turboplanner Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 1 minute ago, jackc said: Still becoming infected and spreading it everywhere…..the vaccine stops the person having vaccine, from getting so sick…….that’s it. Does not stop the spread, only masks, sanitisers, social distancing etc will do that. That's the scenario I was describing. The whole vaccinated population could catch it with no more effect than a bout of flu, but they all become spreaders. The victims of that will be the unvaccinated.
jackc Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 1 minute ago, turboplanner said: Famous last words. A Couple of weeks ago the Delta strain hit Mildura, Bendigo, Shepparton and next day was in Benalla and Mansfield. Farmers can travel hundreds of kilometres in a day to buy a ram. Caused by deadbeats escaping the concrete Melbourne wasteland……. 1
turboplanner Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, jackc said: Caused by deadbeats escaping the concrete Melbourne wasteland……. You can insult other people all you like but the spread carriers are not limited to deadbeats. I wouldn't call nurses coming home from the coast at the weekend. The Cairns outbreak was caused by an airline hostess on the Longreach to coat shift. Edited August 29, 2021 by turboplanner 1
octave Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 Just now, jackc said: Still becoming infected and spreading it everywhere…..the vaccine stops the person having vaccine, from getting so sick… Yes you can still get it although the chances are reduced and you can still pass it on but the chances are reduced but the main point is you are much less likely to become seriously ill. For the vaccinated it will become a minor illness, Early on in the pandemic many people said we should only lockdown the vulnerable. Now it is the unvaccinated who are the vulnerable. If people don't want to get vaccinated that is fine by me as long as they responsibility should they get it and pass it on.
aro Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 Not sure about the others, but Mildura was people from Mildura who travelled to go to the football. Who could have predicted country people travelling to see a sporting event... 2
jackc Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 1 minute ago, turboplanner said: That's the scenario I was describing. The whole vaccinated population could catch it with no more effect than a bout of flu, but they all become spreaders. The victims of that will be the unvaccinated. The big difference is…….rural Qld within many kilometres. of me has not had an infection. Besides my attitude stems from being a cancer sufferer who is still alive, celebrating 10 years extra life 🙂. I am a ticking time bomb and dying does not bother me. I have got this far in an exceptional life…….IF I died tomorrow I would not feel cheated. 1
jackc Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 3 minutes ago, turboplanner said: You can insult other people all you like but the spread carriers are not limited to deadbeats. I wouldn't call nurses coming home from the coast at the weekend. The Cairns outbreak was caused by an airline hostess on the Longreach to coat shift. Travelling? We have mothballed our hybrid camper, not going anywhere as my wife and I have hobbies that we pursue with happiness at home. I don’t want to risk catching covid AND spreading it around…….but that is my responsibility to the cause……..
jackc Posted August 29, 2021 Posted August 29, 2021 7 minutes ago, octave said: Yes you can still get it although the chances are reduced and you can still pass it on but the chances are reduced but the main point is you are much less likely to become seriously ill. For the vaccinated it will become a minor illness, Early on in the pandemic many people said we should only lockdown the vulnerable. Now it is the unvaccinated who are the vulnerable. If people don't want to get vaccinated that is fine by me as long as they responsibility should they get it and pass it on. In 5 years time we will only really know the volatility of spreading it, we will have statistics of vaccination success, long term side effects, susceptibility of vaccinated people spreading it etc. Only time will tell. 1 1
octave Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 4 minutes ago, jackc said: In 5 years time we will only really know the volatility of spreading it, we will have statistics of vaccination success, long term side effects, susceptibility of vaccinated people spreading it etc. Only time will tell. I understand that you have your personal situation and that is fine but what should the government do in your view?
jackc Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 10 minutes ago, turboplanner said: You can insult other people all you like but the spread carriers are not limited to deadbeats. I wouldn't call nurses coming home from the coast at the weekend. The Cairns outbreak was caused by an airline hostess on the Longreach to coat shift. People must accept responsibility by not travelling, unless there is an urgent need. Nurses? I feel sorry for any health professional. The Govt has covid sufferers at mainstream hospitals, infecting those hospitals? The Army could establish field hospitals in unused buildings for covid sufferers ONLY, the medical staff work within that hospital and live in quarantine with all services they need to be provided. Rotate the medical staff after appropriate monitoring with other staff sources, to give them a break. Pay them accordingly. 1
octave Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 Like some others here I am lucky enough to be in a position where I do not (so far) have to expose myself to the risk of infection. I do of course rely on people who are putting themselves at risk in order to deliver my shopping etc. Some of the reasons I got vaccinated are because although I am pretty safe at the moment I would like lo to start getting at and about more. I have an aging mother interstate who was recently widowed. At her age having we could have to do a dash interstate for compassionate reasons at any time. Although I am in a low risk situation now circumstances may change. Early next year I will be requiring a medical procedure that will require a hospital stay. It is totally rational to do everything I can in order to protect myself (and others). I am of course hoping by then that the hospital will not be full of covid patients.
turboplanner Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 17 minutes ago, jackc said: In 5 years time we will only really know the volatility of spreading it, we will have statistics of vaccination success, long term side effects, susceptibility of vaccinated people spreading it etc. Only time will tell. 11 minutes ago, jackc said: People must accept responsibility by not travelling, unless there is an urgent need. Nurses? I feel sorry for any health professional. The Govt has covid sufferers at mainstream hospitals, infecting those hospitals? The Army could establish field hospitals in unused buildings for covid sufferers ONLY, the medical staff work within that hospital and live in quarantine with all services they need to be provided. Rotate the medical staff after appropriate monitoring with other staff sources, to give them a break. Pay them accordingly. We're really not looking for medical advice. The proposal is to open up all over Australia when the vaccination level is at a certain percent where the number of unvaccinated people are not enough to overflow the hospitals. As people die those numbers wil become less and less. 1
octave Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 7 minutes ago, jackc said: The Army could establish field hospitals in unused buildings for covid sufferers ONLY, the medical staff work within that hospital and live in quarantine with all services they need to be provided. Rotate the medical staff after appropriate monitoring with other staff sources, to give them a break. Pay them accordingly. Sounds easy. One of the issues is that treating a serious covid case requires many specialized health professionals it is not just an issue of ICU beds but staff to operate them. Health systems all around the world are dealing with the same problems an implementing varying strategies which when successful tend to be copied. The problem at the moment seems to be the length of time people are in the community before being diagnosed. The trackers and tracers are just not able to keep up. The question is do we want to become a basket case like Florida? 1
skippydiesel Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 Jackc - Great idea ! Just one teeny little problem - there are not enough health worker to staff the existing facilities, let alone additional pop up treatment centres. 1 3
Marty_d Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 If you feel sorry for nurses, then lessen their workload by getting vaccinated. This is kind of a no-brainer. It's like turning your lights out in the Blitz or driving safely - you're doing it not only to save your own life but also the lives of others. 1 1 1
Bruce Tuncks Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 I like the idea if an epidemic among the unvaccinated. Bring it on! Yes, I am a libertarian who believes the government should not interfere as long as your actions don't hurt others. Infecting others with a potentially fatal virus sure is hurting them. Flying your plane over the countryside doesn't hurt anyone, well not as a sensible person would say is at all likely. The mindset of one who would pass up a vaccine shot out of fear is hard to comprehend. They clearly don't understand the concept of "least worst". Mind you, there are those who are not fearful, they reckon the odds against them catching the virus are very low due to their geography and lifestyle. I used to think they were correct, but this latest strain is so infectious that it will get them sooner rather than later. 1
facthunter Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 There's an epidemic of misinformation out there. If they are reading that stuff your friendship is surely tested. When you are being careful can you trust him/Her to include in your space and undo all your efforts, potentially..An epidemic amongst the un vaccinated will overwhelm the hospital system also and ordinary people won't be able to use it for the original purposes it was designed for. We are seeing that now. Nev 4 1
spacesailor Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 AND NOW This covic19, has a new veriant ! Covic19:C:1:2. From Africa according to my news App. A bit worrisome as it appears our vacs is usless. spacesailor
turboplanner Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 39 minutes ago, facthunter said: An epidemic amongst the un vaccinated will overwhelm the hospital system also and ordinary people won't be able to use it for the original purposes it was designed for. We are seeing that now. Nev The Premier outlined that yesterday. In NSW with over a thousand cases per day their system is like New Year's Eve every day, just about at full capacity now, so very concerning. All the States are working on a target to reach - maybe 80% vaccinated when the entire pool of unvaccinated is within the State's capacity, then there's no problem with opening up because there's enough hospital capacity for all the unvaccinated at the same time, and if they all get sick they can all be treated.
Garfly Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 (edited) No amount of information has a chance against entrenched belief. I'm thinking of QAnon style conspiracy theories. Homo Credulus has far more important roles for 'belief' than mere truth seeking. Some sobering listening: https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/rn-presents/this-much-is-true/ It ain't new. Voltaire put it this way: Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. If the God‐given understanding of your mind does not resist a demand to believe what is impossible, then you will not resist a demand to do wrong to that God‐given sense of justice in your heart. As soon as one faculty of your soul has been dominated, other faculties will follow as well. Edited August 30, 2021 by Garfly 3 1
onetrack Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 This Darwin Award winners statement about his "freedom", just outlines the total selfish stupidity of this breed - "I care more about freedom than I do for your personal health.” Note the lack of care for "your personal health". In other words he doesn't give a rats rectum about spreading the virus to other people, as long as he has his cherished "freedom". Well, he sure got his freedom from any controls and laws and regulations on this planet. I don't know about where he is now, could be he's facing a whole lot more restrictions than he ever dreamed of. https://au.news.yahoo.com/dad-of-four-30-who-organised-anti-covid-rally-dies-from-virus-054746631.html 1
jackc Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 Sadly in today’s World few human beings care about their fellow man, no matter what its related to. See it every day……..
facthunter Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 Not enough ? Maybe but fear ignorance and greed are big factors. Usually poor people are more generous than the rich. In the US Money is their god. Capitalism is like the game of monopoly.Winner takes all. It's NOT a fixer. If there's no money in it nobody will do it.. What's good for GM is good for America. When THEY went insolvent they went to the Government begging (but still in their Private jets). Technically the US (Democratic) govt owned GM. The Lemonade Boy rising to be president,is a deceptive myth. It takes $hitloads of cash to get there and the media onside. Corporate entities have more money and power than most countries. and THEY are NOT elected. Nev 2 2 1
jackc Posted August 30, 2021 Posted August 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, planesmaker said: Covid related suicides?? 1
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