NSW Boeing 737 Fire Bomber

[Litespeed]

Estimated soldiers deaths on Iraq side in gulf one is 100-200 thousand dead.

 

Many thousand died from war crimes, soldiers left their tanks to surrender and walk away from battle. US used air burst fuel bombs and incinerated them in thousands.

 

For others that is a war crime, but the USA refuses to accept the war crimes convention  applies to them, only its enemy can be a war criminal.

 

So the many thousands civilians killed in hospitals, schools and known shelters when bombed by the USA do not count. Nor does bombing the same site when rescuers turn up. Same tactics now used in Syria and also by ISIS.

 

Once again the USA teaches the world how to be a war criminal.

 

 

[octave]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Inquiry

 

 

[Methusala]

Which bit is the big lie?

 

The bit that reads, "No Iraqi's were harmed when making this video."

 

 

[turboplanner]

Estimated soldiers deaths on Iraq side in gulf one is 100-200 thousand dead.

 

Many thousand died from war crimes, soldiers left their tanks to surrender and walk away from battle. US used air burst fuel bombs and incinerated them in thousands.

 

For others that is a war crime, but the USA refuses to accept the war crimes convention  applies to them, only its enemy can be a war criminal.

 

In the Gulf War, the Iraqi army was estimated to be 1 million men + 850,000 reservists, 5,500 tanks.

 

The Coalition army sent in 750,000, so there was potential for a BIG conflict.

 

So we come to the "Highway of Death" 

 

The Coalition involvement on this highway consisted of A-6 Intruders blocking the ends of a column of vehicles leaving Kuwait. with cluster bombs

 

The attack lasted 10 hours, 28 tanks were destroyed along with military and civilian vehicles.

 

In these photos you can see the vehicles in a chaotic layout, some trying to get into the desert, some running into each other, general panic. These aren't the photos I referred to earlier; that was a column of military vehicles in lines stretching as far as they eye could see, in order, but every one burnt out completely.

 

PDA (Project on Defense Alternatives) estimate deaths at 200 - 300, but could have been up to 600. Other engagements along Highways 80 and 8  bring this to at least 800 - 1000. 

 

So let's say the coalition inflicted 1000 casualties and knocked out 28 of the 5,500 tanks.

 

Colin Powell, Chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff said  the "shooting gallery scene's carnage was the reason to end the Persian Gulf hostilities"

 

This is from Wikipedia, so subject to correction, but I can't see a General Patton or Montgomery stopping after just 1000 people killed.

 

I don't doubt your claim of 100 - 200 thousand killed, but they weren't killed in this column which was so well covered by photographers and TV.

 

 

[turboplanner]

I read the Chilcot Report  (We're now on the Iraqi War (Or Gulf War II), covering 2001 - 2009

 

Extracts from the report:

 

• Intelligence regarding WMD was presented with unwarranted certainty
   
  
• That a war was unnecessary
   
  
• the report blamed MI6 Intel from an Iraqi with "phenominal access" to high levels in the Iraqi government"
   
  

 

If my Iraqi friend is correct and the Mustard and Sarin Gas was buried some years before the Iraqi war the Iraqi informant was correct, MI6 were correct, but there is no way the inspectors would have been able to find cylinders buried under sand for several years "somewhere".

 

If you think back to that time ISIS hadn't crystallised into the identifyable organisation it is today, religious icons were being torn down in Afghanistan, and the country was falling under guerilla control, guerilla attacks had started to occur on the west, and Saddam Hussein had started to act up again, mostly sabre rattling but clearly on the same side as the ISIS origins, then the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

 

Fighting guerillas is the hardest form of war because you don't know where or how they are going to attack next, and with one of them having access to WMD, you could have a World Trade Center on steroids, so it wouldn't surprise me if the forst thoughts were to knock him out.

 

The problem was that just as general populations think leaders such as George Bush, Tony Blair and Scott Morrison run countries and Saddam ran Iraq, they don't; it was his party and the party's allies that backed him up in his decisions.  So even if a war was thought unnecessary, there would have to have been a pretty wide strike to be successful, and the proof of that was how the coalition forces and the new Iraqi government where bombed and harassed for years.

 

 

[turboplanner]

Meanwhile NSW RFS put out 30 of the 50 fires burning yesterday, and this morning TV News was showing backburning of firebreaks outside the containments lines in case fires jumped the containment lines, so a fantastic job starting to look like the end of the tunnel.

 

 

[skippydiesel]

Meanwhile NSW RFS put out 30 of the 50 fires burning yesterday, and this morning TV News was showing backburning of firebreaks outside the containments lines in case fires jumped the containment lines, so a fantastic job starting to look like the end of the tunnel.

 

CAUTION!!! summer has only just started - long way to go yet.

 

 

[kgwilson]

I went flying yesterday. It was the first time in 3 months that there has been no smoke or dust haze. We had 40mm of rain on Christmas eve/Christmas day and all the local fires have been extinguished. BUT this is only in the NE corner of NSW. The amount of burnt out bushland from Yamba to Evans Head is massive. We still have Easterly winds so while silky smooth along the coast it was very rough above the burnt out areas with small punchy thermals. With more hot and dry weather forecast the fire risk will be back up there within a week or so. 

 

 

[turboplanner]

CAUTION!!! summer has only just started - long way to go yet.

 

Yes, certainly. These fires can still escape, and up the 4,000 km drought corridor fires can spread faster. In particular properties in Qld which would normally be green are a fire hazard. This is also about the start of the normal bushfire season in Victoria and the NSW/Qld guys who normally come down for the big ones in Vic/SA are exhausted.

 

 

[skippydiesel]

I was out in the burnt area to the west of The Oaks NSW yesterday - still a few stumps and hollow logs burning two weeks after the fire was declared out - situation normal Australian bushfires are never really out until sustained rains.

 

 

[NT5224]

I just come back to this thread after  a few days-  I’ve  been busy spending my hols putting in a concrete floor into one of our outbuildings with my wife. It’s very hot work in excessive humidity...

 

But absolutely thrilled to learn of the successes of our firies down south. What an amazing crew! If only our political elite had half of their integrity and sense of civic  duty...  Their  stories need to be told. Every man and woman volunteering with RFS is a hero in my book! I’ve been trying to follow the story of the bush fires down south but now that the urgency and drama of a couple of weeks ago is gone, the media isn’t going there so much...so I’ve found this forum an great source of information with some of our members  living so close to the fire line. 

 

But coming back to the thread,  I’ve been staggered  by how far it  went off topic ... with all our old Gulf Warriors reliving their past campaigns.. The various perspectives made for fascinating  reading 

 

Alan 

 

 

[turboplanner]

AHLOCKS at Cootamundra - Going in

 

[turboplanner]

AHLOCKS at Cootamundra - One house saved, plenty more to go

 

[turboplanner]

AHLOCKS at Cootamundra - Brinkmanship

 

[Thruster88]

A lot of fire fighting aircraft up this afternoon in NSW. For anyone without the app. https://tx.ozrunways.com/

 

One of the worst days of the year here with wind 1000m vis in dust and low humidity, only good thing nothing to burn.  

 

 

[Garfly]

Lovely Cobargo, NSW, before, during, after.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Insurance covering bushfires going to be expensive in regional cities now

 

 

[facthunter]

They spread it (the cost) everywhere. The Qld Cyclones increased my rates here in Vic where cyclones never come (yet). Nev

 

 

[mnewbery]

 

These images were taken from the Canbrraaaaaaaaaaa airport webcam

 

20th December wasn't a particularly clear day. The day before reported visibility around 1500m at 5pm.

 

Today is a shocker. The RVR isn't available because the sensor isn't coping. At 8am the tower estimated the horizontal visibility to be 800 metres due to a mixture of dust and smoke. At the same time the AQI was reported to be 3350 with over 1500 ug/cubic metre of PM2.5 particulate.

 

From the photo on the right I would guess the visibility is more like 300 metres. The stuff is in my house now, I can see it. Its here to stay until the wind blows it away.

 

I just wish the politicians were here to experience it

 

 

[Thruster88]

About  300 metres here as well. No new years fly this year.

 

[fly_tornado]

quite the fire season

 

 

 

[kgwilson]

We have had 5 days of relatively clear skies and NE to SE winds but today the haze returned, mainly dust (no smoke smell) as most of the fires in NE NSW are out or very much downgraded.

 

 

[octave]

I am on holiday in NZ and today the smoke from Australia has reached here.

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/406523/australia-fires-sending-pretty-hefty-smoke-new-zealand-s-way

 

Also the house I built in 1990 and sold 2 years ago had a lucky escape. An ex neighbor sent me this footage

 

 

KGn4MiLee2MTmHAZ.mp4

 

 

 

[turboplanner]

For people who earlier were wondering how the ADF related to bushfires, this shows the sequence:

 

1. A request by a State Government

 

2. A response by the Commonwealth Government

 

"Prime Minister Scott Morrison and Defence Minister Linda Reynolds have agreed to deploy a fleet of aircraft and ships at the request of the Victorian Government.

 

As part of the deal, the Australian Defence Force will send Black Hawks, Chinooks, fixed-wing aircraft and Navy vessels for firefighting support and evacuations."  Source: The Age 1/1/20

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Since Xmas in NSW/Vic:

1 dead at Jingellic (firefighter)

2 dead at Cobargo NSW

1 missing presumed dead at Belowra

1 dead at Lake Cunjola

1 dead at Buchan

1 dead at Yatta Yatta

1 dead at Sussex Inlet

1 dead (unknown, found by paramedics)

1 missing at destroyed house, Lake Cunjola