Mooney loses cargo hatch mid-flight • UK video

[Garfly]

[Flightrite]

 

Oh I wonder what the beeping sound is the driver was thinking as he suddenly realises he was about to join the gear up club!? Talk about a space shuttle arrival! Just goes to show the panic that set in and he near forgot to fly the plane!

[Downunder]

There was another video of several engine failures and forced landings.

To me they all seemed to just "plough it in", with little reguard to actually airspeed or any landing technique so ultimately it turned into a crash....

[Thruster88]

The baggage door could be seen on the tail by the pilot, not sure why the sudden need for a steep turn while keeping the airspeed high. The row of portaloo's at the end finished the video nicely.

[Flightrite]

There was another video of several engine failures and forced landings.

To me they all seemed to just "plough it in", with little reguard to actually airspeed or any landing technique so ultimately it turned into a crash....

Too true! There's a great YT vid of two guys coming in to land in a TB20 with the gear warning nown blaring away the whole time, they touched down gear up and looked at each other dumbfounded!

[facthunter]

Wouldn't like to see how they would handle a REAL emergency, when they turn"something nothing " into one. Good Old Mooney highspeed bouncing kangaroo landing. At least he didn't shove the nose down.. AarrghH. No extra comment. Nev

[Flightrite]

Wouldn't like to see how they would handle a REAL emergency, when they turn"something nothing " into one. Good Old Mooney highspeed bouncing kangaroo landing. At least he didn't shove the nose down.. AarrghH. No extra comment. Nev

 

A long time ago I witnessed a 'hot' arrival of a Mooney in to a grass strip, it was full of local newspapers country NSW. Guy lands down wind Space Shuttle App & promptly runs thru a fence at the end of the strip, he said his engine showed no oil pressure whilst in the circuit yet no mother indications to warrant a crash!?

[facthunter]

These days they probably look for the PAUSE. button. when it's really "GAME OVER". as far as situational awareness is concerned.. When all else fails, PANIC. Nev

[Garfly]

Wouldn't like to see how they would handle a REAL emergency, when they turn"something nothing " into one. Good Old Mooney highspeed bouncing kangaroo landing. At least he didn't shove the nose down.. AarrghH. No extra comment. Nev

 

Nev, I'd have thought that seeing (and feeling) a door wrapped around your tail-feathers (with the extent of the damage unknown) would be attention-grabbing of the emergency kind. Wouldn't you say?

And I wonder if the fast landing might have had something to do with the limited elevator travel available.

[Flightrite]

Nev, I'd have thought that seeing (and feeling) a door wrapped around your tail-feathers (with the extent of the damage unknown) would be attention-grabbing of the emergency kind. Wouldn't you say?

And I wonder if the fast landing might have had something to do with the limited elevator travel available.

 

Doubt that anything to do with a control problem, the guy didn't show any control handling checks which most well trained drivers would have, he just panicked. The fast landing I'd due the gear was still up till the last minute and the guy was panicking!

[facthunter]

When you suspect structural problems you use slow flight. If you think you may have limited travel (control authority) you go upstairs (safe height)and do a slow flight routine to prove the planes lower speed capability/handling so you can have more confidence in doing a normal landing.. I think the entire tail including rudder moves on a Mooney. They didn't spend much effort even looking out the back.. Coming in at warp speed for a slightly controlled crash they had a bit of luck in surviving, was totally unnecessary. Nev

[Garfly]

As it happens, I have a particular interest in this incident because it puts me in mind of a war-story told by my late father.

 

He was aboard an American C47/DC3 helping to push supplies out to the troops re-taking Kokoda in November '42 when they managed to nudge the rear-cargo door into the slipstream (the forward door having been left behind, this other one was 'secured' by ropes).

 

In a flash, of course, it was off and gaily decorating the port horizontal stabiliser.

 

Dad was actually serving in an RAAF airfield construction squadron at Wards 'drome, but for extra adventure he liked to volunteer on the biscuit bombers.

 

He had a camera with him that day (contrary to regs, I believe) and took these snaps.

 

 

 

This is the aircraft (named 'Irene') after it managed to land safely back at Moresby.

(Otherwise, you surely wouldn't be reading this. My siblings and I owe it all to the structural integrity of the Gooney bird ;-)

The errant door can be seen lying on the ground in front of the tailplane. It'd only fallen off during the landing roll.

 

 

As it happens the pilot of that aircraft, Ernie Ford, many decades on, wrote a book about his war called "My New Guinea Diary"

 

 

 

For anyone interested, the tale above, is told over the following 4 pages:

 

(I notice that dad, who actually wrote up the incident in his own diary, has corrected the date as written in the book.)

 

 

 

 

[Garfly]

Meanwhile, back at the Mooney bird:

 

 

[Flightrite]

The guy ruined the flight/video, I was sitting on the edge of my seat listening to the beeping waiting!?

[facthunter]

A Good story. Those doors are very substantial as is the whole DC3- C47? Douglas made the best airframes in the world at that stage..Nev

[Jase T]

How to turn a nasty situation into a very nasty situation very very quickly.... Note the first thing he did was make a mayday call!!!! I am guessing (hoping) a fairly low time guy. No PAX brief at all... That many bounces in a Moonie there will be prop and engine damage for sure. They really don't like to bounce...

 

I can recall a similar situation. On my CPL flight test in 1990 with a well known and rather grumpy testing officer, flying a 177RG the first leg was GC to Tenterfield (TFD) where we did a short field landing and a soft field takeoff. Airborne gear up, the baggage door popped open and began fluttering in the breeze. Back around for a CCT and a landing. Shut down and receive a dressing down from the testing officer who went on to explain how you MUST lock the baggage door in a 177 or they will come open,, how its lucky nothing flew out etc etc etc. I was 100% certain I have locked it as I knew that aircraft (VH-CVG) well and new about its door issues. He gave me a demo on how to shut and lock it and thinking I had probably failed the flight test we took off for the next leg anyway. Airborne, gear up, POP baggage door comes open and is flapping in the breeze. I am thinking to myself see I told you I locked it, now it opened on you, there may be a chance for the test yet... Downwind for another landing.. gear down.. winding noise, no gear down light, in transit light stays on... Gear leg visible my side, gear leg visible, his side, think I can see the nose gear in the teeeny little mirror. I was allowed to keep flying and work through the issues. Keep it under 90KIAS for the door's sake, manual gear extension for real. No change to the situation. We discussed the situation. Don't want to land on the dirt at TFD with dodgy gear, don't want to fly all the way back to CG (nearest with services) with open baggage door. Decided the baggage door was a bigger issue so declared a pan pan pan and flew the approach at TFD. Surprisingly I was allowed to fly the approach, but had help with the "Hold the nose gear off as long as possible". We kept the engine running and don't try to shut it down. flying the ACFT over saving the engine... Touch down went well, gear stayed put, we rolled out and turned left off the runway. stopped clear of the strip and shut down. Called the operating base for help. they send out a PA-34 with a LAME and help. Turns out an over-center bolt in the nose gear had sheered and the gear was being held up by weight on it alone!!! LAME fixed it (I don't want to know how) temporarily and the cargo door was fixed with 100MPH tape... We flew back to CG with the gear down and RTB.... The PA-34 blew a starter motor on startup and was stuck there for 3 days!!! I passed the check ride but had to go out the next day in a PA-28 to do a low level leg to prove I could NAV at 500' to pass the flight....

[facthunter]

The sort of thing that can happen. A lot of those 'catches" are junk and people used to say things happen in 3's. . That's flying. You have to be ready for anything and react to it logically. You can scream your "bits" off over the radio but no Tower ever crashed and no ones coming up there to help you. IF you don't fly it properly. Nev

[Flightrite]

How to turn a nasty situation into a very nasty situation very very quickly.... Note the first thing he did was make a mayday call!!!! I am guessing (hoping) a fairly low time guy. No PAX brief at all... That many bounces in a Moonie there will be prop and engine damage for sure. They really don't like to bounce...

 

I can recall a similar situation. On my CPL flight test in 1990 with a well known and rather grumpy testing officer, flying a 177RG the first leg was GC to Tenterfield (TFD) where we did a short field landing and a soft field takeoff. Airborne gear up, the baggage door popped open and began fluttering in the breeze. Back around for a CCT and a landing. Shut down and receive a dressing down from the testing officer who went on to explain how you MUST lock the baggage door in a 177 or they will come open,, how its lucky nothing flew out etc etc etc. I was 100% certain I have locked it as I knew that aircraft (VH-CVG) well and new about its door issues. He gave me a demo on how to shut and lock it and thinking I had probably failed the flight test we took off for the next leg anyway. Airborne, gear up, POP baggage door comes open and is flapping in the breeze. I am thinking to myself see I told you I locked it, now it opened on you, there may be a chance for the test yet... Downwind for another landing.. gear down.. winding noise, no gear down light, in transit light stays on... Gear leg visible my side, gear leg visible, his side, think I can see the nose gear in the teeeny little mirror. I was allowed to keep flying and work through the issues. Keep it under 90KIAS for the door's sake, manual gear extension for real. No change to the situation. We discussed the situation. Don't want to land on the dirt at TFD with dodgy gear, don't want to fly all the way back to CG (nearest with services) with open baggage door. Decided the baggage door was a bigger issue so declared a pan pan pan and flew the approach at TFD. Surprisingly I was allowed to fly the approach, but had help with the "Hold the nose gear off as long as possible". We kept the engine running and don't try to shut it down. flying the ACFT over saving the engine... Touch down went well, gear stayed put, we rolled out and turned left off the runway. stopped clear of the strip and shut down. Called the operating base for help. they send out a PA-34 with a LAME and help. Turns out an over-center bolt in the nose gear had sheered and the gear was being held up by weight on it alone!!! LAME fixed it (I don't want to know how) temporarily and the cargo door was fixed with 100MPH tape... We flew back to CG with the gear down and RTB.... The PA-34 blew a starter motor on startup and was stuck there for 3 days!!! I passed the check ride but had to go out the next day in a PA-28 to do a low level leg to prove I could NAV at 500' to pass the flight....

 

A good read?

Fly long enuf and something like that happens.

 

Airborne 10 POB in a PA31 just on rotation the lower half of the cabin door dropped down/open. I did the usual response, fly the plane, advise ATC then do a control check, all good. BUT there was a disturbing issue not mechanical related but the female pax sitting opposite the now open door was screaming louder than the two Lyc's!? Door fixed, took off again to complete the charter with 4 POB, 3 brave Pax?

Edited July 11, 2020 by Flightrite

[Garfly]

The incident is well described and discussed on this forum:

 

https://mooneyspace.com/topic/34477-emergency-landing-baggage-door-blow-off-mid-flight-model-k/?

 

including this post by the pilot himself.

 

RedSkyFlyer

 

Posted May 31

Door was latched not locked outside. Gave everything a good tap & tug in preflight and checked over my shoulder at the inside latch on power checks , all ops normal. The AC only came back from annual ARC yesterday which is playing on my mind.

With the debris on the wing and the new hole in the fuselage I could feel the extra drag (you can see me fighting the yoke with two hands in the video) the AC wanted to roll right and pitch nose down, it was a challenge to keep her level, the trim definitely helped. I tried to keep the air speed above 100kts all the way round until final putting out the gear and last notch of flaps at the last second 10ft above the ground.

[Geoff_H]

When I got my Mooney I was told to ensure that the rear baggage door was latched and locked. Apparently a latched door had come open the door went through the tail control was lost and a serious accident ensued. I always was careful to lock mine before flight.

I had the cabin door open in flight several times. I replaced the door seal with a generic seal. Wrong move. Bought a Mooney one and had no more door opening in flight.

[Garfly]

This is the story as told in the current (UK) FLYER magazine:

 

[facthunter]

I doubt control malfunctions are treated in any depth in general GA flying at PPL level these days and probably never were.. Assymetrical situations can occur with flaps easily or any control damage or malfunction. If this happens out of the blue and you've never had any training you are dropped in at the deep end. and have to do the best with what you have in your skills and knowledgebase. Whilst no one can predict the outcome of every situation. There are a few basics that apply in general. which I covered in my reply. Doors and hatches coming open happen too often. and sometimes the noise and buffeting is a major distraction when the plane will generally still fly controllably.. IF your elevator is Jammed the trim tab will work in the wrong sense as a small elevator, but it won't have much authority.. TWO things stand out .. Maintain control.. (You are dead if you don't )and reduce the likelihood of further damage from excess speed Any reconfiguring gear, flaps, power off, try at height where if it's no good you, re establish the original situation. You are the TEST pilot of an entirely NEW challenge. You try to be fast to have control but without/or with reduced elevators a Mooney is a Beast with the U/C it has. when fast on rough stuff. Nev

[Geoff_H]

The Mooney does not have an altitude trim on the tail. Vertical trim is achieved by tilting the tail come tilts about a pivot just behind the baggage compartment.

[Flightrite]

I actually don't believe half this guys story! He was damned lucky he didn't kill everyone, the door was the least if his issues!

[facthunter]

Geoff, I mentioned that for the Mooney " specifically" in my ORIGINAL comments. Please stick to PITCH, ROLL and YAW in this. The only reference to the Mooney in my last post above was in regard to the undercarriage behaviour on rough ground when you are fast. The last thing needed is confusion in these matters.. Nev

Edited July 17, 2020 by facthunter