Fewer aircraft ads

[pmccarthy]

Anyone care to speculate on why the number of aircraft for sale on the RAA site has fallen from 46 a year ago to 29 today?

[Thruster88]

I was wondering the same thing this morning. It can't be that they have all sold and joined the RAA register because it is down about 100 in the last 6 months. People say that GA is dead although I don't believe it is, but perhaps RAA is dead, time will tell.

[Guest Machtuk]

Aviation is fickled. Pilots jobs where plentiful in recent times, Airlines where hiring etc, now it's all but dried up. A/C ownership goes in cycles also. Age of the drivers increases, costs associated with ownership etc. It is what it is?

[planedriver]

Maybe some are content with what they've got, in these uncertain times.

It's always good to read about what's on offer though, so we can dribble and dream.

[Bruce Tuncks]

Most people buy a house first and a plane is a fair way down the list after food and stuff.

I reckon average people are actually poorer now than they used to be.

If I were just joining the workforce now, I can't see how I could ever afford a house, let alone a plane.

There may be a clue in the " inequality " measurement, where inequality has increased a lot recently. I remember how in the 1970's, Harry Schneider would import a container-load of gliders ( Cirrus, Hornet etc) to have them in stock. They were about $10,000 each, and they sold to young workers.

Now we have a very few $250,000 self-launchers, sold to a very few rich men. Maybe one or 2 a year.

[Student Pilot]

Agreed Bruce, life now is harder. It's crept up on us in the last 40 years or so, incrementally, not in one hit. Wages and conditions in real terms have gone backwards alarmingly compared to cost of living.

There seems no such thing as a permanent job, either casual or permanent casual whatever that means.

[spacesailor]

Has anyone noted the price those motor gliders went for, ?

At pickles auctions.

The Roulets are Way beyond my dream. So didn,t even look how their prices were.

spacesailor

[spenaroo]

the cost of storage is a huge factor.

 

Im 28, by no means in a well paying industry (60k P.A.) but Id happily buy a 15k-30k for an older Jabiru or Corby (a man can dream)

I could sell my Amarok and a motorcycle to pay for it (company car at the moment)

self maintenance could make it reasonable to afford the upkeep.

 

but I don't think I could take the cost to have it parked on the airfield. we are like boats now. where its not a matter of affording the boat, but the mooring fees.

 

If they aren't being bought, why sell?

[RossK]

the cost of storage is a huge factor.

 

Im 28, by no means in a well paying industry (60k P.A.) but Id happily buy a 15k-30k for an older Jabiru or Corby (a man can dream)

I could sell my Amarok and a motorcycle to pay for it (company car at the moment)

self maintenance could make it reasonable to afford the upkeep.

 

but I don't think I could take the cost to have it parked on the airfield. we are like boats now. where its not a matter of affording the boat, but the mooring fees.

 

If they aren't being bought, why sell?

 

This ^^^

You can buy a J160 for $35K-$45K, but;

The annual fixed cost to have a J160 and store it at an airfield is around $10K ( hanger fees, maintenance, insurance etc).

That gets me around 90 hrs or hire time. If i did that time in my own plane I would have fuel on top too, another $3-4K ?

but with hiring I don't get to fly whenever I want, wherever I want, so ownership has its advantage obviously, but you have to fly 100+ hours a year to really make it worth while.

 

Something with folding wings (aeropup, kitfox, skyfox etc) that can be stored on a trailer at home reduces this considerably if you have the space though.

[old man emu]

Something with folding wings (aeropup, kitfox, skyfox etc) that can be stored on a trailer at home reduces this considerably if you have the space though.

 

A 6 metre pleasure boat costs from $50K and there are lots of these parked in residential yards, and they don't seem to get wet too often, unless it rains. A trailerable plane can be bought for less than that.

[Old Koreelah]

Over a dozen years, several rebuilds and two replacement engines, my little plane has a cost less than $40k.

Cheaper than boating, 4WDriving and motorcycling.

[Guest Machtuk]

One of my rides costs me around $220 an HR the other around $100 based on an hour a week each. Fact of life planes are a luxury! I've gone without over the years (never wasted money on a new car) in order to enjoy my retirement, I'm loving/living da dream??

[spenaroo]

True, but it doesn't cost 10K to get a license to use the Boat...

almost all of my family has a boat license, its a $300 one-off cost.

Any tradie can purchase a boat on a whim and take it out the next weekend

 

plus its seen as family and friend time - not a selfish activity like flying.

I was raised in a family where we always had a boat in the front yard. the fuel bill for the 350 Chev was similar, the old 34ft fly-bridge cruiser was a liter per minute at full throttle when it had the twin 250? outboards

Edited March 10, 2020 by spenaroo

[old man emu]

I must admit, I have an antique motorcycle that carries normal registration, so it can be a daily ride. This year it is insured for about $25K, so I suppose I could trade it for a single seat plane. At least with the bike I don't pay garaging fees, and only need to add fuel and oil. I have the problem common to most owner pilots - lack of time to use the machine.

[Geoff_H]

I remember in the late 80's. The manufacturer insurance per aircraft built went through the roof after a few big payouts. Aircraft went from a low cost (if my memory serves me right around $20k) to something like $150k (again memory). Cessna and piper stopped making singles for some years. This was truly a huge impediment to flying. From then aircraft were being repaired not replaced. Bloody lawyers.

 

geoff

[Yenn]

Spenaroo. If you are serious about wanting a Corby, I am considering selling mine and have already sold my RV4. I think it is about time that I hung up the headset, although I am sure flying is good for me even in old age.

Of course before you jump into a Corby you have to be tailwheel competent as well as being of a size to fit in it.

[Student Pilot]

Here's an example of why general aviation is going the way of the Dodo

https://www.armidaleexpress.com.au/story/6669536/airport-rent-takes-off-for-armidale-aero-club/?cs=471

[spenaroo]

Spenaroo. If you are serious about wanting a Corby, I am considering selling mine and have already sold my RV4. I think it is about time that I hung up the headset, although I am sure flying is good for me even in old age.

Of course before you jump into a Corby you have to be tail-wheel competent as well as being of a size to fit in it.

 

Thanks for the offer,

But I'm still a year at a guess from seriously contemplating it.

I'm still going through training for my RPL, was only solo last month. And would still need to get a tail-wheel endorsement

size wise Im just on 6ft and 85kg

 

There is just something about the Corby that grabs my attention and imagination

[spenaroo]

edit: RPC not RPL

[old man emu]

Wasn't Armidale once the base for a large number of ag aircraft, AND had an RPT service to Sydney by Airlines of NSW?

[Student Pilot]

Yep, used to be a few Ag aircraft there. Eastern have a Dash service there from Sydney that is twice as expensive as a flight to Bali, still rather go to Armidale though.

[old man emu]

I could fly RPT to Armidale from Sydney in 2 hrs 45 min, or drive in 5 hrs 52 min. A difference of 3 hrs 7 min.

 

But, I bet the time to go from my driveway to a motel in Armidale by car would be the same if you took into account the time it takes to get from my driveway to Sydney Domestic, book in and board.

[spacesailor]

True, on the time scale.

I travelled from Orange to Holbrook NSW. Then Return. Almost two tanks of sixty litres, each way And a three day trip by car.

A pilot using 22 litres p hour flew in, then returned that same day back to Orange.

Sometimes planes are quicker and cheaper.

spacesailor

[tillmanr]

I am disappointed in your travelling style spacesailor. Orange to Holbrook 400k or less depending on which road you choose.

A good days drive return but that fuel economy in your car?

[spacesailor]

The wife Hates me driving to the speed limit.

We,re not in a race , says the back seat driver.

spacesailor