Aircraft Fabric Finishing

[Tigershark21]

Happy new year to all,

 

I'm currently exploring options for fabric finishing and paint systems. I haven't found anything in the forums on Stewart Systems.

 

So far, I am liking the idea of "Stewart Systems" products because of it's water based/waterborne products. Healthier and less harmful with easy clean up.

 

I'm interested to hear what wood & fabric builders have used with regards to fabric cover, glues, sealing and prime/paint finish on their aircraft and why. Pro's vs Cons?

 

I'm guessing that once people start with a certain system, they learn it, understand it and generally stick with what they know and get good at it! 

[skippydiesel]

Hi Tiger - I used the Stewart System to completely refurbish my Zephyr about 4 years ago. My experience is as follows:

 

• The limit of my prior experience - have tried my hand, not terribly successfully , at automotive spray painting (high pressure/low volume).
• Attracted to the Stewart System (SS) for the same reasons as you - much lower toxicity but also less paint drift (aerosol) and aircraft certified, whole system in one package ie fabric, adhesives, paints AND VERY IMPORTANTLY comprehensive do it yourself instructions /bible.
• The SS people are very helpful and there is a stack of "how to"  videos that you can view.
• DO NOT PURCHASE THE TOP COAT UNTIL YOU KNOW YOU ARE READT TO APPLY
• The only down side that I can recall, was there are very few if any, commercial spray painters in my area  (SW Sydney) who have experience with low pressure/high volume paint systems - so my original plan to have a professional automotive painter do the top coat/finish came to nothing & I did it myself - with a result that I am still proud to show off today.
• There is a bit of equipment that will need to be purchased/borrow/hired/steel, so that you can do the job according to THE BOOK
• I chose to build a temporary spray/work booth so that I could minimise dust/insects in, dust and spray drift out. The dimensions are those that will  accommodate the largest section of the aircraft PLUS room for me to move around (from doubtful memory 8 x 3 x 2 m was a bit on the squeezy side but worked) double doors at one end, one of which accommodate a cheap industrial pedestal fan pointing out (shown)and the other end had a large section of air conditioning filter material  (looking other way, blue material). As many preloved fluro lights as you can get hold off  and you may need a revers cycle window rattler.
• Should you be interested, have lots of photos 
• Probably much more I can add - contact me direct/private.

 

 

Edited January 2, 2021 by skippydiesel

[Tigershark21]

Hi Skippy,

 

Thanks for the info! 

I'll stick with Stewart System then and give it a go. 

Is the top coat a two part mix? ..Hence the three hour shelf life?

There I was the day I flew out at the Oaks when I was 16. 

[440032]

Perhaps others could post the details of which suppliers in Australia have which products. Do they have it or do they get it (eg from USA) for you.

I used Polyfiber in 2004, it all came from Aviaquip at Moorabbin, in stock, no getting messed around. Aviaquip long gone now of course.

 

I've seen an aircraft covered (recently) in ORATEX. Looked fantastic. Having covered an aircraft myself, I can say that with some confidence  that I know what I'm looking at.

http://www.wheelerswings.com.au/

 

My tip for anyone:

Do not let a spray painter anywhere near your project. Do it all yourself. (Unless you use Oratex of course!)

Spray painters (eg car painters) have no knowledge of our aviation products. Follow your covering instruction manual, you will be so pleased you did it all yourself.

[skippydiesel]

Tiger -

 

Great photo of you & Light Wing - unfortunately that aircraft is no longer at The Oaks

 

• SS is sold in Australia by Sky Shop however when I did mine the AU$ was almost at parity with the US $ so I purchased direct from SS. Great savings & fast service.
• Yes the top coat is a two part mix, still water born & thinned - Its shelf life is more like 6 months than 3 hrs - you may be confusing the post mix to application time with shelf life.
• Take the SS recommendation and do not purchase the top coat until you are going to apply it. There is a strong temptation to purchase all the SS materials at once, to save on delivery cost, DONT DO IT! If your project time line is anything like mine, I grossly underestimated just how long it wold take to do a good job and came dangerously close to exceeding the shelf life of my top coat.
• When it comes to the top coat application, think about how you will maintain at/above the recommended curing temperature (21+C?) for 24 hrs - I used an old window rattler and cheap digital thermomotors to set & record temps just below the sprayed part(s)
• If you follow the instructions exactly the resulting finish will be spectacular

 

Some better photos of spray/work booth  - I feel it was critical to my good result.

Note:

Plastic (builders plastic) cover include floor, which was slightly flooded for top coat spraying

Air conditioning material , blue panel, can be seen - this provided clean, dust /insect free air

Double doors one end to facilitate large component entry/exit - cheap industrial pedestal fan went in right side (see inner  frame) & used a home made stiff plastic duct & packing tape

All wood  re used for other home projects

[Tigershark21]

Nice set up! 

Luckily, the Fisher 404 is tiny. I'll have to build an enclosure like yours. The dust here is terrible. 

 

I'll leave the top coat purchase til the end then! 

 

I do love painting. I do a lot of airbrushing using waterborne automotive paints by Createx colours usually from airbrusmegastore.com however they are not for aircraft and not sure of their UV rating if any. I really do like the IWATA air brushes.

 

Did you use Superflite 101 Fabric with your plane or another fabric brand with Stewart chemicals?

 

Adam.

[Tigershark21]

6 hours ago, 440032 said:

Perhaps others could post the details of which suppliers in Australia have which products. Do they have it or do they get it (eg from USA) for you.

I used Polyfiber in 2004, it all came from Aviaquip at Moorabbin, in stock, no getting messed around. Aviaquip long gone now of course.

 

I've seen an aircraft covered (recently) in ORATEX. Looked fantastic. Having covered an aircraft myself, I can say that with some confidence  that I know what I'm looking at.

http://www.wheelerswings.com.au/

 

My tip for anyone:

Do not let a spray painter anywhere near your project. Do it all yourself. (Unless you use Oratex of course!)

Spray painters (eg car painters) have no knowledge of our aviation products. Follow your covering instruction manual, you will be so pleased you did it all yourself.

Oratex looks great. Probably lighter overall too. However I'd have work out the costs for the pre-coloured ORATEX vs standard fabric and paint. Even if the costs do work out even, ORATEX would be time saved in labour.

I'm just not sure about the limited colours. 

If I went with ORATEX, I'd probably go with a standard background colour but with painted highlights and pinstriping here and there. I'm assuming ORATEX paint is the same sheen as the fabric. I'll have to do more research on this. Thanks for the tip.

[skippydiesel]

15 minutes ago, Tigershark21 said:

Nice set up! 

Luckily, the Fisher 404 is tiny. I'll have to build an enclosure like yours. The dust here is terrible. 

 

I'll leave the top coat purchase til the end then! 

 

I do love painting. I do a lot of airbrushing using waterborne automotive paints by Createx colours usually from airbrusmegastore.com however they are not for aircraft and not sure of their UV rating if any. I really do like the IWATA air brushes.

 

Did you use Superflite 101 Fabric with your plane or another fabric brand with Stewart chemicals?

 

Adam.

Can't remember what brand of fabric I used (would be in my records somewhere). If I remember correctly, SS offers 3 "weights" of fabric - I went with the middle one (whatever that was) as recommended by SS, based on the expected performance of the aircraft.

 

The SS undercoat is an excellent UV protection not just for the fabric but also for my composite fuselage. The undercoat comes in a regular and a thick grade. You will use mostly the regular however the thick is good for "building up" so that you can sand back to a smooth surface .

 

The SS adhesive is mind boggling effective however as with the painting preparation is everything.

 

SS have quite a good colour range however as an ametaur, I stuck with one of the whites (Arctic?) and also used a matt black on the instrument panel.

 

• Refurbishment DONE!
• Gun modified with hydraulic fitting to facilitate painting under fuselage - I had no way of rotating the fuselage. Did come up with a rotating system for wings.
• Panel painted
• Panel in flight 

 

 

 

[440032]

1 hour ago, Tigershark21 said:

Oratex looks great. Probably lighter overall too. However I'd have work out the costs for the pre-coloured ORATEX vs standard fabric and paint. Even if the costs do work out even, ORATEX would be time saved in labour.

I'm just not sure about the limited colours. 

If I went with ORATEX, I'd probably go with a standard background colour but with painted highlights and pinstriping here and there. I'm assuming ORATEX paint is the same sheen as the fabric. I'll have to do more research on this. Thanks for the tip.

I would imagine Oratex might end up about the same cost as other systems but it would save hours and hours of work, amounting to weeks and weeks in real time. For my plane, just all the spraying alone, I was painting twice a day most days for about 8-10 weeks all up. Plus two gun and pots clean ups a day. It went on forever and stank/stunk the place out. Stinkier than Stinky, the stinky stink bug, stinking up a stink hole.

[Kenlsa]

Tigershark,

how is your covering going. Have you selected a system yet?

 

Ken

[skippydiesel]

I briefly "looked" at Oratex - cant remember all the details but in the end it just did not suit my aircraft. The Zephyr wing has a ply wood skin from spare - around leading edge and back to spare, see photo of underside right wing. The fabric is glued, shrunk/tightened over the rear /trailing side top & bottom - Oratex, without painting to match plywood skin would look just weird and would defeat the benefit of the product - no need to paint..

 

 

[Yenn]

I used Stitts system when I built the Corby 18 years ago. It is needing attention in places now. Slight cracking on the rudder and where I had a repair to the aft bottom of the fuse when the tail wheel spring support cracked and had to be replaced. I did the repair with Orotex over the existing Stitts finish.

My preference now would be to use Oratex for a couple of reasons.

Firstly it is easier to apply and doesn't involve nasty chemicals.

Secondly it would be easier to repair. With Stitts you have to use MEK, to remove any covering that has to be replaced, then you have the multiple layering of fabric and chemicals which cannot be bought in small quantities. I think the smallest quantity of any of the finishing chemicals was about a litre or quart. Far too much to do a small repair economically. Those chemicals cannot be transported by air, which make freight expensive.

[skippydiesel]

27 minutes ago, Yenn said:

I

My preference now would be to use Oratex for a couple of reasons.

Firstly it is easier to apply and doesn't involve nasty chemicals.

Secondly it would be easier to repair. With Stitts you have to use MEK, to remove any covering that has to be replaced, then you have the multiple layering of fabric and chemicals which cannot be bought in small quantities. I think the smallest quantity of any of the finishing chemicals was about a litre or quart. Far too much to do a small repair economically. Those chemicals cannot be transported by air, which make freight expensive.

 

I cant comment on Stitts or for that matter on Oratex however I think any reduction in the potential to be exposed (and the environment)  to harmful chemicals should be adopted (subject there being no reduction in performance/safety of the finished product).

 

I am very happy with the experience I had with The Stewart System and the resultant finish.

 

I would speculate that Oratex is possibly best used where the whole frame (wings, fuselage, control surfaces) is to be covered eg the fuselage & tail feathers of a Sonerai.

 

I do not think this system would be appropriate for the type of fabric coverage used in the ATEC Zephyr or similar aircraft.