Jabiru Catches Fire

[boleropilot]

in the past I used to keep the (lead acid) battery topped up on my Drifter by hooking it up to a small solar panel - worked a treat...now that I have a Lithium Ion battery I'll be using the same solar panel but taking the battery out of the aircraft for top up between flights. Not sure I need to put a trickle charge into the Lithium Ion, better RTFM I think...

 

BP

 

 

[apm]

Whats with all this battery charging, if battery wont hold charge between flights, replace it.

 

 

[facthunter]

It pays to check the temperature of the battery you are charging. about 1/2 an hour into the charge. If it gets hot something is wrong. Paste ( AGM) batteries once overheated are totally suss. (Unusable). Lead acid batteries that have been left discharged for extended periods can sometimes be re invigorated by slow charging a few cycles and discharging them between charges. This can sometimes remove the white powder like lead oxide? that can short them out. If the battery is more than say 2 years old and doesn't respond to charging straight away and spin the starter easily, don't take the chance with it in an aircraft.. It's not just a matter of the radio not working or having to propswing it.. It can be a hazard and cause damage to other electrical components and the aircraft structure. with acid leakage. Fuses don't provide protection from slow overheat situations. They only protect the wiring from "shorted out " type overloads. Nev

 

 

[apm]

http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/battest.pdf

 

Posted in another thread also, cheap & easy battery test. If it dont pass test, put it in your lawnmower.

 

 

[Bennyboy320]

Whats with all this battery charging, if battery wont hold charge between flights, replace it.

Because if you don’t use the a/c on a regular basis your battery will slowly loose its charge, hence my example, only using the a/c a few times a year the trickle charger means I won’t be faced with a flat battery when I want to go flying.

 

 

[cscotthendry]

Whats with all this battery charging, if battery wont hold charge between flights, replace it.

Yes that is appropriate if you fly regularly. I just purchased a new AGM battery for my plane and the guy at the battery shop said that if they're left standing, disconnected from anything, they need recharging at least every 2 months. If there is any drain at all (like an onboard clock etc) then might need charging more often.

[boleropilot]

It pays to check the temperature of the battery you are charging. about 1/2 an hour into the charge. If it gets hot something is wrong. Paste ( AGM) batteries once overheated are totally suss. (Unusable). Lead acid batteries that have been left discharged for extended periods can sometimes be re invigorated by slow charging a few cycles and discharging them between charges. This can sometimes remove the white powder like lead oxide? that can short them out. If the battery is more than say 2 years old and doesn't respond to charging straight away and spin the starter easily, don't take the chance with it in an aircraft.. It's not just a matter of the radio not working or having to propswing it.. It can be a hazard and cause damage to other electrical components and the aircraft structure. with acid leakage. Fuses don't provide protection from slow overheat situations. They only protect the wiring from "shorted out " type overloads. Nev

I've bought a temperature gauge that has a nice little probe on the end of a 2 metre lead - I'm going to set the probe into the foam up against the battery so I can keep an eye on it during flight (Lithium Ion battery). Justin.....to be sure, to be sure. Any charging will be done with the battery removed from the aircraft.

 

BP

 

 

[facthunter]

The temp gauge is not a bad idea especially if you do long flights They cost very little these days. Nev

 

 

[Guest Guest]

There is a very simple solution here to all this confusion, FLY, fly the machine you paid big bucks for!! I fly my bird at least twice a week using about $10k a year on fuel alone, born to fly not look at it!

 

 

[BLA82]

I have a few batteries that a continually on charge. My boat the moment it comes home and is washed is plugged onto two. One for the main battery and the other the water snake. Been that way for 5 years and I haven’t had to buy a new battery or have never had a flat battery. Thirdly my motorbike. Can go 3 months sometimes between rides and again never had a issue. I think there are two things to consider, the quality of the chargers and the quality of the batteries. All three of my charges cost nearly $300 each and came with a 5yr warranty. All batteries a kept installed and never removed.

 

 

[boleropilot]

I don't see any confusion here. People lead different lives and have different attitudes, values and responsibilities. If I could fly every day I would, but many factors get in the way of that wish. When I finally get my Drifter home to my little airfield at Woolooman, my wife of 47 years will be retired and here to see me slip the surly bonds for that last half hour of light. That won't happen every day because Huey won't let me have that much fun. When we jump on a big bird (Boeing 777, 20th December 2018, retirement trip for my long suffering wife, in magnificent Premium Economy seats to NZ, for 4 weeks) I will have to think about a specific subject while we're away - batteries! 5 cars, 2 mowers, and a Drifter!!!

 

BP

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

... Not sure I need to put a trickle charge into the Lithium Ion, better RTFM I think...

A LiFePO4 battery holds its voltage for months, so a trickle charge is probably unnecessary.

[Ron5335]

I don't trust the chargers that much, so I use an el cheapo bunnings plug timer switch in the line.

 

Just set it for 1 hour a day or every couple of days, and when the charger cuts in, it boosts it

 

with a big hit, and then cuts it back, and even if it's not so smart, it can't boil the battery in an hour.

 

 

[jetboy]

Jabiru draws around 15mA with the master off, thats .36 Amp/hour per day or around 1 A/hr every 3 days. With the standard 18 A/hr battery it will need either a trickle charge or a boost charge after a couple of weeks.

 

Because I have no mains power at the hangar I use a small solar panel across the battery. The small ones are not capable of overcharging my 24 A/hr battery and are safe to clip on to the terminals and leave day & night. - sold at Jaycar for camping boating etc. they are 6 Watt. Larger panels will require a regulator. If I had mains power I'd be using a plug pack type trickle charger.

 

The least trustworthy chargers are ones with fans for cooling, not only can they put out serious power they also heat up and if the fan gets blocked they will burn up themselves. AGM SLA really work best with a regulated supply, around 13.6 float, so the old chargers with the moving iron Ammeter and 6V / 12V switch are also a bit risky for overcharging.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

you guys are making me nervous, I just ordered one of these to use with an old laptop power supply

 

5A Lithium Charger CV CC buck Step down Power Supply Module LED Driver New-in Integrated Circuits from Electronic Components & Supplies on Aliexpress.com | Alibaba Group

 

 

[facthunter]

Keeping your batteries fully charged is the clue to long and satisfactory life. Cold temperatures knock charge out of a lead acid battery also.

 

. It's clear you need the appropriate charger. and quality is essential. I got 11 Years out of a set of batteries in my Van. Lead acid low maintenance .They were German made but I usually get well over 6 years. I never buy the cheapest batteries . The weight gives a good indication of how long they will last.

 

. I think all aircraft batteries should be disconnected when stored in a hanger, for safety.. Nev

 

 

[boleropilot]

hey Tornado, the sellers of my battery told me it had all kinds of stuff (that's the technical term I recall) that monitored input and output and some other stuff too...so I'm happy!

 

my lead acid battery weighs just over 5 kg - the Lithium Ion battery weighs just under 1 kg...same performance figures - the LI battery even has a little press button on the top for state of charge...unbelievable

 

BP

 

 

[bexrbetter]

After owning workshops for eons, I'm amazed that no one considers for a moment that the owner did something stupid.

 

Oh the things I have seen.

 

in the past I used to keep the (lead acid) battery topped up on my Drifter by hooking it up to a small solar panel - worked a treat...now that I have a Lithium Ion battery I'll be using the same solar panel but taking the battery out of the aircraft for top up between flights. Not sure I need to put a trickle charge into the Lithium Ion, better RTFM I think...BP

Li-ion batteries longest life will be obtained by charging to no more than 80%, and not dropping below 20%.

If you charge to 100% then you need to be using the battery. Holding 100% and dropping below 10% are the most damaging.

 

Trickle charge is actually prefered on a Li-ion due to low heat, but not critical.

 

I would go for Li-Fe battery in a Rec Fly plane, safe, they don't care about charging rates or cycles etc..

 

 

[Guest Guest]

Tiger Moth owners must be chuckling reading all these dramatic wives tales:plane:

 

 

[boleropilot]

I'm sorry bexy, didn't realise I was being stoopid....

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

I too use a LiFe battery and have for a few years now. It is only used to start the engine and is switched out as soon as the start drawdown has been replaced. So it is hardly ever connected to anything, only when the engine is being cranked and for a few minutes after that.

 

 

[Mike Borgelt]

Electric powered aircraft are going to be sooooo great. There needs to be some new safer battery tech before I'd fly in one.

 

 

[Dr John]

This incident could have been so much worse. There were several other aircraft and gliders in the large club hangar which is close to the fuel bowser. Fortunately it happened during the day when people were around and one of the members reacted promptly to save at least two of the aircraft by pulling them out of the hangar. It is not confirmed that it was caused by a charger/battery - but you see a lot of hangars with a cheap solar panel on the roof hooked up to the aircraft as a routine post-flight action. 

 

 

[Roscoe]

The battery chargers are used to keep the battery topped up, although with all the flying the planes do, it does seem a bit pointless. As for the battery removal, it's a pain to get the battery in and out of a Jabiru.

If I am parked outside for longer than a week, I hook up a 10w Solar charger with voltage reg attached and works fine.

 

 

[dazza 38]

I have recently looked at 2 different seven stage, computer controlled, "smart chargers", one I bought new and the smart bit didn't work - it charged flat out no matter what. I returned it for a refund, grudgingly given. The second one was an up-market (expensive) brand 15 amp unit owned by a friend. Same story, no smarts, only full charge.So I still use an old (probably 20+ years) Caddymate charger from a golf cart. All it does is charge at 2.8 amps until the battery is full charge and then reverts to constant voltage float charge suitable for long term maintenance. It isn't "smart", but just works well without the fancy add-ons -i.e. no computer! Just tried and proven analogue control.

I have a Ctek smart charger and it works as advertised.