Can you land a trike on the beach?

[Spoon]

Hello there,

 

I have recently been for my first 1hr flight in a microlight and absolutely loved it. The reason I thought about doing this is because I love to fish and a person I follow on YouTube has a trike and lands on remote beaches to fish. When I was talking to the pilot on my into flight he asked me how I thought about doing it and I told him about the guy who lands on the beaches to fish. He then proceeded to tell me that it’s illegal to land on any beach in Australia. I believe what he has told me but I’ve tried to find exact legislation that says this. In one of the videos I watched of the guy who flies his trike he lands on a beach and there he meets 5 other people who flew in. Four of them were light aircraft and one other trike. They were all meeting to have breakfast. 

I was reading an online article, “https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08-08/aviations-saving-grace-the-rise-of-bush-pilots/12483726” where the person being interviewed said,

"It's not uncommon for a group of us to go and fly to Crab Claw Island for breakfast," Ms Parker said and "The rules are that the pilot needs to make the decision about where and how they land, so it's always left to the pilot," he said. 
 

Ive tried to Google it and search for it in forums etc but can’t find the information. I just don’t understand if it’s illegal why are people posting it all over the internet and giving interviews to local papers etc? 
 

 

Im located in far North Queensland. I could understand if you were trying to land on a Gold Coast beach or similar. Talking about secluded and isolated beaches.

 

Looking forward to hearing from you.  
 

Regards

Nick

[spacesailor]

At Rainbow beach Queenslandd,

A trike group were doing trips for tourist.

I think it was legit as had to fill in that old libility waver card.

Off the sand and area roped off.

spacesailor

[Spoon]

Cheers, I also read that you can’t charge for flights unless you are instructing? 
Seems like you can make up your own rules? Lol

[onetrack]

Spoon - Read the 4 points under CAR 92, and read the full text of CAAP 92. Remember that beaches are used by people on foot, and in 4WD's, and numerous 4-wheel drivers enjoying finding, and driving on, "remote beaches".

 

As a pilot, your responsibility is to make 100% sure that a chosen "aircraft landing area" is safe - both for the aircraft and pilot, and for those on the ground - who more than likely, are not expecting an aircraft to land in their remote location.

 

Rules of the Air - https://vfrg.casa.gov.au/general/rules-of-the-air/aerodromes/

 

https://www.casa.gov.au/sites/default/files/_assets/main/download/caaps/ops/92_1.pdf?acsf_files_redirect

[Spoon]

Thanks onetrack,

 

It all seems so self regulated by the pilot, like the casa document written in 1992 with “guidelines” for landings. 
Is there an actual law that states that it’s illegal to land a trike on a deserted beach? And what are the punishments for breaching the specific law? Sorry I was a police officer for 22yrs and vague guidelines with no actual law and punishment to view is driving me crazy. (Already suffering from ptsd so that probably doesn’t help lol) 

 

It still seems so up to the interpretation of the pilot! 

[spacesailor]

Surly the rules of ' over flying the intended landing zone ' Will alert the resident fauna  ( animal the is ) that the SKY is falling.

BUT

it doesn't apply to Emergency landings I believe !.

IT IS illegal to land on the Highway. But it still happens.  

spacesailor

Edited May 8, 2021 by spacesailor
missed sentence

[onetrack]

Spoon, flying regulations outline that the permission of the landowner must be obtained before using that area of land as an ALA. Beach areas are owned and controlled by a range of owners - the Federal Govt, State Govts, individual Councils, and private landowners. So it pays to find out who owns the land you're intending to land on, or you could face regulatory action. However, there is no specific law that I know of, that prohibits landing on beaches, there is always the "emergency" excuse.

 

Then there's the issue of high and low water marks. In areas where the tidal zone is relatively level and the tides recedes a long way out, you are landing on the seabed when you land at low tide - because land title boundaries under Common Law, only extend to the high water mark.

But the seabed belongs to the Crown, and that includes anything below high water mark - so, technically, you would need the Crowns permission to land on the seabed!

Landing on beaches is definitely a grey area, and "pilot discretion" is advised. As I previously mentioned, the safety of people on the ground, and safety in the operation of the aircraft, must be the primary objectives in any planned beach landing.

[Spoon]

I really appreciate the discussion and it helps understand and interpret the legislation. I was going to mention the high water mark and every beach landing I’ve seen so far has been in between high and low and under the jurisdiction of the crown. Ultimately like you said safety is the primary concern and is the responsibility of the pilot. 
 

Well I still loved the hours “training” I did and think I’ll go back and do some more 🙂 

[turboplanner]

13 minutes ago, Spoon said:

I really appreciate the discussion and it helps understand and interpret the legislation. I was going to mention the high water mark and every beach landing I’ve seen so far has been in between high and low and under the jurisdiction of the crown. Ultimately like you said safety is the primary concern and is the responsibility of the pilot. 
 

Well I still loved the hours “training” I did and think I’ll go back and do some more 🙂 

Just working out who owns the land, while important, isn't the only restrictor.

When you've rolled down the camber and caught a wing in the sea, or a wheel has caught in soft sand, or what looked like a smooth dry surface is quicksand, you will need to explain how you met ALA requirements. You talk about loing the training in the past tense; air legislation is included in training for both certificate and licence, so I think you've missed some training there.

[facthunter]

Your "Kite" won't be worth much if you have much contact with sea water or spray. It's incredibly corrosion inducing. How successfully you "Read" the sand will dictate how lucky you are. The slope towards the water GETS some also. Aviation penalties or of "strict Liability" . Look up what that means in Legal Parlance.  Nev

[spacesailor]

Then why did some people do ,TIFF,S  on a beach? .

I personaly thought it was a great introduction to Triking. If l had time l would have taken a trip then & there !.

AND

Didn,t a group of trikes go around this island on the beaches, On tv. And made the news !.

I didn,t hear of any convictions.

spacesailor

[SSCBD]

For two weeks i was landing on mission beach (lightwing 912) and others. The cops had no problem with it at all. Also was not stupid and did not land near anyone if they were on the beach. Got plenty of waves.  Just don't do anything stupid or go near people or fly over them when landing. In other words dont be a di**h head.  

Remember everyone has a phone camera anyway!!. 

[Spoon]

16 hours ago, facthunter said:

Your "Kite" won't be worth much if you have much contact with sea water or spray. It's incredibly corrosion inducing. How successfully you "Read" the sand will dictate how lucky you are. The slope towards the water GETS some also. Aviation penalties or of "strict Liability" . Look up what that means in Legal Parlance.  Nev

Yeah totally understand strict liability and as it should be if you were landing on the beach. I’m sure everyone that has would have done a few circles around the area scanning for potential hazards including slope, debris not to mention people. 
 

I can see from the replies that this is certainly a grey area and everyone has opinions because of an absence  of clear laws and that’s where strict liability, common sense and other factors have to be considered and weighed accordingly. 
 

Thank you to everyone that replied it’s all valuable information. 
 

Cheers

Nick

[pmccarthy]

It would be interesting to know whether the STOL Youtubers in the USA need permission to land on all the hilltops, streamsides and so on. Is it Federal land or private? Do they carry insurance for their exploits?

[spacesailor]

Same goes for those tourist planes on Fraser lsland.

AND, there,s a lot more beach goers around the landind area.

One bad just of wind, then people Will be scrambling for their lives !.

spacesailor

[onetrack]

Any commercial operation such as aircraft ferrying tourists, needs to have a raft of official permissions to operate onto and off beaches, and with those permissions comes a raft of conditions applying to flying operations.

[turboplanner]

9 hours ago, Spoon said:

Yeah totally understand strict liability and as it should be if you were landing on the beach. I’m sure everyone that has would have done a few circles around the area scanning for potential hazards including slope, debris not to mention people. 
 

I can see from the replies that this is certainly a grey area and everyone has opinions because of an absence  of clear laws and that’s where strict liability, common sense and other factors have to be considered and weighed accordingly. 
 

Thank you to everyone that replied it’s all valuable information. 
 

Cheers

Nick

A few things here; 

Strict Liability relates to the legal status of a Regulation, which you find out about when CASA imposes a penalty for an infringement and you go to Court.

Public Liability is where you lose your house and assets because you were flying where you shouldn't have been and someone got killed.

 

You would certainly avoid any steep slope, but the comments here relate to the nore subtle issue that landing on a cross grade introduces complications you don't normally deal with on normal ALAs (Aircraft Landig Areas), such as nosewheel castor reacting to the cross grade. Another aspect would be morning and afternoon crosswinds, agin not normally encountered at most flying fields. 

 

Your questions have been brief, so the replies have been brief, but there are no grey areas, and no absence of clear laws.

I'm not sure how much formal instructing you have received but here's a very rough guide to why I just made the above statement.

 

A recreational aircraft is built and maintained to  RAA procedures and you are trained to RAA procedures, but from the time you leave the ground you are flying in CASA airpspace and so are bound by CASA's Rules of the Air many of which are Strict Liability Rules, as some people have mentioned.

 

CASA's general overview to make you familiar with some of these Rules of the Air is The Visual Flight Rules Guide (VFRG)

This doesn't spell out the Rules, just gives you a guide as its name implies.

It is 466 pages long with a lot of detail. On top of that are the Rules (Civil Aviation Regulations or CARS) and on top of those are and Guidelines/Explanations relating to the rules.

The Aircraft Landing Area (ALA) people were referring you to is covered in Civil Aviation Regulation (CAR) 92 (1) (d)   

The link to the Visual Flight Guide is https://vfrg.casa.gov.au/  and its probably easier to read if you click the link (which is at the bottom of the page) "download pdf version"

You may already have read all this, but from the speed of your reply suggesting grey areas, I've provided the links just in case.

 

 

 

 

[Lizzard]

Beach landings can be a can of worms .

 

The legalities aside,

 

Here is my hands on opinion if you are considering beaches

 

Flying over coastal areas offers some of the safest flying available to us , no power lines ,clean air, and a lot of runway that is survivable at worst which makes it very relaxing .

I also offer a free shark spotting service which has probably saved a few surfers over the years.

 

landing on a remote beach can be an instant rollover , especially with the latest runway queens with small tyres and high stall speeds.

The only way to adapt to  the risk is to only land on the Known beach which you just took off from .

If you can take off ,you can land as long as you are gentle with the front wheel and dont ever pull in for better breaking ..do the opposite .

 

It is my firm opinion that ultralight trikes should be light ,slow , and have instant and predictable  handling response which is not common for the modern commercial models .

The airborne redback  with a wizard  is  the most capable  faster trike with wheels that resist digging in with low pressure on the front .

 

 

 

In a forced landing ..engine out or other. You can hope that there is a favorable head wind . Use it !

Vehicle tracks are a god send as long as you took the time to do a low level inspection.

Where there is a sloping beach with active breakers and a non flat surface ,its is most likely that the sand will have soft/boggy bits that will grab the front wheel and over you go only to be pounded by the next lot of breakers.  In this situation take the high section . Kelp and a relatively flat surface is the best indication of a stable surface .

 

Otherwise touch down as close to the water as you can, ready to steer up the beach asap. If you see small stones and shells its likely its hard there .

A small wave will stop you very quickly and you have a job rinsing everything the same day.

 

A sloping beach with a crosswind is a skill that can be mastered safely by practice .

 

Try Not to operate from the same area too often as some beach users don't see you as amusement the second and third time you disturb the peace on their favorite beach

 

I have always made my own trikes and the limited bar out (no stall) that the manufacturers became addicted to is downright dangerous in this situation.

But having a no stall aircraft is a great thing ... NOT!

 

For Exactly this reason my home brew models always have an extra 300mm of bar out which means a full braking flare is doable and gets much more  weight off the front wheel .

It also means that on take off you can haul it off the ground  technically stalled but picking up speed. Bad if the fan stops!

It is also useful In an emergency landing on say a foot ball field to stall with a sideslip recovery  then round out . It can also be fatal if you fail with the timing.

 

Any way if we are taking a trike that was designed for runways to a beach you are out of its designed operating conditions ...best to not do it unless all of what I have said makes sense to you.

[kgwilson]

Back in the 90s we used to run club trips out to the beach with our 152s, 172s & PA28-181s to go fishing and get some shellfish. This was the West Coast of NZ North of Raglan. The black sand at low tide was compact and hard. It was just like landing on tarmac. We had to time it right & get away before the tide returned. Those were very enjoyable trips. The aircraft were thoroughly washed when we got back.

Edited February 7 by kgwilson

[facthunter]

Washing won't get in all the nooks and crannies and skin overlaps. Nev

[kgwilson]

I'm sure it won't but the aircraft were all sold and replaced in the late 90s to early 2000s. None were ever hangared so they were showing their age and I assume some corrosion by then.