AirVenture Australia is landing in Cessnock this September

[dsam]

New venue... anybody with any insights or comments on this?

 

 

[robinsm]

Given the expenditure on OZkosh and the tripping around the country by management, do we need another national event this year. Will they charge admission to flyers flying in to pay for it. If its blown out cast wise I forsee another disaster...shame.

 

 

[scre80]

Lets be positive and make it a great success.

 

My biggest issue is getting a leave pass from the wife!!!

 

 

[Guest Guest]

Should have been located more in,and away from the Great Divide.

 

 

[robinsm]

They had it, they blew it, politics and empire building I suppose.

 

 

[rankamateur]

They had it, they blew it, politics and empire building I suppose.

Egos and Empires, was a lethal combination for Natfly too. Probably always will be a risk in our sport.

 

 

[jetjr]

Its the same people and RAA are a small part of it.

 

Fees are in promo, everyone pays but RAA gets a big discount

 

Not sure why he location changed but it will surely be harder to get to and prone to weather

 

 

[Camel]

In regard to crossing the Great Divide, Cessnock is one of the easiest places to cross as it seems to me as I'm further North and have crossed numerous times and heard stories of others and in bad weather on the range a lot cross in the Hunter Valley area and then travel coastal or inland.

 

 

[slb]

I agree with scre80 ... lets try it first. Its up to the attendees to make it sucessful.

 

Make it a big fly-in and a meet and greet for all, regardless of what you fly.

 

Cessnock should be a good venue for this to happen. Lets try and make it work this time. I for one will be driving down for the three days.

 

 

[Yenn]

I would say that it is up to the organisers, rather than the attendees to make it succesful.

 

I went to Narromine last year and RAAus touted that as a great success. I was not impressed, mainly because there was a massive generator right alongside the tents which had the seminars. There was no ability for spectators to get anywhere near the aircraft There was no display flying of the aircraft on offer to be bought, The people with the new aircraft, such as Bristell were not interested in talking to people. The organisers were not interested in any feed back from the attendees. To get from some parts of the show you had to go out of the gate and find another hangar, then afterwards you had to re enter the gate.

 

Finally I dubbed the airshow "The interstate Airshow" because they were so far away.

 

 

[slb]

Mmmmm, I hadnt thought of that, Yenn. True that the organisers have to arange it so that the attendees have good access to everything.

 

I didnt go to the Narromine one last year but did go one a couple of years ago there, which wasnt too bad but the Temora one quite a few years ago was probably the best for ease of walking around with plenty to see. I think Carol Richards was one of the organisers back then. Didnt hear too many complaints after that one.

 

Hopefully there will be enough to see at this one ....

 

 

[robinsm]

Mmmmm, I hadnt thought of that, Yenn. True that the organisers have to arange it so that the attendees have good access to everything.I didnt go to the Narromine one last year but did go one a couple of years ago there, which wasnt too bad but the Temora one quite a few years ago was probably the best for ease of walking around with plenty to see. I think Carol Richards was one of the organisers back then. Didnt hear too many complaints after that one.

Hopefully there will be enough to see at this one ....

Carol was the organiser of the exceptionally successful ones, but she was knifed in the back and RAA decided that they could "do it better". We all know how that turned out. Politics and empire building are not conducive to having a successful organisation that actually allows the members to do what the organisation originally set out to do. Dont tell me this is "progress" and "the way of the world. Rubbish. Let good people do what they are good at and things work well, redesign the elephant by committee and political empire builders with rules and egos and ,you have the current RAA set up. Carol should have been lionised, instead she was shut down and bypassed. There was a woman who had members interests at heart and was prepared to go the extra mile for them. She got very little out of it, not even the genuine thanks of the management of the organisation.

[frank marriott]

Remember the set up of the current board was designed to be run by 3 people (ended up 4 i.e. increased from 5 to 7)

 

The individuals involved honestly believe they know what is needed without ANY input. Many organisations suffer when individuals (even with the best intentions) isolate themselves from membership.

 

This will not change IMO without a restructure - until then just cop it OR organise a change.

 

Do not forget the new constitution allows for payment of directors - this is currently played down but if it was not intended why was it included? The choice is up to members.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

I think some of you are being a bit selfish and missing the bigger picture.

 

This puts it nearer to mass population and is exactly what is needed to bring new blood to the sport, now and in the future.

 

I see little need at all for a show just for people involved already and completely aware of everything surrounding It, and it will be inspiring to go to a show that isn't a sea of grey hair.

 

 

[derekliston]

I think some of you are being a bit selfish and missing the bigger picture.This puts it nearer to mass population and is exactly what is needed to bring new blood to the sport, now and in the future.

I see little need at all for a show just for people involved already and completely aware of everything surrounding It, and it will be inspiring to go to a show that isn't a sea of grey hair.

Can’t disagree with you on that one. Last few fly-ins I’ve been to, all the pilots congregate together and there is no one to talk to the general public about the aeroplanes. My wife and I just put chairs under the wing, sat there and chatted to a lot of interested people. We need to encourage new people, particularly young people to get involved with aviation at all levels.

[jetjr]

He new model vs Temora Natfly or even Narromine before that sees massively less risk and cost to RAA. A good thing Id have thouht. Also very few attended.

 

Some fair criticisim of last year but it flogged down rain, remember that bit?

 

Tends to slow interest in fly in events

 

Insurers drive most events today as to what can and cant be done

 

 

[robinsm]

The first year and second years of Temora were an out standing success. The first year, there were over 1000 aircraft on the ground on the saturday . ...Obviously a failure. (then the jaffas and empire buil;ders got involved)

 

 

[jetjr]

Yep and had high cost and if anything went wrong RAA was fully liable

 

After then numbers dropped to apoint where it was going to loose money

 

No ones fault, just punters need for change

 

If RAA was dusting $90 K + on the event some here would be the first to complain

 

 

[johnm]

I see little need at all for a show just for people involved already and completely aware of everything surrounding It, and it will be inspiring to go to a show that isn't a sea of grey hair.

great idea Bex ......................... anyone over 48 years - charge them double ............ or isolate them in a holding pen

 

 

[derekliston]

great idea Bex ......................... anyone over 48 years - charge them double ............ or isolate them in a holding pen

We need all ages and lots of them. Need to show gamers that real life Flying is better than the vicarious electronic kind and show the older ones that all ages can participate. As kids we used to cycle out to the airport and sit on the open-air balcony watching aeroplanes of all types come and go, Chipmunks, Mosquitoes, Viscount, Vanguard, Friendship and many others. We used to just ask the captains if we could have a look around their aeroplane and they were invariably happy to show us around. In this day and age it is nigh on impossible to do that so we need to find other ways of attracting new blood to aviation.

[johnm]

All clubs, professions and groups want new blood

 

I think people have been saying it for lifetimes

 

............... Its just the way it is

 

 

[Camel]

In my opinion !!! Natfly starting failing for very obvious reasons, I will not go until it is sorted and I have voiced my opinion to RAA on several occasions, a survey taken by a previous president a while back and I don't believe the result was ever made public because the reason is not what they want to hear ! , I have emphasised why I would not go ! May be trivial but the reason is shared by many !

 

The event has to be for several reasons ! seminars, seeing new aircraft, catching up with old and new friends, product displays, new technology and home built competition, tools, camping, demonstration aircraft, learn to fly promotion and RAA and Casa information !

 

What I don't want is Casa acting like it is running the show ! They need to stand back and observe and ENJOY ! And critique if nessecary !

 

RAA may be under direct supervision of CASA but I believe RAA has to make recomedations to Casa so it can be viable to operate small aircraft at an affordable and practical way and operate under current regulations and not let the bureaucratic mob interpret the rules so they can stop all the fun which has been observed many times !

 

First problem ! Natfly was a fly in ! Casa interpret it as an airshow ! An airshow is expensive and a lot of planning ! Plus requiring Casa permission and payment also Air traffic control !

 

Had this problem many years ago at a country fly in and Casa showed up after threatening the aero club but the conversation was recorded and the Casa guy jumped in the twin waiting and left with a gentle warning ! As his threats were unwarranted, unlawful and just a grab for justification for Casa existence ! Result was no more fly ins as was too popular ! Too many came !

 

 

[bexrbetter]

The first year, there were over 1000 aircraft on the ground on the saturday .

Sure, and the current industry is of course important to support and invigorate, I'm just suggesting that the people who don't arrive in an airplane are a more important target auidience to substain and grow the industry.

 

Chipmunks, Mosquitoes, Viscount, Vanguard, Friendship and many others.

With the modern gen I believe more fighter related planes like the Tuscano, more colourful stuff like the Foxbat, and like them or not, Euro plastics.

An 'X' gen is more likely to want an Opal Facet than a Chipmonk.

 

 

 

[Yenn]

Derek I agree, but the way to attract people is to allow them to get up close and personal. I have been involved with the Old Station fly in for many years and what seems to be the thing people like is the ability to wander along the flight line. We have had all sorts of people wandering around, including families with kids in pushchairs, and the aircraft have also been able to taxi around, without any incidents. That includes taxiing taildraggers where the pilot cannot see directly ahead. Maybe we have been lucky safety wise, but we make our own luck.

 

 

[Guest Guest]

We need all ages and lots of them. Need to show gamers that real life Flying is better than the vicarious electronic kind and show the older ones that all ages can participate. As kids we used to cycle out to the airport and sit on the open-air balcony watching aeroplanes of all types come and go, Chipmunks, Mosquitoes, Viscount, Vanguard, Friendship and many others. We used to just ask the captains if we could have a look around their aeroplane and they were invariably happy to show us around. In this day and age it is nigh on impossible to do that so we need to find other ways of attracting new blood to aviation.

That pretty much says it all, it is nigh impossible to get exposure to avaiation at any level for the youth of today other than these few airshows. BUT the youth of today are virtually nothing like we where all those years ago. I used to pedal over to my local airport as a kid and wander around the planes unchallenged, everyone now is considered a threat!. Kids these days have exposure to far more activities mainly computer related so something has to give and that's usually getting outside in the sun! That coupled with flying is expensive, not promoted by our regulator ( in fact the opposite) and the expense of going to these air shows all means we have a changing society of what they consider 'entertainment'. If the pilots don't turn up then neither will the masses, pilots therefore are very important. The end results are a dwindling shortage of career pilots now showing up as a world wide issue.