Watercooled Jabiru 2200

[skippydiesel]

I guess the correct answers will not be forthcoming any time soon

[kgwilson]

Hypoxia can sneak up on you and it all depends upon the individual, fitness level, age, frequency and other factors. A friend of mine took off in his hang glider in the White Mountains, part of the Sierra Nevadas at 8000 feet back in the 80s. He had an oxygen supply but the cylinder was empty. After gaining about 10,000 feet in the wave he started to worry about things and began to recount all of the symptoms of hypoxia like Euphoria, Yawning, task impairment but couldn't remember others. He decided to go back down & land & then it finally occurred to him one of the symptoms was Memory Loss.

[Old Koreelah]

... WIKI probably has it right. Nev

...and if it doesn't, you can correct it.

[Old Koreelah]

Wow the fw 190 was good. There is a story about how the pommy minister for munitions wept when he saw the fw 190 performance figures since he knew that they were much cheaper ( about 1/3 i think ) than the spitfire.

I always liked the FW-190, mostly because it was the only German aircraft with graceful lines.

I finally got to take some closeup pix of one at Scone a few years ago.

I believe a major advantage was that it's clever design required far less maintenance than the Spitfire.

[skippydiesel]

Skippy, people have climbed mount everest (25,000 ft ) without oxygen.

At the start of ww2, they were ferrying GI's to Europe at 14,000 ft. They had lots of smokers in those days.

Anyway, some got into difficulties after hours at 14,000 ft so the Americans lowered the legal height without oxygen to 12,000 ft.

Of course here in Australia, like embarrassing yokels, we have gone for 10,000 ft.

On a good gliding day, 15,000 ft agl is not unusual in Australia. In Alice Springs, ( gliding strip is 2,400 asl ) this means over 17,000 ft.

Personally, I used oxygen up there in an attempt to stay smarter.

Wasn't about people so much as the effect of altitude on aircraft (IC) engines cooling systems - read Nevs comments regarding 30,000 ft etc - I was asking about the relevance of this in practical Civilian (ie not exotic military aircraft/sorties) aircraft terms - no answer at this tage.

[facthunter]

Skippy perhaps if you question was more clear I could answer it more to your satisfaction. I do do my best. Nev

[facthunter]

Due to an incoming phone calI, I've just lost a lengthy elaboration and an incomplete bit I cancelled out early has appeared. Please Ignore it. I've wasted a good 1/2 hour and a few brain cells I didn't have to spare .Nev

[skippydiesel]

Due to an incoming phone calI, I've just lost a lengthy elaboration and an incomplete bit I cancelled out early has appeared. Please Ignore it. I've wasted a good 1/2 hour and a few brain cells I didn't have to spare .Nev

 

I know exactly how you feel

[facthunter]

It takes a bit of extra resolve to try ALL over again. Mostly I NEVER get back to it when so much goes into the one lost. Nev.

[Bruce Tuncks]

Kg, the White mountains arise from a high valley and a 10,000 ft climb would easily put you over 15,000 ft. I have been there at 19,000 above sea level (with an oxygen supply ) and yes you can feel drowsy if you turn the oxygen off.

The ridge top is about 12,000 ft and so 15,000 ft clouds are only 3,000 ft above the ridge top.

Sorry I cant tell you more about the aircraft since all my high altitude stuff has been in gliders. I have heard that a Jabiru can climb to 14,500 ft before the engine runs out of puff. ( this must have been a VH Jabiru ) You would need a supercharger to go higher I guess.

Our low wing loadings would enable the aircraft to go real high then. All conjecture of course.

[onetrack]

You don't lose anything you've written in the message box with this forum programme, unless you purposely delete it. Whatever you write up is automatically saved, even if you click off the page.

You only have to go back to the thread, and insert your cursor in the message box, and all that you typed, re-appears.

[pmccarthy]

I have been on the High desert in Chile, which from memory was 12000 ft, for work. It slowed me down and gave me headaches but was ok.

[Bruce Tuncks]

There is a town in Peru over 16,000 ft. Wow.

[skippydiesel]

Mosquitoes with the right superchargers went above 30,000 ft for Photo reconnaissance trips. The "Consolidated Liberator was a high flyer(P&W R1830's with turbochargers). plane itself unpressurised. Pressurisation will not include anything to do with the engines or some cargo lockers. It's mainly cabin area and in some big Russian freighter Jets only the cockpit. area is pressurised. .Ignition systems have to be pressurised Coils on each cylinder and low tension magnetos to prevent electrical leakage of high voltage current. Your OAT at those levels can be about minus 45 degrees C or lower..

Most pressurised Piston aircraft have multi speed superchargers. You manually change the gears on the way up (and down).

Oxygen is required to be available at FL100 here and FL120 in some other countries .This covers the failure and unpressurised situation. The oxymask usually mixes the oxygen with some air but you can select 100%. which is not considered too good for you if you do it for long periods.. Nev

 

Hi Nev,

 

My question related to civilian piston powered aircraft and usual/normal flight levels for these aircraft.

 

In relation to my aside regarding aircraft normal flight levels - I happened to mention the need for Oxygen as a limiting factor - I understand (no experience);

• Oxygen, delivered via nasal cannula (low pressure) is what most pilots will use below 18,000 ft.
  
• Above this, the bodies ability to absorb the O2 is much reduced, so pressurised delivery via mask is require, so that the O2 will enter the blood stream in sufficient concentration to maintain normal brain function
  
• Higher ( but not sure how high ) there is a need for a pressure suit & helmet for normal brain/body function to continue.
  
• The alternative is cabin pressurisation to an artificial 8-10,00 ft (or there about)