ASIC AGAIN!!!

[BrendAn]

9 minutes ago, facthunter said:

I was actually backing you up Brendan and responding to other Posters, Sometimes there's a few frequencies operating at once Here. My Apologies for  the lack of clarity.. Nev

No need to apologise nev. 

Been listening to reporters talk about that loaded gun when it wasn't even assembled. They have to sensatioalise everything . 

[KRviator]

20 minutes ago, BrendAn said:

what is ridicule. every news report mentions a loaded gun and there never was one.

Just like the dozens, if not hundreds, of "news" reports telling everyone those nasty Sydney train driver's went out "on strike" when that never happened either. 

Welcome to the modern-day media....

 

[skippydiesel]

1 hour ago, onetrack said:

Skippy, you're wrong. At no stage did the offender get into the aircraft. The flight attendant stopped him at the door, and the video clearly shows the shearer holding the offender in a chokehold - IN the doorway of the aircraft. Only after crew and pax went through his tool bags did the shearer THROW him, face-down onto the aircraft floor.

Your a classic wriggler - in the door, in the aircraft cabin - a matter of CM's. The inescapable point is, he should never have got where he did.

It doesn't matter if the gun was loaded or not, the bombs real or fake - they could have been and at tragedy the result. Would you have been arguing CM's then??? - I think not.

SECURITY  FAILED !!! - ASIC is supposed to be a key part of security - ASIC FAILED!!

 

If ASIC can so easily be circumnavigated AT A RELATIVELY MAJOR AIRPORT WHERE SECURITY RELAY MATTERS what hope for a small, twice a day RPT airport, with virtually no security funding, casual staff, who are only around shortly before/after the twice daily arrival/departure ???? - The rest of the day anyone can walk in to any part of the airport - I know I have seen for myself.

 

I do not care about your flying interest/aspirations - there are other pilots, who like to tour across our wonderful country, why should they be required to obtain an ASIC, that achieves no practical purpose,  just to land at a small airport, where there may be an RPT aircraft standing  or not, for fear of the once in a blue moon chance of receiving a $3000 (?) fine for not displaying the said useless card??😈

 

 

[onetrack]

Ahh, give it a break, Skippy - you need treatment for your Aspergers Syndrome. You're the original, "One Note Charlie".

[skippydiesel]

2 minutes ago, onetrack said:

Ahh, give it a break, Skippy - you need treatment for your Aspergers Syndrome. You're the original, "One Note Charlie".

 

Thus harped the complaisant, while their rights & privileges are eroded. Apathy rules! Good on ya mate, take another prozac & have a little nap!

 

You probably didnt notice the title of this thread "ASIC AGAIN" - I am sticking to the "One Note"/topic.

 

• Not intersted - don't participate
• Got nothing constructive to say - don't participate😈

[Jerry_Atrick]

Hmm saying ASIC didn't work in this instance is sort of like saying guns don't kill people, people kill people and those law abiding citizens who want guns won't kill anyone; and baddies will get them anyway, so let's dispense with gun control laws.. In fact our 17 year old perpetrator had a shot gun.. Did he have a license for it? I am thinking not. If not, then they clearly failed in this case, too, and therefore we should get rid of gun laws, right?

 

In the same vein that gun laws failed, I guess ASIC did; any law and restriction is one part of the puzzle of keeping people safe. Anyone hell bent on breaking the law will, and they will either be prevented by other checks, or captured later, or get away with it. ASIC is one part of the security puzzle.

 

The difference of course, is that guns being freely available are obviously a far bigger risk than free access to most airports in the country. Of course, free access to some airports, such as Avalon, would represent a big risk and I would accept an ASIC as part of the mix of security measures to get access to fly in there.. A line has to be drawn somewhere, though. What about Proserpine? Probably. What about Merimbula? Rex flies in an out of there with routes to Melbourne and Sydney, apparently (thought Rex went bust): https://begavalley.nsw.gov.au/services/arrivals-and-departures.

 

Where does a pollie draw the line. We know pollies in Australia are incredibly risk averse. I would see Merimbula as low risk and not needing an ASIC to fly into, but a pollie does not want any responsibility for something bad happening would just say "stuff it.. one person ruins it for everyone rather than applying resources to police the baddies so that the goodies can enjoy their pastime." It is thus, the Australian way; drilled into us at primary school and beyond.

 

I don't have a problem with anyone continuing with this subject, nor any other. If I am bored by it, or I see it as a proprtionate approach, I will stop reading it. If people gave up the fight for many things, even when many others accepted it, how much worse would the world be?

 

BYW, now there is  an industry around it employing many people, I can't see pollies getting rid of it..

 

Even the Chinese ships had their MSIC cards, evidently, as no one went to remove them. 😉

Edited yesterday at 10:05 AM by Jerry_Atrick

[Moneybox]

Fear runs our lives and the media support it. I don't watch the news but I can't avoid bad news completely while I browse the internet. In reality the majority of the general public are good honest people. Most of our strict security measures are a waste of time and money because they are driven by fear of a highly unlikely set of events.

 

How many people have actually been stabbed by nail clippers or a table knife in a manner that couldn't have been achieved with a decent ball point pen or an uncapped fountain pen. Perhaps we should ban pencils and pencil sharpeners because that's like reloading a weapon if you managed to break it on the first strike.

 

Consider how much cheaper your flight would be if we relaxed all the preflight security and in reality how much difference would it make? For one thing it would save a awful lot of time.

 

just in case....

[skippydiesel]

Hi Jerry,

 

Thank you for your considere input.

 

The incident at Avalon is but an extreme example of failure in what should be a highly regulated/secure civil aviation environment. The crux of the debate is the hundreds of RPT/Security Controlled Airports around rural Australia.

 

I have no recollection of anyone advocating to remove ASIC from being used at major domestic/international airports in Australia.

 

In my view this conversation is about the merits ASIC, as applied to low volume rural airports, designated Security Controlled Airports - does it confer an improved security benefit? I would say not for all the reasons previously articulated.

 

Flowing from the decision to impose ASIC, on these minor ports, is the impact on touring private pilots - Cost benefit analysis, where cost is not just financial, more importantly, includes loss of pilots automatic right of access to public airfields, there being no evidence for an enhanced security benefit to individual/population.

 

As for an "industry around it employing many people" - there are several service providers delivering ASIC to applicants. No idea what the number of employees would be - unlikly to be significant numbers.  As for the small rural airfields - at best a handful, as it would seem the existing ground/maintenance person (or similar) is most often tasked with the additional responsibility of security, that is if even this small step has been taken.

 

Unfortunatly your gun analogy does not apply - if here is a "black market" in unlicensed small aircraft, aircraft being stolen for criminal purpose, in Australia, I haven't heard of it. Nor can you secrete a manned aircarft on your person, baggage. May be possible with a drone (see my earlier comments)😈

 

 

[facthunter]

That's an all over the Place, Rambling  presentation. ASIC is becoming your Cause Celebre.   Nev

[BrendAn]

24 minutes ago, facthunter said:

That's an all over the Place, Rambling  presentation. ASIC is becoming your Cause Celebre.   Nev

Have to agree. This thread is turning into a never ending rant with no possibility of achieving anything.

[skippydiesel]

1 hour ago, BrendAn said:

Have to agree. This thread is turning into a never ending rant with no possibility of achieving anything.

Simple - If you are not learning/enjoying/have constructive comments - don't participate. The choice is entirely yours😈

[BrendAn]

18 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

Simple - If you are not learning/enjoying/have constructive comments - don't participate. The choice is entirely yours😈

fully agree skip. i have tuned out . you can rant to your hearts content. 😁

[facthunter]

IF everyone had that attitude  Skip ,  this wouldn't be a place you'd want to come to. Plenty of people HAVE made constructive comment but you don't LISTEN unless they Completely agree with you..  BTW . That's a cop out.  What have we learned from what you have posted that we didn't already know.? Also some of it is JUST  WRONG in fact. Nev

[Thruster88]

Has there been a hijack since the simple effective step of locking the cockpit door?

[Freizeitpilot]

Yes- I can think of two where a pilot hijacked the plane.

[Arron25]

11 hours ago, Freizeitpilot said:

Yes- I can think of two where a pilot hijacked the plane.

Bit hard to stop perb getting in...when he is already there😁.. so not really and appropriate example

A secure 'locked door' override needs to be available to at least one external, as this seems to be the latest 'hijack' process

[facthunter]

Details won't be readily available or what is the Point?, Don't encourage Copycat behaviour. There's plenty of would Be Heroes. OUT THERE.. Obviously security will be further increased..  Nev