Passenger Endorsement

[Guest Flyer40]

So just to clarify my understanding, there is NO restriction on aero's with pax providing "passengers are briefed not to interfere with the controls and there is adequate communication with the pilot". That's the same requirement for any pax occupying a crew seat, aero's or not.

 

I sincerely hope you're not going to uncover some obscure and little known rule Mike.

 

Don't worry Doug, we're always thread-jacking. That's the nature of discussion.

 

Mal

 

 

[ahlocks]

Not that I'd consider pulling the engine to idle to demonstrate that we're not going to "plummet to earth" if the engine fails or a demonstration of a gentle stall recovery an emergency procedure, here's where I think the confusion is coming from;

 

Civil Aviation Regulations 1988

 

249 Prohibition of carriage of passengers on certain flights

 

(1) The pilot in command of an aircraft that carries a passenger must not

 

engage in any of the following types of flying:

 

(a) flying training given to a person who has not passed a general

 

flying progress flight test for aircraft of the category concerned;

 

(b) practice of emergency procedures in the aircraft;

 

© low flying practice;

 

(d) testing an aircraft or its components, power plant or equipment.

 

I don't demonstrate stalls as most of my pax have been experiencing their first flight in a light plane and to me it's all about the view and not trying to scare the bejesus out of them. The engine to idle and trim for best glide routine definitely settles their nerves - a lot actually.

 

Cheers,

 

Steven B.

 

 

[Guest brentc]

Interesting Steven, I wonder if a recovery from stall is an 'emergency procedure?' Personally I think it would be, so therefore no pax for me for such procedures. 'Emergency procedures' would also cover shutting down the engine.

 

I don't like the idea of even contemplating a maneuver that might upset my passengers. I have a better half that doesn't enjoy flying and I'm very careful to look after her best interests when in the air, which usually means no more than 20'ish degrees angle of bank, no steep climbs or descent, away from cloud and or rain and as smooth as possible which is sometimes hard to achieve.

 

 

[ahlocks]

Just being pedantic re shutting the engine down. :devil:

 

Shutting the engine down is a big 'no no' unless accompanied by a CFI. (I can’t recall where I read this so can’t provide a reference)

 

To consider that pulling the engine to idle and trimming for best glide is an emergency procedure would by definition make every landing from late downwind an emergency! My interpretation of the CAR is 'no precautionary or forced landing practice’ with pax onboard. i.e. No low flight.

 

I will restate that I don’t think that stall recoveries add to the enjoyment of the flight by pax. I have found that pulling power and demonstrating how well the aircraft stays aloft with a simulated dead engine has been very reassuring to the people who have flown with me.

 

I think we're all on the same train of thought though, that it's not good to upset the pax by playing silly buggers and that we have an obligation to exercise good airmanship on every flight.

 

Cheers,

 

Steven B

 

 

[jcamp]

This all sounds like the what my wife's (then 38) instructor said when she finished her nav stuff and was filling out the form "You have the hrs and as I don't think you will be buzzing houses or chasing cars, I will also put in the passenger endorsement". Should he have also said stuff about shutting down engines and aeros"

 

 

[Geoff]

Shutting the engine down is a big 'no no' unless accompanied by a CFI. (I can’t recall where I read this so can’t provide a reference)

 

 

 

Sorry ahlocks been hear before this is not in any rule book.

 

 

 

[ahlocks]

Shutting the engine down is a big 'no no' unless accompanied by a CFI. (I can’t recall where I read this so can’t provide a reference)Sorry ahlocks been hear before this is not in any rule book.

Probably why I can't recall where I read or was told it.

 

All in all, it's still not something that is high on my list of things to do...

 

Cheers!

 

 

[Guest brentc]

From memory, it's a GA rule, thus it applies to RAA automatically unless specifically granted in the excemptions associated with 95.55.

 

 

[bilby54]

I remember a few years back where an aircraft went in on take off and the investigation found the pasengers foot wedged between the rudder pedals.

 

Seems that the passenger was taking photos and got there foot stuck in the rudders so I always brief passengers about keeping their feet firmly stuck to the floor and no photos while taking off - just might save your life or at least your jocks!!

 

Bilby