So have any of you Mexicans (Victorians)– smile people - made it across the border by air.

[Flightrite]

Fear & hysteria rules!?

[aro]

If you're not worried about this virus, you really haven't been paying attention to what is happening in the world.

[Butch]

I can't see how this is going to end without Herd Immunity.

 

There is no Immunization and probably won't be for years (there is nothing for SARS after years of trying).

 

It is like a bush fire in the middle of Summer....... there's no point in putting out 99% of the fire , then leaving 1% to keep burning because you have no way to put it out.

 

In a few days it will be back worse than ever........ this cycle will continue till the whole State is burnt!

[aro]

We are a long way from herd immunity - probably years before it will make a difference. Herd immunity means the number of cases declines because there are not enough vulnerable people to infect. Herd immunity by mass illness means that the decline in cases starts from a very high number, and will take a long time.

 

Peter Doherty won the Nobel Prize in immunology, and is optimistic that we will have a vaccine within 6-12 months. There are currently well over 100 candidates under development. If Peter Doherty is optimistic, that is enough for me to be optimistic.

 

Also, treatments are improving as we learn more about the effect of the disease.

 

It seems likely that medicine will provide solutions in the medium term. In the meantime, we need to minimise the number of people who die, and the number of people who end up with perhaps permanent disabilities.

[facthunter]

There are plenty of examples where it was done another way. There's no need to follow a proven failure technique. (like Sweden) . As we learn more It's a far more serious outcome for many who "Recover" which is not really what happens in a lot of cases. You end up with permanent damage. Australia (so far) has done very well. By trying for political advantage and dividing the people with misinformation we will guarantee a much worse result. Victoria was bullied into opening up when it wasn't happy with doing so and warned of the extra cost of shutting down again.. Many are really hurting here who have done the right thing all the way through. It doesn't take much for a minority to undo all the good work, as we have just witnessed. Other areas are learning from what happened here. Outbreaks in other states won't necessarily ALL come from Victoria either. Nev

[onetrack]

There is no guarantee that herd immunity results from letting COVID-19 spread on a widespread scale. There are repeated reports of people catching COVID-19 again - as little as 3 mths later.

It's not known if this is because they never fully recovered, or if they caught a new strain of it (and there is apparently more than one strain of COVID-19).

This virus is the nastiest thing to infect the Earths population in the last 100 years, and it's highly likely people who catch it, end up with mutated genes, and all the associated problems that brings.

[Neil_S]

Jokes aside, can anyone point me to any guidance material regarding what specific limitations currently exist for a Melbourne based flyer. The 'four reasons to leave home' rule is probably the biggest hurdle, although based on other allowable recreational activities, it is not exactly clear. I'm guessing that a recreational flight that takes you beyond the metropolitan lockdown zone is not acceptable.

Any thoughts, preferably backed by government guidance material or specific rules are welcome...

 

Hi,

 

Go to :-

 

www.dhhs.vic.gov.au

 

..and search for Restrictions for those in Melbourne/Mitchell Shire. You will eventually get to a page detailing the rules for golf, surfing, fishing and boating. No explicit mention of planes, of course. However, it says you can do those activities provided you keep socially-distanced (eg 2 people playing golf must remain 1.5m apart and others should be about 100m away) and they must be done within the lockdown area. It says not to travel a long distance if they can be done close to where you live, but if your boat is moored 50kms away at the coast then obviously you will need to travel there to sail it. By implication the same must apply to your airplane - so you can travel to where the plane is hangared provided it is within the lockdown zone. No landing outside the lockdown area, of course.

I think they realized from the last time that as these sorts of activities are outside, and easily done solo, or many metres apart from others, the risk is tiny, and the benefit is huge for mental health.

 

I have this page bookmarked on my phone, so if an over-zealous cop questions it I can show them.

 

HTH,

Neil

[Flightrite]

Hi,

 

Go to :-

 

www.dhhs.vic.gov.au

 

..and search for Restrictions for those in Melbourne/Mitchell Shire. You will eventually get to a page detailing the rules for golf, surfing, fishing and boating. No explicit mention of planes, of course. However, it says you can do those activities provided you keep socially-distanced (eg 2 people playing golf must remain 1.5m apart and others should be about 100m away) and they must be done within the lockdown area. It says not to travel a long distance if they can be done close to where you live, but if your boat is moored 50kms away at the coast then obviously you will need to travel there to sail it. By implication the same must apply to your airplane - so you can travel to where the plane is hangared provided it is within the lockdown zone. No landing outside the lockdown area, of course.

I think they realized from the last time that as these sorts of activities are outside, and easily done solo, or many metres apart from others, the risk is tiny, and the benefit is huge for mental health.

 

I have this page bookmarked on my phone, so if an over-zealous cop questions it I can show them.

 

HTH,

Neil

 

That's why I flew last time and this time? It's a choice, you either live in fear or you get on with life!?

[Mriya]

It couldn’t be clearer, so let’s cut the BS

From the range of responses so far, it seems to be decidedly unclear. You can go fishing, you can play golf, you can go for a drive. These common activities have all been approved under the latest lockdown. This isn't about pushing boundaries (although it is clear that some do), but rather understanding how the rules should be applied to recreational flying in a considered and conservative manner.

I think most people would agree that a private aircraft owner who goes for a local flight on their own or with someone else from their household and applies appropriate social distancing is not creating a risk of spreading COVID-19.

As one working in the GA industry, I look forward to a return to the freedoms that we normally enjoy. I am frustrated by the return to lockdown, particularly in light of the reported reasons for this outbreak. I agree that the lock-down is needed at this time and that everyone must play their part to stop the spread of the virus. However in the absence of a clear rule applying to recreational aviation, and given the range of recreational pursuits, including going for a drive just because you can, some people have arrived at the reasonable assumption that a recreational flight is broadly equivalent to other allowable activities.

[facthunter]

It's not that simple. When you have more knowledge about it and have kept the health system working you are in a better position to successfully tackle it.. There's no assurance whatever of any level of worthwhile and lasting immunity from contact with it existing. A Tribe that works together will survive one where each to his own prevails. That''s why we evolved a (supposedly) superior brain. and have kids we have to educate extensively for things to get where we have gotten to . The GOOD things..Nev

[KRviator]

Go to :-

 

www.dhhs.vic.gov.au

 

..and search for Restrictions for those in Melbourne/Mitchell Shire. You will eventually get to a page detailing the rules for golf, surfing, fishing and boating. No explicit mention of planes, of course. However, it says you can do those activities provided you keep socially-distanced (eg 2 people playing golf must remain 1.5m apart and others should be about 100m away) and they must be done within the lockdown area.

Aahh, Grasshopper, what their website says, and what their legislation says are not always the same. (Maybe it's the same webmaster CAsA use?!?) If you look at the legislation, you can go outside the area if what you want to do cannot be done inside the area, so long as it is a permitted activity. IF you lived in the CBD and your plane was hangared at Mangalore, you can drive there to fly it if you are practicing to obtain or upgrade your licence.

 

I have this page bookmarked on my phone, so if an over-zealous cop questions it I can show them.

Personally, I wouldn't bother. If I was in that situation and sure I was in the right, I'd simply suggest "If you're sure I'm in the wrong, write the fine and I'll see you in court". Arguing with a police officer is like arguing with your missus - you aren't going to win...

[facthunter]

TOO many assumed (hoped) we are back to NORMAL and RELAXED and did really stupid things. That's a pretty COSTLY mistake or worse. People will get very sick and a lot of businesses will go broke. THAT did NOT have to happen. but it's all over the world. It will be a long time before we see normal again what ever the discoveries etc are. IF we had a vaccine NOW lots would refuse it

To be represented at your DAY in Court will cost you about $, 8.000. and don't COUNT on winning, and don't count on any Justice, you will only get an interpretation of the LAW.. You have more chance of winning Tatts than recovering your costs..Nev

[turboplanner]

From the range of responses so far, it seems to be decidedly unclear.

This is a good example of what can happen with silly posts. There is always someone out there who will take them as fact-based, make a judgement and get hurt by it.

[aro]

Looking on the bright side, we know aircraft owners tend to be shall we say older, and higher risk...

If the outbreak really gets out of control 30-40% of aircraft owners are likely to die or lose their medicals. If you can stay healthy, there are likely to be some bargain aircraft around. ?

[facthunter]

There's very little in life more important than your Health. Without that, the REST doesn't count for much. Nev

[kgwilson]

The strategy here has always been containment and it almost worked until the latest ourbreak. If we manage to stifle that we will get back to a semi normal in 2 months. NZ went hard & fast with an eradication strategy & it worked but was almost undone by a couple of people returning to see their dying mother, who then died & they were let out of quarantine for compassionate reasons without being tested. When they did test positive it was only pure luck that everyone they met was tested & only a couple of relatives had been infected. This gave rise to a national witch hunt, military were posted at all quarantine hotels, quarantine breakers named, shamed & prosecuted finally resulting in the Health Minister falling on his sword.

 

The mistakes made in Melbourne were different in that no one knew they'd been made for 2 weeks & by then Covid had bolted. The new lockdown strategy will work providing we can get compliance & so we will be back to slow re-opening after 6 weeks until we are back to the ability to contain the virus once again.

 

The longer this goes on the harder it gets with tolerance levels dropping so it is important to turn up the heat. When 10,000 people refused a test the most common reason was that the whole thing is a hoax. If it was me I'd put all 10,000 in enforced quarantine & charge them for the pivilege.

 

Now we are restricting people returning from overseas because we are running out of quarantine hotels & money so they are now being charged to stay there. Good idea. They decided not to return 3 months ago & want to return now due to the worsening state offshore. OK come back now but wait in line and pay the exhorbitant cost. That's just the way it is.

 

If you want to go flying or any other activity just check the rules in detail and follow strict social distancing. There is no place for a "She'll be right" attitude.

[Butch]

Covid 19 hasn't come close to the impact of Malaria.

 

Maybe because Covid 19 affects all the Worlds population not mainly Third World Country's there's a mad panic.

 

There have never been any restrictions banning travel to infected Nations and nobody really cares !

 

"Over one million people die from malaria each year, mostly children under five years of age, with 90 per cent of malaria cases occurring in Sub-Saharan Africa. An estimated 300-600 million people suffer from malaria each year. More than 40 percent of the world’s population lives in malaria-risk areas"

Edited July 11, 2020 by Butch

[Yenn]

How many die each year from the usual flu that goes around, I know the figure is not high, but it is not negligible either, So far we are getting less flue cases, because of the social distancing.

The USA is the worst country in the world as far as cases per head of population go, except for places like Andorra and Vatican City, which have tiny populations. We don't have to look far to see why the USA is such a sad case. The health experts, State Governors and President are all pulling in different directions. The UK is not far different.

[440032]

I can see it coming to an AVMED questionnaire near you:

Q1. Have you ever been diagnosed with Corona Virus? YES/NO/UNSURE

Q2. Did you die from it? YES/NO/UNSURE

 

Quick question:

Does anyone, anywhere, personally know anyone, anywhere, who has it/had it? (not interested in my mate's auntie's gardener's next-door-neighbour's dentist's tax advisor might have had it)

 

Last time, many were asking CASA if they could go fly. This has nothing to do with CASA. It's not their lockdown. They can't let you fly, or stop you.

[Flightrite]

I can see it coming to an AVMED questionnaire near you:

Q1. Have you ever been diagnosed with Corona Virus? YES/NO/UNSURE

Q2. Did you die from it? YES/NO/UNSURE

 

Quick question:

Does anyone, anywhere, personally know anyone, anywhere, who has it/had it? (not interested in my mate's auntie's gardener's next-door-neighbour's dentist's tax advisor might have had it)

 

Last time, many were asking CASA if they could go fly. This has nothing to do with CASA. It's not their lockdown. They can't let you fly, or stop you.

 

I think my cat might have the virus should I shoot it like most others!??

[octave]

Covid 19 hasn't come close to the impact of Malaria.

 

Maybe because Covid 19 affects all the Worlds population not mainly Third World Country's there's a mad panic.

 

There have never been any restrictions banning travel to infected Nations and nobody really cares !

 

Sorry To be pedantic but Malaria is not a contagious disease, it is it does not spread between humans in the way covid or flu does. It can only be caught from a particular type of mosquito or blood transfusion/organ transplant etc.

[onetrack]

To compare Malaria to COVID-19 is like comparing apples to oranges, a Lamborghini to a Lear Jet, or an excavator to a boat.

 

This is what is wrong with America - faulty logic amongst their leadership (or more correctly, lack of leadership), and the resulting chaos and huge infection levels.

 

In the U.S. there's a total lack of understanding of how the COVID-19 virus operates, and the massive damage it can do, if no-one in authority takes positive and enforceable steps to stop its spread.

 

It's like saying termites are just harmless little critters that don't eat much, so you don't need to bother about them - while your timber house crumbles around you.

[M61A1]

To compare Malaria to COVID-19 is like comparing apples to oranges, a Lamborghini to a Lear Jet, or an excavator to a boat.

 

This is what is wrong with America - faulty logic amongst their leadership (or more correctly, lack of leadership), and the resulting chaos and huge infection levels.

 

In the U.S. there's a total lack of understanding of how the COVID-19 virus operates, and the massive damage it can do, if no-one in authority takes positive and enforceable steps to stop its spread.

 

It's like saying termites are just harmless little critters that don't eat much, so you don't need to bother about them - while your timber house crumbles around you.

I think the point is more about the response to the disease rather than the disease itself. Never before have we seen such a massive response to a disease that's killing relatively few people.

I doubt we will really know who had the best response for some time, and it's all rather pointless arguing over who did the right thing until it's all over.

While people are praising the Australian response, they can't keep this up forever, or even for much longer. Then what?

[Dreamtarduus]

Oh SSCBD yo must not jest. I tried to cross SA border and copped this.

[onetrack]

While people are praising the Australian response' date=' they can't keep this up forever, or even for much longer. Then what?[/quote']

 

Well, we could always try Swedens approach - take the hands-off approach, and let the virus run rampant.

 

But for just 10.1M population, they have 73,000 cases and 5,400 deaths, and I don't know how their health system continues to operate without collapsing.

 

In addition, there has been no quantifiable economic gain by letting the virus run rampant. The projections are that Swedens economy will shrink by 4.5% this financial year.

 

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/sweden-coronavirus-strategy-high-death-toll-no-economic-gain-data-2020-7