Aircraft into power line 26/06/2022

[onetrack]

Maybe someone could have got the "larrikin" bit removed from the story. It's not a good look for RA to have a bloke who killed himself in an aircraft to have "larrikin" as the major description of the man. 

Everyday readers of the article will immediately rate "larrikin" up there with "hoon", and the gossip mill will go into overdrive, with the main object of the gossip being that, "all these RA pilots are larrikins - and there's the proof". 

[facthunter]

WE don't have much control of that sort of thing. As I said earlier, which of us hasn't missed seeing a SWER powerline till late in the forced landing exercise.  Nev

[ClintonB]

Around our local airport, there are major supply lines 3 poles side by side carrying lines towards gunnedah, and the industrial areas around it. Whenever instructor was teaching about engine out on take and to look for no more than 30 degrees either side of straight ahead, I was always thinking about in that range was full of lines and what a silly place to put them. the airport has been there longer than most of these lines would have been. Now they are building more industrial area to the south parallel to the other runway. There will be no clear area in the circuit other than the runways.

[turboplanner]

    

3 hours ago, onetrack said:

Maybe someone could have got the "larrikin" bit removed from the story. It's not a good look for RA to have a bloke who killed himself in an aircraft to have "larrikin" as the major description of the man. 

Everyday readers of the article will immediately rate "larrikin" up there with "hoon", and the gossip mill will go into overdrive, with the main object of the gossip being that, "all these RA pilots are larrikins - and there's the proof". 

 

I opted not to link another similar description of this person, because it only seems to attract like-people.

 

There are some pilots killed where you think, “how do I avoid that” Weather is one of those complex ones where you can do the training and find yourself in the air with nothing as forecast and sheer luck gets you home.

 

This case hasn’t been finalised so we don’t know what caused his pathway to that power line, larrikin or not, but if it was illegal low flying we can very easily avoid being taken out suddenly in the same way just by avoiding it.  Removing the risk is always much surer than minimising it.

 

Minimum Altitude for flight (except taking off and landing)

For anyone teaching themselves to fly or flying with an Instructor who doesn’t explain your regulation obligations, the second your wheels leave the grass or runway you are flying in CASA Airspace and subject to their rules of the air as they used to be known, when about 30 were enough for PICs to operate.

 

Here’s a plain English guide

https://www.casa.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-08/plain-english-guide-part-91-new-flight-operations-regulations-interactive-version.pdf

 

The minimum heights are in two parts:

 

Minimum Height Rules for populous areas and public gatherings.

Page 101 (91.265) (MOS 12.01)

The record that probably triggered this one was probably a powered parachute that flew in under the tree canopy at a Sunday village market and crashed into some limbs.

At the other end of the scale was the guy in a twin who opted to do a steep turn beat up of a Mine Site and didn’t see the radio antenna, killing all six POB.

 

“Must not fly……below 1000 feet above the highest feature or obstacle within a radius of 600 metres of the point on the ground or water immediately below the aeroplane. (So if you were hanging a 1000’ plumb bob below the aircraft it wouldn’t hit the masts, high buildings or hills just over your right shoulder out of sight.)

 

That leaves the rest of Australia

 

Minimum Height Rules

Page 103 (91.267) (MOS 12.02)

“You must not fly” [note the must] “an aircraft below 500 feet above the highest feature or obstacle within a horizontal radius of 300 metres of the point on the ground or water immediately below the aircraft.”

So you again apply the plumb bob test, this time 500’ long.

 

(This doesn’t include normal take offs and landings in accordance with the POH)

 

Power Lines

You can’t see power lines which is why you look for power poles coming in to land, and you can no longer rely on these radiating back from the homestead because those round green patches which look so small from the area and are now spread out across Australia are huge, often requiring 3 phase power for the pump shed, and often having their own spur line from the cross country source, so nowhere near the homestead.

 

Power Lines in Hills or Mountains

It would be nice if power company operations manuals required cross-valley cables to the CASA regs and then you would have that safe separation, but it’s never a good idea to be flying down in a valley; in fact the higher you are the safer you are because you have that option of the steep descending turn.

 

You can be lucky and see the pylons and usually the cables have to be strong enough and heavy enough to be seen, although I flew over the site where a US Airforce pilot took himself out down in the Grand Canyon, and a Cherokee pilot took himself out in the Howqua valley over Eildon reservoir.

 

The second issue with mountain cables is that they aren’t necessarily going along the side of the valley or across it at 90 degrees. I flew a Cessna up the Kiewa Valley from Wodonga once keeping well away from power lines running along the valley for some distance, then all of a sudden saw the cables coming towards me and climbing sharply up the window. I still had plenty of clearance to get away but it was a good lesson.

 

Its well worth checking out all the High Tension lines in your route and estimating the time you’ll be near them. On the WAC charts the State built ones are all over-scale and good check points.

Edited June 30, 2022 by turboplanner

[RFguy]

The agricultural low level pilot crews have some fancy Google earth overlay for ALL power lines. well all they maintain and know about.....

Edited June 30, 2022 by RFguy

[jackc]

1 hour ago, ClintonB said:

Around our local airport, there are major supply lines 3 poles side by side carrying lines towards gunnedah, and the industrial areas around it. Whenever instructor was teaching about engine out on take and to look for no more than 30 degrees either side of straight ahead, I was always thinking about in that range was full of lines and what a silly place to put them. the airport has been there longer than most of these lines would have been. Now they are building more industrial area to the south parallel to the other runway. There will be no clear area in the circuit other than the runways.

In which case I would never fly to or from an airport I did not think safe enough.  Serves as a good reminder to me when planning any trip to make sure I feel safe to fly to a location, or not.

[turboplanner]

33 minutes ago, RFguy said:

The agricultural low level pilot crews have some fancy Google earth overlay for ALL power lines. well all they maintain and know about.....

Private lines are an issue. Property owners don’t always register them. If you fly high you don’t hit them.

[jackc]

Maybe the local energy provider can supply power line mapping for an area people wish to fly in?

[turboplanner]

3 minutes ago, jackc said:

Maybe the local energy provider can supply power line mapping for an area people wish to fly in?

Why? It’s illegal to fly down there.

[jackc]

IF they have engine failure, can you have too much knowledge?  Besides some controlled airspace restrictions mean you have to fly low?  

 

[ClintonB]

46 minutes ago, jackc said:

In which case I would never fly to or from an airport I did not think safe enough.  Serves as a good reminder to me when planning any trip to make sure I feel safe to fly to a location, or not.

Tamworth is a large enough airport and supports commercial and training, powerlines don’t really affect the dash 8 etc that fly out of here because they climb well and have 2 large turboprop donks, it’s us GA users with 60 year old conts  and lycomings that need to worry about sudden stoppages.

the 2200m runway is way more than needed, even the 1100 one is adequate for ops normal with reserve. It’s when the fan stops I am concerned about the limited options, and even less now.

[turboplanner]

20 minutes ago, jackc said:

IF they have engine failure, can you have too much knowledge?  Besides some controlled airspace restrictions mean you have to fly low?  

 

Don’t be sucked in by the internet whining. Check the  routes for ground clearance.

[jackc]

1 minute ago, turboplanner said:

Don’t be sucked in by the internet whining. Check the  routes for ground clearance.

In my area I have NONE, with airstrip at 650 feet above MSL. and controlled airspace breathing down my neck 😞 

[turboplanner]

Well you told us you lived out west, but the procedure is you check the airspace above 650 feet. If you can comply with the refs I posted, you’re good to go. If not it’s not a flyable area so no point building an airstrip there.

[jackc]

Can’t go over 1000 above mean sea level, so that leaves me 350 AGL.  Spoke with Rocky ATC, gave them location.

They have said they will let me fly out of here, buts it’s not strictly to the written rule…… sometimes the written rules are stupid anyway.  Just like some of the airspace changes ASA want to make.  

[turboplanner]

11 minutes ago, jackc said:

Can’t go over 1000 above mean sea level, so that leaves me 350 AGL.  Spoke with Rocky ATC, gave them location.

They have said they will let me fly out of here, buts it’s not strictly to the written rule…… sometimes the written rules are stupid anyway.  Just like some of the airspace changes ASA want to make.  

If that’s the case you don’t have a problem so why did you post the way you did.

[jackc]

Turbs, you are the one always on about rules etc.  I am saying I have to break rules to do what I need, that incidentally won’t harm anyone…..but as you always say ‘rules are rules’ Anyway, you seem to have a set on me tonight?

I don’t remember pee’ing your Weeties this morning?  

[turboplanner]

11 minutes ago, jackc said:

Turbs, you are the one always on about rules etc.  I am saying I have to break rules to do what I need, that incidentally won’t harm anyone…..but as you always say ‘rules are rules’ Anyway, you seem to have a set on me tonight?

I don’t remember pee’ing your Weeties this morning?  

You are not breaking the rules if the restriction is lifted for you.

[jackc]

Won’t get anything in writing, that is for sure.  IF SHTF, I do have pretty good negotiating skills though. 

I will just work on that plan 🙂 

[turboplanner]

4 minutes ago, jackc said:

Won’t get anything in writing, that is for sure.  IF SHTF, I do have pretty good negotiating skills though. 

I will just work on that plan 🙂 

You won’t get anything in writing. You won’t necessarily get an approval if you call ATC in which case you don’t fly. If the ATC determines there are no issues and gives you approval, you’re legal to go. Same procedure for inbound.

[jackc]

Just call them on the mobile, leave radio on but not ask anything over radio lest someone snitches to CASA about me getting some advantage in respect of rules etc.  Can’t trust many human beings these days 🙂 

Big mistake in letting people know what you are upto other than the usual commonsense safety  things. 

[turboplanner]

22 minutes ago, jackc said:

Just call them on the mobile, leave radio on but not ask anything over radio lest someone snitches to CASA about me getting some advantage in respect of rules etc.  Can’t trust many human beings these days 🙂 

Big mistake in letting people know what you are upto other than the usual commonsense safety  things. 

I think first start flying, get an aircraft flying and do the Nav course, where you will learn the procedures for doing what I've been saying. It's not a cloak and dagger thing where some person would gain anything by listening in, it's around a 10 second call. If the space is free he will lift it for you.

[turboplanner]

4 hours ago, ClintonB said:

Around our local airport, there are major supply lines 3 poles side by side carrying lines towards gunnedah, and the industrial areas around it. Whenever instructor was teaching about engine out on take and to look for no more than 30 degrees either side of straight ahead, I was always thinking about in that range was full of lines and what a silly place to put them. the airport has been there longer than most of these lines would have been. Now they are building more industrial area to the south parallel to the other runway. There will be no clear area in the circuit other than the runways.

The things you are describing there are all Planning matters. Problem is while flyers hate journalists calling all planes Cessnas, virtually none of them would be going to the Online planning portal to check for new developments coming up, and putting in submissions to make people aware that all the circuit area, not just the runways has amenity problems with some designs.

[johnm]

this one should give you power line mapping 

 

give you an idea anyway

 

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=5a53f6f37db84158930f9909e4d30286

[onetrack]

Thanks Johnm - However, the "Look up and Live" app you linked to, only operates in QLD., N.S.W., Vic., and S.A.

W.A., the N.T. and Tasmania are not included.