Bevan...

 

 

[GraemeK]

AvPlan’s glide ring allows for terrain & altitude, but unlike the Dynon, I don’t think it has accurate compensation for actual calculated wind aloft.

From memory, it does compensate for wind - and the effect is quite marked!

 

 

[Downunder]

I have the Dynon.....

 

You need to remember the ring offset is only for your current altitude and calculated wind direction/strength.

 

As you ARE decending, winds below could be in the opposite direction.

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

Good point Downunder. It is especially true where sea-breezes come in. I remember a badly damaged STOL plane which was caught by a tailwind on finals...  the wind was SW to 200 feet, and easterly above that. 

 

For many of my final glides,  usually into the SW, the report from the ground was for a SW sea breeze . But heading into the SW there was a tailwind component down to about 1500 ft, at which height the tailwind became a headwind.

 

 

[dsam]

I have the Dynon.....You need to remember the ring offset is only for your current altitude and calculated wind direction/strength.

 

As you ARE decending, winds below could be in the opposite direction.

Quite correct. That’s why I used the plural... “wind directionS” in my comment. The glide ring tells you what paddocks to look for, and your ongoing vigilance watches for smoke trails, dust plumes behind farm equipment, ripples on dam water, etc. throughout your journey. 

 

 

[Yenn]

I have had 3 engine out landings in ultralights and 1 in a Cessna. The one thing I have learnt is to keep a high steep approach. Flying with some others in GA or even some ultralights, I know that if the engine fails, we will not make the strip. If I am too high there is plenty of scope to get down, but what chance if I am too low?

 

 

[Hargraves]

Quite right Yenn,   unnecessary low flying is Russian Roulette and will catch up to you eventually,   as far as i,m aware no one,s died crashing into the sky yet

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

I agree. Once I did a simulated engine failure some distance from an airfield and could have made it but ruined things by doing a circuit when I got there. Turning from downwind to base I saw that I was too low.

 

So now I reckon the thing to do is to get to base leg high and do S turns on base leg till its time to go to finals.

 

 

[Downunder]

Full flap, may also allow you to descend steeper and slower if required......

 

Plenty of options if too high...... Not many if too low....

 

 

[spacesailor]

"Full flap, may also allow you to descend steeper and slower if required"

 

The Japanese...... have developed a seaplane, that has flaps that drop almost 90 degrees,  to the wing, making takeoff in less than 500 mtrs.

 

I, have a look for the link later.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[spacesailor]

The STOL seaplane.

 

PX-S STOL Flying Boat

 

"

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh8mn0DeKSs "

 

spacesailor

 

 

[Downunder]

Ha Ha... no doubt the 4 turbo props had a lot to do with the short take off but but that inner flap was about 90 degrees for sure!

 

 

[boleropilot]

I agree. Once I did a simulated engine failure some distance from an airfield and could have made it but ruined things by doing a circuit when I got there. Turning from downwind to base I saw that I was too low.So now I reckon the thing to do is to get to base leg high and do S turns on base leg till its time to go to finals.

Yeah my paragliding instructor was the one who first taught me the techniques for landing 'on the spot' - no chance of a go around in a paraglider (unless you jag a low save, but that's never going to happen - just ask Murphy)

One of the big things both my paraglider and ultralight instructors drummed into me was to never turn your back on your intended landing point - not much fun when you're committed and stressed, then after a 360 you can't see your chosen spot

 

My little airfield at Woolooman has hills all around and is a bit short, so Kiwi suggested I approach from overhead and then spiral down - that way I will always be within glide of the 'field

 

Great thing about Drifters of course is they sideslip like a demon and drop like a brick in the process - seriously thinking about installing disc brakes for a better chance of avoiding the fence at the South end of the 'field - I'd ground loop before I got too close anyway...

 

On the subject of getting from the end of Downwind to touchdown, there has been quite a lot of discussion on this forum about the 'military' style turn = one big 180 degree descending turn - pros and cons with this option but more pros than cons I think

 

btw, re the air blown over the flaps on the jap seaplane, if I remember correctly the F4 Phantoms had a similar system to maintain boundary layer over the flaps?

 

BP

 

 

[boleropilot]

yep:

 

 F-4A (F4H-1F) changes were a leading edge flap boundary layer air control system first used on the 5th preproduction aircraft and blown flaps introduced on the 7th preproduction aircraft.11 The wing leading edges and trailing edge flaps were blown by high-pressure bleed air from the engine compressors, which produced a thin layer of air which helped keep airflow attached at high angles of attack.

 

from website:

 

http://www.aviation-history.com/mcdonnell/f4.html

 

BP

 

 

[boleropilot]

I was at Amberley when the RAAF was flying these beasties (while waiting for the F-111s to arrive) - imagine what the Canberra pilots felt when they strapped one of these machines on....check out the records achieved by Phantoms (bottom of page - aviation history website)