How has COVID 19 affected your flying or intended flying

[kgwilson]

I don't think the government is doing a good job of handling the crisis. Allowing hairdressing & barbers to continue & the 30 minute backflip is one simple example. Announcing a rule on not allowing cruise ships to dock from the 18th & then 4 dock after the announcement & people get off & disperse everywhere many WITH Covid-19 is another. Ignoring the advice of Health professionals is another. Partial lock down may work and this is what the government is betting on to reduce the effect on the economy but we already know the virus is now in the community.

[turboplanner]

While it's interesting to specualate, especially if you are a home financial genius who can predict outcomes without known inputs, just at this stage the death toll has started, in Victoria, DHHS are now predicting that converting the Exhibition Buildings, Jeff's Shed and the Convention Centre and St. Andrews/Peter McCallum Hospital is not going to provide enough beds for people to lie down on (these are people who can breathe on their own without ventilators). While this is happening anout 40% of the population isn't bothering to heed the urgent messages and 10 km of beach from Brighton to Port Melbourne had to be closed yesterday because people who had been given the simple message "If you can stay at home you must stay at home" continued to do what they always did.

Whether we get a recession or a depression is irrelevent right now, when we need to save every life we can by separation which is the only way to stop being infected at the moment. We're actually back to the action which stopped the plague, and which is the only know action against a pandemic without a cure.

Under those circumstances the best for us is that the government keeps on throwing money in where it's going to save lives, keep essential services going, and feed us.

An independent body has been formed to start looking at how we will manage the financial situation when the pandemic is over.

Historically the best way out of a recession or depression has been to absorb people looking for work into building projects, so when they start earning money they spend it and pay taxes and that's an exponential increase.

[Old Koreelah]

...Vegan/vegetarians are notorious for being unhealthy low in B12 and iron - thats the stuff that gets oxygen to the blood...

FB do you have any authoritative source for this claim?

I've heard this so many times over the forty-odd years since I gave up red meat, but I'm in better health than many who didn't.

Edited March 28, 2020 by Old Koreelah

[poteroo]

The quarantine/biosecurity responses to this pandemic have been generally way too late, and then, applied patchily in different ports of entry. Here's my recent experience of our 'front-line' response:

 

We were long booked onto a Norway cruise out of Tilbury, (London), departing on 24th February. About 2 weeks prior, the cruise company emailed us to say that they would be applying 'enhanced' medical screening at boarding - specifying temperature checks, and a detailed questionnaire. Which they did apply, and thoroughly.

 

However, we simply walked straight through Heathrow, with barely a mention of cv issues! How was that allowed?

 

We duly sailed for Norway, and disembarked in Bergen on 10th March, from where we flew back to Oz via Oslo and Doha, arriving in Perth on 11th March.

 

Once again, our alert, vigilant, Border Security, (or whatever their name this week), failed to temperature check anyone off the flight. They did give us a nice A4 sheet telling us to report 'sick' if we came down with a 'flu' after arriving home. This was before the 14 day self-isolation requirement, but we actually did 95% self-isolate anyway, as I wasn't happy with the Perth Airport 'screening'

 

To see this approach when we'd been better screened a month earlier - and by private enterprise!! My impression was that our Aussie government knew much more that those silly owners of the cruise ship.

 

[disclosure: I'm a former plant pathologist who spent some time as a quarantine pathologist - not that this makes me any sort of expert, but I'm not ignorant about epidemiology]

 

happy days in isolation.....with a well stocked cellar!

[Yenn]

One thing for sure. No matter how much the pensioners whinge they are in the best position to weather this storm. They have an income and most don't have to worry about a mortgage or even rent, so the pension is all theirs. I don't hear many whingeing now and most are wondering how they can help out those less fortunate.

[turboplanner]

One thing for sure. No matter how much the pensioners whinge they are in the best position to weather this storm. They have an income and most don't have to worry about a mortgage or even rent, so the pension is all theirs. I don't hear many whingeing now and most are wondering how they can help out those less fortunate.

Also all those in Retirement Homes have been (or should have been) in lockdown for about a month, so there;s an excellent chance that this group will come through relatively unscathed.

[farri]

Just looking at the lets say older members here (which I am one)

 

Hasn`t stopped me flying and I`m 12 years older than you! .............

 

Yesterday afternoon.

Franco.

[pmccarthy]

Burn offs near my home this morning.

[octave]

When we consider what is happening to the economy during lockdown it is all to easy compare the present economic situation with what it would be if covid 19 hadn't occurred. The fact is it has occured. The most useful comparison is how would the economy be if we did not shut things down and let covid run it's course.

 

I am neither an economist or and epidemiologist but when I look at my own little economy it is easy to become dismayed. I am self employed, I provide a service where I am face to face with my customer (not a sex worker but all reasonable offers will be considered). My business has temporarily ceased to operate although I am beginning to operate online. I have to considered how much business I will lose and for how long under different scenarios. If isolation is not done then we are looking at a large number of people being sick to varying degrees. A large surge of infections would overwhelm our health system and from a personal income perspective would be worse than a more sustained event but with less people ill at any one time.

 

In any case I am more inclined to take my advice from epidemiologists, virologists etc rather than what uncle Dave reckons on Facebook.

[Flying Binghi]

FB do you have any authorities source for this claim?

I've heard this so many times over the forty-odd years since I gave up red meat, but I'm in better health than many who didn't.

 

First up - I am NOT a carnivore. I am NOT a herbivore. I is an Omnivore..?

 

“Source for this claim...” ???

 

3 seconds of google gives me this:

 

Via: What Every Vegan Should Know About Vitamin B12

 

“...B12 is an exceptional vitamin. It is required in smaller amounts than any other known vitamin. Ten micrograms of B12 spread over a day appears to supply as much as the body can use. In the absence of any apparent dietary supply, deficiency symptoms usually take five years or more to develop in adults, though some people experience problems within a year. A very small number of individuals with no obvious reliable source appear to avoid clinical deficiency symptoms for twenty years or more. B12 is the only vitamin that is not recognised as being reliably supplied from a varied wholefood, plant-based diet with plenty of fruit and vegetables, together with exposure to sun. Many herbivorous mammals, including cattle and sheep, absorb B12 produced by bacteria in their own digestive system. B12 is found to some extent in soil and plants. These observations have led some vegans to suggest that B12 was an issue requiring no special attention, or even an elaborate hoax. Others have proposed specific foods, including spirulina, nori, tempeh, and barley grass, as suitable non-animal sources of B12. Such claims have not stood the test of time.

 

In over 60 years of vegan experimentation only B12 fortified foods and B12 supplements have proven themselves as reliable sources of B12, capable of supporting optimal health. It is very important that all vegans ensure they have an adequate intake of B12, from fortified foods or supplements. This will benefit our health and help to attract others to veganism through our example...”

 

Seems the vegan/Vegy crew understand the basics.

 

 

...OK, nonsense out of the way. Back to the China virus...

 

One thing I took on board at the start of the ‘pandemic’ is our current medical researchers/practitioners in the virus related fields are overloaded at this time. I dont expect them to have all the answers for some time to come. I’ve never been one to let the government hold me hand ...So, what I can do to inform me-self of what I can do to help me-self is a priority.

 

If yer ever played them shooter video games yer’d be familiar with the idea of health points. Do a certain thing, or eat a certain thing, or wear a certain thing and your survivability rate goes up by percentage points.

 

If by doing a bit of back ground research on the apparent outliers that have suffered from the virus and identifying possibilities of adding health points to my armour then thats what I do...?

 

If one has ever read my comments reference aircraft crash’s then yer’d see how I like to look at things fairly in depth and work from there. Just because I bring up any particular point don’t mean I think thats the correct ‘answer’ to any investigation of the subject..?

 

Nuff fer now.. the a-noon beckons..?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[kgwilson]

No matter what anyone does in their life there will be change if it has not already happened and everyone will take a financial hit of some description. I informed my commercial tenants a couple of days ago I did not expect that they would be able to pay their rent so that's a fair chunk of income gone for who knows how long, the value of my assets especially stocks & shares have plunged 35% and will probably keep declining. I still have my health, a roof over my head and food in the fridge. I went for a fly on Wednesday but whether I can continue to do so is unknown. The rest doesn't matter until this crisis is over.

[Marty_d]

I am neither an economist or and epidemiologist but when I look at my own little economy it is easy to become dismayed. I am self employed, I provide a service where I am face to face with my customer (not a sex worker but all reasonable offers will be considered). My business has temporarily ceased to operate although I am beginning to operate online.

 

Our kids (and my wife) have been learning piano over the internet for at least 2 years - their piano teacher is in country Victoria. Works really well, teacher and student each have computer set up on the side of the piano for the talking and a camera pointing down at the keyboard for watching hand positions. We use "Zoom" as the videoconferencing tool.

Eldest son also does drums and his teacher is going to online lessons too.

 

If you're interested, their piano teacher holds free sessions on Mondays for other music teachers to give them help with setting up the technology etc. She's been teaching online for 10 years now. If you're on Facebook, look up "Unmani" (she only has 1 name), or PM me and I'll give you my wife's facebook details and she can give you the info. I'm not on it myself.

[turboplanner]

Also all those in Retirement Homes have been (or should have been) in lockdown for about a month, so there;s an excellent chance that this group will come through relatively unscathed.

Spoke too soon, a 91 yo has died in NSW; someone didn't know what "isolation" meant.

[Guest Machtuk]

First up - I am NOT a carnivore. I am NOT a herbivore. I is an Omnivore..?

 

“Source for this claim...” ???

 

3 seconds of google gives me this:

 

Via: What Every Vegan Should Know About Vitamin B12

 

“...B12 is an exceptional vitamin. It is required in smaller amounts than any other known vitamin. Ten micrograms of B12 spread over a day appears to supply as much as the body can use. In the absence of any apparent dietary supply, deficiency symptoms usually take five years or more to develop in adults, though some people experience problems within a year. A very small number of individuals with no obvious reliable source appear to avoid clinical deficiency symptoms for twenty years or more. B12 is the only vitamin that is not recognised as being reliably supplied from a varied wholefood, plant-based diet with plenty of fruit and vegetables, together with exposure to sun. Many herbivorous mammals, including cattle and sheep, absorb B12 produced by bacteria in their own digestive system. B12 is found to some extent in soil and plants. These observations have led some vegans to suggest that B12 was an issue requiring no special attention, or even an elaborate hoax. Others have proposed specific foods, including spirulina, nori, tempeh, and barley grass, as suitable non-animal sources of B12. Such claims have not stood the test of time.

 

In over 60 years of vegan experimentation only B12 fortified foods and B12 supplements have proven themselves as reliable sources of B12, capable of supporting optimal health. It is very important that all vegans ensure they have an adequate intake of B12, from fortified foods or supplements. This will benefit our health and help to attract others to veganism through our example...”

 

Seems the vegan/Vegy crew understand the basics.

 

 

...OK, nonsense out of the way. Back to the China virus...

 

One thing I took on board at the start of the ‘pandemic’ is our current medical researchers/practitioners in the virus related fields are overloaded at this time. I dont expect them to have all the answers for some time to come. I’ve never been one to let the government hold me hand ...So, what I can do to inform me-self of what I can do to help me-self is a priority.

 

If yer ever played them shooter video games yer’d be familiar with the idea of health points. Do a certain thing, or eat a certain thing, or wear a certain thing and your survivability rate goes up by percentage points.

 

If by doing a bit of back ground research on the apparent outliers that have suffered from the virus and identifying possibilities of adding health points to my armour then thats what I do...?

 

If one has ever read my comments reference aircraft crash’s then yer’d see how I like to look at things fairly in depth and work from there. Just because I bring up any particular point don’t mean I think thats the correct ‘answer’ to any investigation of the subject..?

 

Nuff fer now.. the a-noon beckons..?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Crazy Vegans will defend their odd way of life to the grave!?

[turboplanner]

There were still people out there flying for recreation today. Two in the Moorabbin Training Area (which is still an outstanding success, down from hundreds), and those boasting on Social Media.

 

[onetrack]

Sorry F.B. - Your pooh-poohing of vegan diets doesn't stack up against the facts. The Seventh Day Adventists, fairly strict vegans, live much longer than any other Americans, and are healthier in their old age!

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7731947/Seventh-Day-Adventists-longer-life-expectancy-lower-cancer-risk-study-finds.html

 

This old S.D.A. Doc was still working in his 90's, still driving himself about, and doing all his house maintenance at 100 - and he only died at age 104!

 

https://news.adventist.org/en/all-news/news/go/2018-12-20/in-memoriam-ellsworth-wareham-104-was-blue-zone-pioneer-and-cardiologist/

 

Vegan diets are not for me, I love my red meat- but I'm not about to pooh-pooh someone who chooses a different style of diet.

I do keep right away from smoked meats and most pork, I believe they are not good for you, long term. I do eat a bit of bacon, but I always ensure I have a balanced diet, with even amounts of carbs, protein, and vegies/salads.

[Flying Binghi]

Looks like India is asking questions about the China virus. Via an Indian news service:

 

 

 

 

 

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[SplitS]

Sorry F.B. - Your pooh-poohing of vegan diets doesn't stack up against the facts. The Seventh Day Adventists, fairly strict vegans, live much longer than any other Americans, and are healthier in their old age!

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7731947/Seventh-Day-Adventists-longer-life-expectancy-lower-cancer-risk-study-finds.html

 

This old S.D.A. Doc was still working in his 90's, still driving himself about, and doing all his house maintenance at 100 - and he only died at age 104!

 

https://news.adventist.org/en/all-news/news/go/2018-12-20/in-memoriam-ellsworth-wareham-104-was-blue-zone-pioneer-and-cardiologist/

 

Vegan diets are not for me, I love my red meat- but I'm not about to pooh-pooh someone who chooses a different style of diet.

I do keep right away from smoked meats and most pork, I believe they are not good for you, long term. I do eat a bit of bacon, but I always ensure I have a balanced diet, with even amounts of carbs, protein, and vegies/salads.

The Seventh day Adventists do NOT have a fairly strict vegan diet. Vegans hijack the 7th day Adventist study but calling them vegan is a joke What can Seventh-day Adventists eat - Answers

The blue zone's show the more meat you eat the longer you live. The longest lived people are from Hong Kong and they consume the most meat.

Vegan diet cause brain damage The Trendy Diet Linked To Brain Damage - PsyBlog that's why there is a thing called vegan fog.

https://www.womenshealthmag.com/food/a19941229/side-effects-of-vegetarianism/

You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts.

[Flying Binghi]

Sorry F.B. - Your pooh-poohing of vegan diets doesn't stack up against the facts...

 

 

 

Onetrack, re the China virus apart from the B12/iron aspect, I don’t know if the vegan diet has any real relevance at this time. Of the three people referenced in news articles that were quoted in this thread only one is a maybe - the sick athlete. The young lass who died I don’t know as yet because I can not research facebook. The third chap had asthma. Hardly enuf info to make a decision on. I may have to join facebook to do further research..?

 

I thought I’d put the comments re B12/iron up there anyway because if yer past 60 years old and maybe not eating a B12 and iron rich diet it is probably prudent to have a steak and eggs every day until we have a vaccine. If you get the virus its probably best to at least have the blood working 100% at getting ‘oxygenated’ because yer lungs will not be providing much.

 

In passing, I been hearing there’s research out there suggesting high cholesterol is an anti viral..?

 

 

 

 

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[onetrack]

SplitS - Dearie Me! Your favourite Womens Health Mag needs to make up its mind, as to which style of food intake it's going to support!

 

https://www.womenshealthmag.com/food/a19945165/risks-of-eating-meat/

[SplitS]

SplitS - Dearie Me! Your favourite Womens Health Mag needs to make up its mind, as to which style of food intake it's going to support!

 

https://www.womenshealthmag.com/food/a19945165/risks-of-eating-meat/

Check the date's one can change one's mind when new data presents it's self. It's called science.

[turboplanner]

There were still people out there flying for recreation today. Two in the Moorabbin Training Area (which is still an outstanding success, down from hundreds), and those boasting on Social Media.

 

[ATTACH type=full" alt="1585384092528.png]51755[/ATTACH]

 

The review on prohibition of recreational activity is April 13 (I think I said April 19). That doesn't mean it starts again, just a review to see whether the Stay at Home order is to be lifted or nor

 

[Paulmilo]

Now is not the time for playing politics.

As it happens, I have the numbers because I'm working onsomething else.

 

National Cabinet

Prime Minister: LNP

Qld Premier: Labor

NSW Premier: LNP

Victorian Premier: Labor

Tasmanian Premier: LNP

South Australian Premier: LNP

Western Australian Premier: Labor

ACT Chief Minister: Labor

NT Chief Minister: Labor

 

Labor - 5

LNP - 4

 

It's working well because there's a good bipartisan balance.

 

There's not much chance of any Right Wing agendas coming out of that, or Left.

 

The Deputy Chief Medical Officer, Paul Kelly has announced they are expecting a best case of 50,000 deaths and worst case of 150,000 deaths

 

In two or three weeks time when the parents and grandparents start to go, the mood of the Australian people will be such that I wouldn't want to be any Australian politician who strays from the path of doing everything he/she can to save lives, support people out of work, and bring the financial recovery as forward as fast as possible.

 

50,000 deaths. That suggests more ppl will die from cancer. Mind you, if you were dying from cancer but catch COVID19, they will count you as a virus death rather than the cancer that was going to get you anyway.

[SplitS]

50,000 deaths. That suggests more ppl will die from cancer. Mind you, if you were dying from cancer but catch COVID19, they will count you as a virus death rather than the cancer that was going to get you anyway.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

I am starting to think shutting down the economy and locking everyone down is a really bad idea.

This thing is only slightly more deadly than the flu if you are under 50. The elderly and health compromised should be self isolated and assisted but shutting down the country for a virus that is around 0.2% fatal (under 50's) (the flu is around 0.1) is really dumb and going to cause far more damage. Watch what happens to the suicide rate rate, bankruptcy's the destruction of small business some of which are never coming back this has become a huge over reaction. I also think the longer this goes the greater chance of social instability which is a real risk here the longer and harder the government locks the population down the greater the chance of problems.

[Guest Machtuk]

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

I am starting to think shutting down the economy and locking everyone down is a really bad idea.

This thing is only slightly more deadly than the flu if you are under 50. The elderly and health compromised should be self isolated and assisted but shutting down the country for a virus that is around 0.2% fatal (under 50's) (the flu is around 0.1) is really dumb and going to cause far more damage. Watch what happens to the suicide rate rate, bankruptcy's the destruction of small business some of which are never coming back this has become a huge over reaction. I also think the longer this goes the greater chance of social instability which is a real risk here the longer and harder the government locks the population down the greater the chance of problems.

 

I tend to agree, the cure will be far worse and long lasting than the disease! The world's economy is just as venerable as its inhabitants!

Hysteria has become the real issue!