aro Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 I haven’t seen this on the Vic Health web page. Make sure that your mask does not have holes or a valve. This can result in breathing out the virus if you have coronavirus (COVID-19). https://www.dhhs.vic.gov.au/face-masks-victoria-covid-19
Flightrite Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Another quiet day on the R/T today, I could get used to this? 1
tillmanr Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Thanks Aro, I found it within cloth masks. As I was not looking at cloth masks as a retail source I did not read this section. I doubt that many domestic mask makers would incorporate a valve.
Bruce Tuncks Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 The trouble with police and discretion is that too much might depend on just who was on duty. What about the guy who did over the border contracts and who couldn't find out before quoting if his blokes would need quarantine on return or not, because this was at the discretion of the police on duty on the day.
M61A1 Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 I find police cannot be trusted with discretion unnecessary and somewhat offensive. Particularly during this pandemic they have proven it time and time again. What may have been in the past is no longer and it been quite some time since there was some sensibility. Campbell Newman's VLAD laws saw QLD police using the laws to harass ordinary citizens on motorcycles. The many fines that were handed out in regards to CV19 and then overturned also shows us clearly that to rely on police discretion to enforce the spirit of the law rather than the letter the law would be most unwise. If that offends you, so be it. Cops are not what they used to be. 2 1
kgwilson Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 The whole issue surrounding masks has been debated since the beginning of this Pandemic. Health officials have said all along until very recently that if you are feeling well the wearing of a mask would not help but if you were not feeling too good you may have Covid-19 and wearing a mask would help by trapping most of the moisture therefore you would be less likely to spread the virus that way. The Chinese have always contradicited this theory and way back in January everyone was wearing masks there even their President and all other poilticians. I remember Bex (Where is he?) commenting on this a number of times. Well China has had a pretty good success rate with Covid-19 & has dealt with outbreaks with efficiency and effectiveness. Of course their society is much more attuned to discipline and order than ours. In the last few weeks we now find that the virus can be spread as an aerosol where droplets are not present. Masks are not the be all and end all, they are just one of the measures to assist in the reductuion of the spread. When people flout the isolatiuon rules and there are cock ups made in security and a myriad of other mistakes it is no surprise that we are where we are at with over 500 new cases today. At least the decision makers all sing from the same song sheet (more or less) unlike the US which has proven that the worlds largest economy can be brought down by the failure of their own systems where idiots rule and the population suffers. Nearly 145,000 deaths to date in only 5 months. They lost 416,800 in WW2 & that was over 2 1/2 years. 1
turboplanner Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 I find police cannot be trusted with discretion unnecessary and somewhat offensive. Unfortunately that's not the first comment and it typical of what drags this site down and turns people away. In the pandemic the police and our defence troops have been standing in the front line and patiently advising people on what is safe. For their trouble they have been abused, called "jacks" etc, have had to stand out in the winter weather getting what food and drink they can, finding what toilet facilities they can, and running the risk of becomeing infected and taking the disease home to their loved ones. As a result of one Melbourne woman leaving lockdown in Melbourne and travelling across to the town of Orbost, and while infected, visting several shops there is now a cluster in Orbost which includes the local police officer. Country people will know what it means to lose your local cop at a time like this. During the Stage 4 lock down of the nine Melbourne towers, police had to man the perimeters and put up with abuse from all sorts of people including those "poor" people who had children in the Covid-linked and expensive Al-Taqua school in the northern suburbs. They had to bring in mesh fencing to lock these residents in after continuous escapes by potentially infected people. Even after this two Sudanese climbed over the fencing and made a run for it and had to be run down and caught by multiple police. In spite of this their efforts were rewarded by a reasonably fast all-clear from most of the towers after infected people were transferred. On the other hand the most heart warming story was about a little old lady with a 14 year old blind dog who wasn't allowed out to walk it each night to do its business. The video shows the cops picking it up each night and walking it for her. 1
turboplanner Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Channel 9 News has just claimed Victoria as a disaster. That's not exactly what the President of the AMA who has been sticking his oar in with his opinions over the last couple of days said, but if people are worried about this, there is a big increase in numbers of cases in one industry sector and inevitably because of percentages there will be a big increase in deaths "in Victoria." What has actually happened is an explosion of infections in Aged care facilities, alleged to be due to the financial model of only employing nursing staff for a few hours each day, which resulted in nurses working for multiple nursing homes each day. So where a nurse became infected they didn't spread it in one nursing home, they spread it in three or four, hence the numbers. At the same time there are allegations that staff were not given PPE, and one allegation that kitchen staff were not made to wear PPE because they were "not in contact with the patients." It's too late to help the infected patients now, but relatively easy to prevent the same thing happening again. 1
Jerry_Atrick Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 I had a large response to the police thing... but better judgement kicked in. In summary, my experience of the Victorian Police (last in about 1999 - and only traffic related) was that they are defintiely adverarial (us v them) to start with, but once you establish yourself as respectful to them and don't try and BS them, they show discretion. Hey, I even managed to avoid a fine from the notorious Traffic Operations Group back in the early 90s for doing 80 in a 60 zone coming out of a country town between the last house and the 80 sign. I find the police in the UK (again, only for traffic offences) don't exhibit the adversarial trait - based mainly on the fact that when doing over 90 on motorways and being caught red-handed, they haven't even bothered coming after me (and no fine or summons in the post). In fact, once, when I slowed down, the motorcycle policeman waved me on to speed up (and of course, I would not disobey the police). In the case of COVID-19, like an umpire of an AFL game, the rules allow a lot of lattitude when making a decision. Unlike an AFL game, they have to balance personal liberties against the wider community safety, and it is a difficult call to make. Some will err on the side of caution; some will err on the side of personal liberties and some will get it right. Unfortunatley, some will be posterior holes (as there are in all forms of life). Thankfully, the latter are in the minority - but the natire of being adverarial to start off with may be in response to community attitudes. Here is an ABC report on an outback policeman. Interesting watching: Back to topic.. I can't even get back to Melbourne to traverse a border
Flightrite Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Well it's mask day today in the leper colony, will be interesting to see how the cops treat people, no doubt won't be fair in many cases as there will be plenty of power trips from this day on!!
octave Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Well it's mask day today in the leper colony, will be interesting to see how the cops treat people, no doubt won't be fair in many cases as there will be plenty of power trips from this day on!! For me th bottom line is this - Hairstylists with COVID-19 didn't infect any of their 139 clients. Face masks may be why. We can be reasonably sure that this will have a positive effect on the infection rate. Obsessing about whether a cop is on a power trip or not is secondary to tackling the problem at hand. 1 2
Yenn Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 I hear today that Flu deaths are down from about 370 last year to 30 plus this year for the same time period. That is the good news. As far as the police go, they are doing a difficult job and no doubt can get pissed off by the way they are treated. In Qld they are way better now than they were in the eighties. 1 2 1
Jerry_Atrick Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Tomorrow in ol' Blighty, wearing face masks in shops becomes compulsory (they announced it two weeks ago; maybe COVID-SARS was predicted to be dormant until tomorrow?) However, for some reason, we can go to pubs and restaurants/cafes without wearing masks? Is alcohol an inhibitor they are not telling us about? Today, I get my first haircut since some time in January... Unfortunately, what hair I have doesn't grow long, it sprouts out the sides, so I look lik a half-bald, wrinkly and rotten broccoli floret... Will be wearing a mask (have to hold it to my face). Funniest thing I have seen, and it is quite common, are people wearing masks with their noses poking out of the top of it into the air... Sort of defeats the purpose...
M61A1 Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Unfortunately that's not the first comment and it typical of what drags this site down and turns people away. It appears I've been mistaken...For some reason I thought it was the accusatory, know it all, humourless, authoritarian and at times, outright wrong comments from some that drove people away. 3
Butch Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 We have a Covit checkpoint at the entrance to our town . 24/7 freezing cold and boring as Bat Shit , I feel for the Police and Army personnel that are doing their job. The shame of it all is that anyone with half a brain can divert around the roadblock by going around the block . I went through yesterday and just said I was a local on the way home from my farm and didn't have my license with me. The young policeman wasn't worried and let me through, not checks. Is anyone being issued with fines for Covid travel violations ? It doesn't look like it to me.
octave Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Is anyone being issued with fines for Covid travel violations ? It doesn't look like it to me. Victorians slugged more than $10 million in coronavirus fines
Flightrite Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 It appears I've been mistaken...For some reason I thought it was the accusatory, know it all, humourless, authoritarian and at times, outright wrong comments from some that drove people away. Love it!?
Butch Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Victorians slugged more than $10 million in coronavirus fines Not general fines , Travel violation fines. I think most people can talk their way out of a travel fine... there's a million excuses you can use ! (sick mum, feeding animals on holiday property , fictitious work, etc,etc.
turboplanner Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Not general fines , Travel violation fines. I think most people can talk their way out of a travel fine... there's a million excuses you can use ! (sick mum, feeding animals on holiday property , fictitious work, etc,etc. Depends where you are. Several cases have made the papers around Melbourne. Earlier this week a couple of women sneaked across the border from Connewirricoo 20 km into SA to play golf. The local cops went out to the Naracoorte Gold Club to check for Vic number plates and fined them each $1650.00
octave Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Not general fines , Travel violation fines. I think most people can talk their way out of a travel fine... there's a million excuses you can use ! (sick mum, feeding animals on holiday property , fictitious work, etc,etc. I suspect that most travel violations are turned back rather being fined although there have been several high profile fines. An internet search for covid travel violations reveal several.
old man emu Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 If people are allowed out and about to attend to their occupations, does that mean a street-walker can still work? 1
turboplanner Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 If people are allowed out and about to attend to their occupations, does that mean a street-walker can still work? No, that’s been announced.
turboplanner Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 1214 fines in the past fortnight. https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/one-in-five-fines-handed-to-those-caught-leaving-locked-down-zones-20200723-p55esa.html which includes these two: Torquay police Sergeant Stephen Bull said while most people they had checked had been doing the right thing, a 49-year-old Albert Park woman was fined $1652 and escorted from the area on Wednesday afternoon after she was caught shopping and dining in the town. "She’d taken public transport down here. She was sick of walking around her lockdown suburb, like what we saw with the woman from Brighton the other day," he said. A woman dubbed "Karen from Brighton" shot to social media fame last week after she told Nine News that she had gone to the Tan in Melbourne's CBD to exercise because she was "sick of walking the same streets". "You know, I've done all of Brighton," she said.
Flightrite Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Dopey Dan has gotta justify his actions somehow!? There will always be people who don't accept the tyranny being dished out, human nature!
turboplanner Posted July 23, 2020 Posted July 23, 2020 Dopey Dan has gotta justify his actions somehow!? There will always be people who don't accept the tyranny being dished out, human nature! I thought by now anyone who said they came from Melbourne would know these actions are specified by the CHO and Health Commander and the Premier manages the scenario he's given each day, and would know that's becaise we are in a declared state of emergency.
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