Background information for flying around Uluru and Kata Tjuta

[timbo59]

Can anyone confirm for me whether private planes are allowed to fly low around Kata Tjuta and Uluru? Or is it restricted airspace because of all the commercial flights in the region? The reason I ask is that I'm trying to nail down the details for a novel I'm writing. If it makes any difference, the novel is set in 1985. 

 

Also, is there anyone on here with extensive experience of flying in central Australia, areas like Cobber Pedy, Oodnattada, etc?

 

Thanks in advance

[kasper]

I'd have a time finding an old VTC for Ayres Rock back to 1994 when I started flying but I recall that back then low level circumnavigation of the rock and the Olgas at 500' was permitted ... it absolutely is not now - see the current VTC:

 

https://www.airservicesaustralia.com/aip/pending/aipchart/vtc/AliceSprings_Uluru_VTC_17JUN2021.pdf

 

You are not flying 'around' Uluru or the Kata Tjuta at all - its a controlled flight past them on a set track and you are at 4-4,500' AMSL so at around 1,500' above the top of Uluru so near 2,500' above ground level.

[turboplanner]

I think it was tightened up after someone did a touch and go on the top.

[timbo59]

Hi Kasper. Your first line says that dropping down to 500' was fine back in the early 90's - is the second line a reference to current restrictions?

 

Let me put it this way. If we're talking mid 80's here, could someone have flown there early in the morning, performed a quick circuit round the rock a few hundred feet above it, same again for Kata Tjuta, and gotten away with it as long as there was no other air traffic? Maybe it was legal back then, maybe not, I don't know. I could just wing it in the story, if you'll pardon the pun, but I'd like to be accurate if possible. 

 

As for the touch and go, the only one I can find was very recent, in 2015. http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=1d3c5931-c2f2-40f6-b3e9-5787fce5bbc5#:~:text=Left Tire Marks On The,formerly known as Ayers Rock. I really don't know how anyone could manage it safely, because the top is heavily ridged - I climbed it long ago, well before the Anangu began asking people to respect their wishes and not make the climb. Last time I went there in 2011, with my American wife and kids, we just walked around the base. 

 

[turboplanner]

8 minutes ago, timbo59 said:

Hi Kasper. Your first line says that dropping down to 500' was fine back in the early 90's - is the second line a reference to current restrictions?

 

Let me put it this way. If we're talking mid 80's here, could someone have flown there early in the morning, performed a quick circuit round the rock a few hundred feet above it, same again for Kata Tjuta, and gotten away with it as long as there was no other air traffic? Maybe it was legal back then, maybe not, I don't know. I could just wing it in the story, if you'll pardon the pun, but I'd like to be accurate if possible. 

 

As for the touch and go, the only one I can find was very recent, in 2015. http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=1d3c5931-c2f2-40f6-b3e9-5787fce5bbc5#:~:text=Left Tire Marks On The,formerly known as Ayers Rock. I really don't know how anyone could manage it safely, because the top is heavily ridged - I climbed it long ago, well before the Anangu began asking people to respect their wishes and not make the climb. Last time I went there in 2011, with my American wife and kids, we just walked around the base. 

 

Given the source here is the Betoota Advocate, I'm not sure that's the actual case. A Saratoga would be much more of a handfull wheraas a Cherokee could be touched quite accurately. Giveaway is probably the tyre marks and estimated cost of $millions to remove the marks. I don't think you'd be applying the brakes up there.

[spacesailor]

And your told not to rake photographs, SO l took pictures of All those signs. That Rock, of course was hard Not to get in the photo. LoL

Next time in that vicinity l will try for a Climb on the Other Rock ?.

Mt Conner,

It looks like the rock named after Sir Henry Ayres, as you drive tbere.

And the cattle station has an airfield.

spacesailor

Edited May 14, 2021 by spacesailor
Double letter

[timbo59]

Most people driving out there mistake Mt. Conner for Uluru when they first see it in the distance. I've always felt kind of sorry for it, as it gets little love or acknowledgement compared to its illustrious cousins further west. 

[SilverHammer]

 

 

 

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5085/5234815332_704b0485c9.jpg

 

In 1981, before Yulara (AYQ) airport was commissioned in 1985, the Ayres Rock strip was adjacent to the Rock. On google maps satellite view, it is still visible about 600m to the NE. I was there with a C182 in August 1981, it was quite busy,  traffic control was see and be seen, although circuit direction and height around the Rock and to and from the Olgas was specified but often ignored. The terminal facilities were non existent.

[SilverHammer]

oops. The Flickr URL in my post was an attempt to embed another image from the 70's. It can be cut and pasted into your browser.

[timbo59]

Thanks SilverHammer, that kind of confirms my recollections from the period regarding Uluru, loose air control of people radioing their approach and intentions and keeping visual contact. Uluru wasn't as heavily visited in those days as it is now - or was, before COVID. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by timbo59
mistake

[onetrack]

I visited Ayers Rock in July 1969 with a mate (by road). The place was still the "Wild West", facilities were non-existent, Aboriginals were hardly seen, and the roads were little more than goat tracks.

I can't even recall seeing an airstrip or aircraft, but I guess the airstrip was there, then. We climbed the Rock and we were completely alone, all the way up, and all the way down.

There was a "visitors book" at the top with a few hundred entries in it. We left our entries - but I have no idea what might have happened to that book! It probably got vandalised and thrown out.

No aircraft flew in, or around the Rock, while we were there (a couple of days). We camped where we liked, there was no delineated camping areas, back then. We only saw about 4 or 5 other vehicles. That was the "good ol' days"!

[timbo59]

They kept those books - my name and that of my then girlfriend are in one of them. It's my understanding that the park rangers replaced them when they'd fill up and stored the old ones away.

[clouddancer]

You should check ERSA special procedures

[spacesailor]

The height difference between Mt Conner & Mt ularu if approximately 5 metres. 

The Whitey,s can And should promote a climbing resort, for the Coming of the TOURIST BOOM. 2025 . LOL

spacesailor

[onetrack]

I've often thought about what a great spot the top of Mt Conner would make as an ALA. I suspect some chopper operators might have already landed there, but I don't know what the terrain is like on the top.

From ground level the top of Mt Conner appears very flat, but aerial photos show it isn't nearly as flat as it appears.

 

https://pbase.com/bmcmorrow/image/170811210&exif=N

[timbo59]

I think vegetation might be more of an issue! :) 

 

 

[timbo59]

These two pictures also tie in with what was mentioned earlier. The first shows the old air strip, taken from the viewpoint of being on top of Uluru. The second ties in with what I said earlier, wondering how someone managed a touch and go on top of Uluru - look at all those ridges running SE to NW. I think I read that the pilot was drunk - I can believe it. That or you'd have to be crazy to try it. 

[timbo59]

One more follow-up. I wrote to one of the operators yesterday that takes people on scenic flights in the area. This is what he said in the reply I just received - 

 

'While there’s no hard restriction we do adhere to requests from the National Park to fly at specified altitudes and tracks around the sites. Planes will fly above 4000’ AMSL and Helicopters will be at 3500’ AMSL. By duress of weather we will fly at any altitude that is safe.

 

I hope that helps!'

[Bruce Tuncks]

Nice pics, but really old. The airstrip is now some distance away at Yulara.

[timbo59]

Yeah, that's why I said 'old' in my post. The disused strip right by Uluru was mentioned in earlier posts.  :) 

[Yenn]

I cannot find the instructions for sightseeing at Ayers Rock, but from memory there was one direction to go round, same at the Olgas.

The whole area was in a designated remote area and if you didn't have HF you had to stay within sight of the main highways or railway lines

I have a 1994 VTC for the Alice and Darwin. This gives VFR routes to several places in the area and shows the route to Ayers rock going overMulga Dam and Lawrence Gorge check points.

In those days a lot of aircraft had radios which had to have the necessary crystals for the frequencies fitted. I am not sure when the modern multi frequency radios came int being, but it was around the time you are interested in.

[kasper]

If anyone cared to follow the link in my original post to the online current VTC the full flight path allowed, heights and even clarification that the old airstrip is no longer available to use.