CASA Safety Notice warns against stalling Bristell aircraft - 19 Feb 2020

[FlyBoy1960]

Soneone has to ask.

 

Is it LEGAL to go and put other markings on an airspeed indicator in a certified aircraft ? I suspect without manufacturers approvals and listing the changes in the aircraft POH I think you would invalidate the airworthiness certificate. Having said all of this however the information in the video was quite good

[FlyBoy1960]

 

This was doing the rounds of our club members. They reckon its a Bristell footage

[Student Pilot]

He wasn't far off the ground when he pulled the handle. He didn't appear to try rocking it with power and elevator to get the nose down.

From a distant past I remember they put strakes on the fuse in front of the tail-plane on Tigers and chipmunks to help with spin recovery.

[derekliston]

Piper sport was many tens of thousands of dollars more....for the same a aircraft.

Went the way of the Cessna Skycatcher and the Dodo.....

Probably a good private aircraft but nosewheels didn't hold up as a training aircraft...

I take issue with the statement about nosewheels. By far the majority of pilots in my lifetime would have trained on C150/152, C172, PA38 and PA28, all nosewheel aircraft!

[kgwilson]

About 14 seconds from deployment to impact & he took some time to pull it after the engine stopped. Is the throttle in the centre console between the seats? Initially he pushed the stick forward then all over the place including fully back. I couldn't detect any change in the engine note until it stopped. Spin recovery by the normal procedure looked impossible which tends to indicate that this aircraft can only be recovered from a spin via a BRS.

Edited February 27, 2020 by kgwilson

[Guest Machtuk]

Ye

Soneone has to ask.

 

Is it LEGAL to go and put other markings on an airspeed indicator in a certified aircraft ? I suspect without manufacturers approvals and listing the changes in the aircraft POH I think you would invalidate the airworthiness certificate. Having said all of this however the information in the video was quite good

 

Yes it is illegal to add unapproved makings to an instrument in a permanent fashion.

[Mewp]

Sportscruiser was designed by Jiří Konečný, Bristeli worked at CZAW. The SC is heavier than the Bristell by 155 lb and has a completely different wing design with greater surface area than the Bristell which is also shorter in length and wider in the cabin. What is common are ancillary parts, like the canopy and fuse. Because they look similar does not mean they perform the same. CZAW have documented stall spin recovery and demonstrated this in a youtube video. I have no hesitation to practice stall recovery in all configurations and rudder response is quick and effective.

 

at 4.36 minute mark.

[kgwilson]

Yes it is illegal to add unapproved makings to an instrument in a permanent fashion.

So adding strips of tape to the glass face of the instrument is OK as that could not be construed as permanent.

[FlyBoy1960]

You are not allowed to mark the instruments on the glass face. There are reported fatalities where the glass face has rotated because of vibration. I was having a look on the Internet last night to get more information. All markings must be permanently mounted on the face of the instrument not on the glass

[skippydiesel]

I have heard comments (unverified) of European LSAs with stress ripples appearing on wing skins. If true I would steer well clear of such an aircraft.

WOW!! talk about sweeping statements!! ALL European LSA's ????

[facthunter]

. Jets have up to 4 moveable "BUGS" on the rim of the ASI to set TTS speeds etc. YOUR plane does not have" A" STALL speed. Stall speed varies with it's current AUW. If you have two Sumo wrestlers and a full fuel tank it's a lot different to having a Jockey with near empty tanks. All your margins go up as well with mass increase for any dynamic loads. Nev

[kgwilson]

WOW!! talk about sweeping statements!! ALL European LSA's ????

Who said ALL?

[facthunter]

The top surface of the Vickers Viscount wing used to go corrugated is it rotated on take off.. It was made in Europe/England. Plenty of wings with stressed skins oilcan as they work in turbulence. Really thin wing sections (unstrutted) have highly loaded wing centre sections, presenting a design challenge. Nev

[turboplanner]

. Jets have up to 4 moveable "BUGS" on the rim of the ASI to set TTS speeds etc. YOUR plane does not have" A" STALL speed. Stall speed varies with it's current AUW. If you have two Sumo wrestlers and a full fuel tank it's a lot different to having a Jockey with near empty tanks. All your margins go up as well with mass increase for any dynamic loads. Nev

Very good.

Could you expand on what "dynamic loads" are because recently a discussion became very confused about that with some thinking dynamic loads didn't make any difference.

[facthunter]

Simply, what you would read on a "G" meter or the force pushing you into the seat during turbulence or any manoeuvre where lift above the planes mass is required.. In level unaccelerated flight the aircraft weight equals the lift. IF you are pulling out of a loop you will register around 3 G or more and the planes wing will have to provide lift 3 times as much lift force as in level flight to do the job. Lift and drag are proportional, IF the AoA is constant (best angle to the relative airflow)) so we have more drag and to get the extra lift we need more speed to avoid a stall happening. Nev

[Guest Machtuk]

As we all know AoA is the governing factor re stall. That arbitrary figure of AoA (can vary with lift enhancement devices) can be achieved at different speeds due different weights. Light A/C only have one documented stall speed for simplicity and that's at gross deigned weight. For all intensive purposes 1.3 vs (App speed) will have a suitable safety margin over the actual stall speed on the day. Load factor has a big bearing on stall characteristics.

[M61A1]

The top surface of the Vickers Viscount wing used to go corrugated is it rotated on take off.. It was made in Europe/England. Plenty of wings with stressed skins oilcan as they work in turbulence. Really thin wing sections (unstrutted) have highly loaded wing centre sections, presenting a design challenge. Nev

I have a photo of a B52 in the afternoon sun at Darwin. the whole thing is covered in ripples. Almost every section between frames and stringers has a diagonal ripple across it.

[Student Pilot]

I have a photo of a B52 in the afternoon sun at Darwin. the whole thing is covered in ripples. Almost every section between frames and stringers has a diagonal ripple across it.

I think they disappear in flight

[facthunter]

When the planes are new they don't have them to the same extent. I think heavy landings cause most of the ones aft of the wing , over time. Nev

[pmccarthy]

I think they disappear in flight

It would take a lot to make a B52 disappear. :)

[derekliston]

It can be done! Look on YouTube, B52 gets into a very steep bank and fairly literally disappears!

[M61A1]

I think they disappear in flight

I suspect that all the ripples just Change to diagonally opposite.

[M61A1]

Sportscruiser was designed by Jiří Konečný, Bristeli worked at CZAW. The SC is heavier than the Bristell by 155 lb and has a completely different wing design with greater surface area than the Bristell which is also shorter in length and wider in the cabin. What is common are ancillary parts, like the canopy and fuse. Because they look similar does not mean they perform the same. CZAW have documented stall spin recovery and demonstrated this in a youtube video. I have no hesitation to practice stall recovery in all configurations and rudder response is quick and effective.

 

at 4.36 minute mark.

The SC also appears to have a larger fin and strake. Hard to tell at a glance, but that would make a difference. There also appears to be some sort of fairing or strake underneath the aft fuse.

[FlyBoy1960]

http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2020/03/loss-of-control-in-flight-brm-aero.html

[Guest Bristell]

I note that AOPA have advised that CASA intends to look into the stall/spin characteristics of up to fifty LSAs . So everybody who has had such enjoyment from sinking the boot into the Bristell may not find things quite so enjoyable from here on. The silence from Raaus on this matter has been deafening with no attempt made to support their members . Just lapdogs of CASA it would appear.