GA landing at YSSY

[hdus001]

With the low traffic due to travel restrictions, just thinking this is a good time to do this checklist thing of landing/taking off at YSSY (From YSBK, in a VH registered 172). Has anyone had experience doing this? How do you go about planning a flight like this? What are the costs involved? Keen to hear your thoughts on this. If anyone can help us plan this (and perhaps come along as a safety pilot) I'm happy to pay for your time.

[Bennyboy320]

Go on YouTube & look at Stefan Drury’s videos, he’s landed his Cirrus at Darwin, Melbourne & Sydney, will answer all your questions. 

[old man emu]

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/sep/23/the-little-planes-that-could-sydney-airport-opens-up-to-hobby-pilots-during-pandemic

 

 

[kgwilson]

Something was posted here when the Pandemic was in full swing about this and the landing fee being somewhere North of $300.00.

[facthunter]

There may be frequent trips done on that route just taking small loads across . I did it an an Auster in the 60's with Keith Robey. Most twins are single pilot. You might get a Right seat and some tips going that way. It's a pretty short run as it is from Tullamarine to Essendon. Radio frequency changes are a bit of a blur. You just need to plan and be ahead of it. Normally the landing fee would make it fairly impractical. You may not be able to log it as flight time but can in other columns. Get in someone's way and you might get sent a large bill. 

 Prior to doing it you might benefit from some time visiting the Tower. I'm sure that can be arranged. Nev

Edited January 31, 2021 by facthunter

[Roscoe]

Ive done it. Happy to brief you on procedures, its not difficult!

PM me with your number if you wish.

Its great fun!

[old man emu]

Back in the Good Ol' Days, you had to go into Primary Airports as part of your Nav.

 

I suppose that traffic is so constant now that most of the slots are booked, so the irregular flights don't have a chance. 

[hdus001]

I advertised this planning task on airtasker and spoke to an instructor who bid on it. We are planning to do this flight this Sunday.

 

Here's comms from Airservices:

 

Quote

There is a temporary procedure in place for itinerant flights which are not regular/semi-regular operators at Sydney Airport. Flights which are conducting the approach and landing at Sydney for airwork/experience purposes, and which intend to depart immediately, are required to:

• Obtain slots from ACA
• Read and be familiar with AIP/ERSA FAC sections as relevant;
• File two flight plans: one for the arrival and another for the departure;
• Contact the Sydney Traffic Manager (02 9556 6853) prior to starting engines.

 

Additionally, please be advised that instrument requests and airwork are not available unless approved by the Sydney Traffic Manager and this will be assessed on the day. There is no guarantee that the airwork will be able to be facilitated. The flight will only be permitted to conduct a full stop landing, vacate, receive clearance and depart again (ie. no taxi-tours of the airport, touch and go, or missed approaches will be approved)

 

This procedure will remain in place until such time as traffic levels dictate that flights of this nature can no longer be facilitated, or until specified by Sydney Air Traffic Control.

 

[hdus001]

1 hour ago, Roscoe said:

Ive done it. Happy to brief you on procedures, its not difficult!

PM me with your number if you wish.

Its great fun!

Thanks Roscoe, will PM now.

[spacesailor]

HEY !,

Don,t forget us " non pilots ", 

Any spare seats would be WELCOME  ,.

Many thanks :: just in case.

spacesailor

Edited February 1, 2021 by spacesailor
Missed letter evenspellchecm got it wrong

[hdus001]

We did this flight into YSSY today.

 

Going into Sydney, the flight plan was YSBK->Parramatta->Pennant Hills->Hornsby->Long Reef->Harbour Bridge->YSSY,

and the return flight plan was YSSY->Long Reef->Hornsby->Prospect->YSBK

 

Took a bit a planning and coordination prior, to get a slot allocated, but the Sydney traffic Manager was very helpful and we spoke to him at length over the phone regarding what to expect, routes, procedures, frequencies etc couple of hours before the flight before submitting the 2 flight plans.

 

The flight itself was straightforward with them giving us instructions at appropriate times about what to do next. Before we reached the harbour bridge we were vectored into a base for 16R and then cleared visual approach to land. After landing they gave us detailed and friendly taxi instructions at every step. One thing I'd recommend is having two pilots, so one can work the radios, there's a lot of switching frequencies within a short timeframe - there's Sydney Terminal, Sydney Departures, Sydney Director, Sydney Tower, Sydney Ground, Sydney Delivery and then Sydney Departures again.

 

We were cleared to stop briefly at a holding point and change pilots (there were 3 of us in the plane) before being cleared to take off and depart to Long Reef.

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by hdus001

[old man emu]

 

[skippydiesel]

On 01/02/2021 at 4:51 PM, old man emu said:

Back in the Good Ol' Days, you had to go into Primary Airports as part of your Nav.

 

I suppose that traffic is so constant now that most of the slots are booked, so the irregular flights don't have a chance. 

For me it was Canberra - still a Primary but not as many movements as Bankstown

[kgwilson]

I did my PPL in NZ and did a Nav to Auckland international. I had a 747 behind me & I was in a C152. Minimum approach speed was 90 knots which was flat out for the 152. I flew it right on to the ground, flapless & only slowed in the flare which took quite a while. Touched down & rolled a short way & then off. ATC were very accommodating.

[old man emu]

Yep. Mine was into Canberra during a flight from Mudgee via Parkes. I don't know why we didn't go up to Tamworth. My mate was chasing a bit of skirt from Tamworth and he often flew from Dubbo to Tamworth for meetings with her.

[Roscoe]

Mine was also into Canberra as part of the final 5 hour Nav for the PPL.

In those days you had to demonstrate competancy in landing at a Primary Control Zone Airport.

After achieving the PPL, I did many flights into Sydney for the proverbial Cup of Coffee, no fees of course, and one memorable time they let me taxi my Cherokee to the Intl Terminal, escorted us up the Bridge, and let us wander around at will.

Then it was back to the Royal Aero Club at Bankstown where Gentlemen were required to wear ties after 6pm!

This was the early 70s.

What memories!!

 

[Yenn]

I went into Essenden, back when it was the International airport and Tullamarine was just a few slabs of concrete. Landed a Cessna in the width of the cross runway.

[facthunter]

Aw C'mon Yenn. Did you land with the brakes still parked? Nev

[facthunter]

Getting back to the original Bankstown To Kingsford Smith. Why the circuitous route?  We used to get a heading off a turn from the runway alignment and intercept final at KS from it. on rwy 16. .  Be lucky if the whole thing took longer than 8 minutes from lift off to touchdown.  Nev

[old man emu]

15 hours ago, facthunter said:

We used to get a heading off a turn from the runway alignment and intercept final at KS from it. on rwy 16

That was back in the Good Ol' Days when KS didn't have every daytime slot filled, and when you got back to Bankstown you ended up in the Royal Flying Club lounge for refreshments.

[facthunter]

The more territory you wander around in the more space you occupy which is less for others, at that time.  THEY just have to be ORGANISED. A SLOT can commence at take off and the shorter the leg, the less error. Nev

[old man emu]

I wonder how the landing fees at Bankstown and K-S in the 70s and 80s compare to what they might be today. hdus001 did not tell us how much the movement fees were for the whole trip.

[facthunter]

I Don't recall them being mentioned. Aerodromes were owned by the Commonwealth then. Now it's privatized and the user PAYS and Pays and pays. Australia needed little aeroplanes because it's a LARGE place with big distances to cover.. Now Pilots are regarded as potential criminals and the ones still flying just haven't been caught yet.. Nev

[hdus001]

16 hours ago, facthunter said:

Getting back to the original Bankstown To Kingsford Smith. Why the circuitous route?  We used to get a heading off a turn from the runway alignment and intercept final at KS from it. on rwy 16. .  Be lucky if the whole thing took longer than 8 minutes from lift off to touchdown.  Nev

We went this way as all of us onboard were very familiar with the route until HBB, having done Scenic One several times. Thought a direct flight would be too short and wont give us time to "settle" ourselves before getting into the thick of things. Coming back, in hindsight, we could've asked for DCT to YSBK.

[red750]

On 01/02/2021 at 4:51 PM, old man emu said:

Back in the Good Ol' Days, you had to go into Primary Airports as part of your Nav.

I remember flying into Essendon before Tulla was opened. 727's, DC9,s etc.

 

I never flew into Sydney, but I did take a Grumman AA5A Tiger with 3 colleagues from work from Bankstown to Hornsby, then Bondi, circled the Opera House, on to Canterbury race course and back to Bankstown.