Melbourne Airport rail link

[red750]

Details have been released of Melbourne Airports proposed rail link.

 

Despite the airport authorities desire for an underground station, and reports of a station already built under the airport terminal from its original construction, Dan "Skyrail" Andrews has decided to blight the community with a lengthy skyrail, including a high level station which will enable passengers to bask in the balmy Tullamarine weather during winter.

 

 

[facthunter]

I was around during all of that airports construction and if there's any station already built under it, it's news to me and a lot of others.  Originally there was a plan to have a second east west runway South of the existing one but the area has subsequently been built out by development . Nev

[red750]

Can't give you details, but it written about quite a bit when the rail line was being discussed. 

[facthunter]

I'll remain skeptical. since Melbourne's rail is not often underground. City loop excepted, but you'd expect that to be. What's the cost difference?  Lots I'd expect.   Nev

[red750]

Story on Herald Sun website. More to it, buried behind damn paywall.

 

Melbourne Airport whacks rail plans

Melbourne Airport has been blindsided by the state government’s elevated station plan, saying they hadn’t agreed to it yet.

[Jerry_Atrick]

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/fight-or-flight-conflict-with-airport-looms-after-government-reveals-sky-rail-plan-20220920-p5bjmp.html has detail of the spat (open in private mode). It isn't quite a whack, but the Herald Sun is the Herald Sun. No mention by Melbourne Airport management of an existing underground station..

 

Having said that, I would want to make sure there were multiple completely covered areas to get to an above ground platform.. and I would personally perfer an underground station. The Melbourne Airport management have expressed a preference for an underground station given they are planning additional terminals and see a need to have a second station sometime in the future. That, and the aesthetics seems to make the difference.

 

Obviosuly, to keep the costs "down", they are looking at integrating into the existing network, and the new loop.. Would it have been better to run it from Spencer St. Station, direct  - there are a couple of new stations planned, so I am thinking there won't be too many epxress trains for the city.. which, when I am in Melbourne, am in the SE 'burbs, so probably will find alternate transport.. Stopping in Sunshine... buggah that!

[facthunter]

Since airports are privately owned they can't reasonably be expected to  be allowed to dictate things which the taxpayer's have to pay for. Cost and priorities for other projects matter. We don't elect Airport owners and not everyone fly's or would use a TRAIN to access the airport either. Train schedules can't adapt to changed arrival times either. Nev

[turboplanner]

Melbourne Airport is already a trash town of elevated roadways, elevated car parks and a spaghetti of access roads so complcated that unless you download google earth maps, find a route and then repeat each sequence of the route changes a hundred times, you could still be out there.

 

Narita Airport which feeds Greater Tokyo is an example where underground rail is brilliant, able to pick you up or drop you off in the middle of the terminal where you can sit down and eat a meal or check yourself in right near the station.

 

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

6 hours ago, facthunter said:

Since airports are privately owned they can't reasonably be expected to  be allowed to dictate things which the taxpayer's have to pay for. Cost and priorities for other projects matter. We don't elect Airport owners and not everyone fly's or would use a TRAIN to access the airport either. Train schedules can't adapt to changed arrival times either. Nev

I agree they shouldn't be able to dictate to the government anything,, but the headlline about Melbourne Airport "whacking" tie Vic government is out of line with reality - or at least what The Age were reporting, which was airport management expressing a preference and working "in good faith" - which doesn not appear to be "whacking at all"..

 

However, as a taxpayer to the state (payroll taxes, land taxes, etc) as well as indirectly via federal taxes) as well as being directly impacted by the government decision, should they not be able to express their opnions and even facts, and that they are considered regardless of whether they participate in elections (wich corporations, otherwise known as legal persons, are not allowed to)?

[facthunter]

I didn't say they couldn't express opinions but it's the state that funds it in the end and that's where my concerns lie if the Corporation is using the media or other means to push their interests. . This not a new problem where corporations wish to exercise power over self interested developments. in NSW it's against the law to have developers funding anyone or interfering with planning but often ways are found to circumvent such laws but the intent is clear  Nev

[turboplanner]

1 hour ago, facthunter said:

I didn't say they couldn't express opinions but it's the state that funds it in the end and that's where my concerns lie if the Corporation is using the media or other means to push their interests. . This not a new problem where corporations wish to exercise power over self interested developments. in NSW it's against the law to have developers funding anyone or interfering with planning but often ways are found to circumvent such laws but the intent is clear  Nev

It is in Victoria too, but I've just seen a case where porkie after porkie was told by the developer.

[BrendAn]

The Andrews government have been up to their necks in corruption and dodgy deals since they took office.

[facthunter]

What have you been reading Laddie?    Nev

[BrendAn]

A bit off topic but you and everyone else have in Vic have witnessed Andrews lies and dodgy dealings right from the start of his reign.

He cancelled the east west link and promised to release the documents that led to that decision within a week of winning the election. Still hasn't released them . He paid out over a billion of our money even though he said no money would be paid. Not 1 minister was questioned over the redshirts affair because he told them to say nothing. Yet the young people they employed were dragged out of home in the middle of the night for questioning by the police some thrown in jail.  He tried to make the eastern freeway heritage listed from Chandler highway to Hoddle street to stop the libs building the east west link in the future.  Giving transurban the contract for the Westgate tunnel without even putting it out to tender.

Allowing them to double tolls overnight.  I wish I had kept notes every time I have heard something.i could write a book.  It's amazing how interested he is in fixing the health system all of a sudden with an election looming.  2 weeks ago they realised the report on the health system failings on a Saturday morning and the chairman didn't show his face for 4 days because  he copped most of the blame .   That's all for now. Sorry for the rant.😀

[red750]

And the eastern rail loop he's sinking $7bil into and won't be ready for 35 years. He'll be 85, or possibly be dead and buried by then. Auditor General said it would return 51c in the dollar.

[aro]

14 hours ago, BrendAn said:

He paid out over a billion of our money even though he said no money would be paid.

The billion dollar payment was the result of a side letter signed by the Libs. The Libs signed the side letter when Labor was promising to scrap the EWL after the election and were looking certain to win.

 

The Lend Lease consortium didn't want to sign the contracts until after the election, when the future became clearer. The Libs promised 1B if they signed the contract, specifically to be paid even if the contract was invalid or thrown out by the courts.

 

A billion dollars of taxpayers money committed by the Liberals with no purpose other than to cause problems for a Labor government, punish Victorians for voting Labor and support a future Liberal campaign. How does that add up to Labor corruption?

[BrendAn]

5 hours ago, aro said:

The billion dollar payment was the result of a side letter signed by the Libs. The Libs signed the side letter when Labor was promising to scrap the EWL after the election and were looking certain to win.

 

The Lend Lease consortium didn't want to sign the contracts until after the election, when the future became clearer. The Libs promised 1B if they signed the contract, specifically to be paid even if the contract was invalid or thrown out by the courts.

 

A billion dollars of taxpayers money committed by the Liberals with no purpose other than to cause problems for a Labor government, punish Victorians for voting Labor and support a future Liberal campaign. How does that add up to Labor corruption?

we know all that. the east west link was wanted by a lot of people and andrews agenda was to discredit it because it was not his idea. mathew guy has the right idea. stop the rail loop and fix the health system instead. he will not get back in because we the sheeples will continue to vote the chairman back in because we forget the lockdowns and the dodgy deals when his pr machine convinces us to.    by corruption i was referring to the redshirts rort . you can even go back to when dans wife hit the kid on the pushbike. 3 different cops forgot to do a breath test on her, pretty convenient.  going behind the feds back and signing a belt and road deal with his masters, all to his advantage ,stuff the people. the latest thing i have heard is they are going to almost double rego fees for vehicles over 2 litres. that will be announced shortly after they get back in. but its not all bad . the rail crossing removals are fantastic and i thank them for that.    pity they could not get rid of all the career politicians on both sides and get people in government who want to do the right thing .   sorry for rant number 2.

[facthunter]

Guy breaking the"PAIRS"agreement doesn't bother you.?  O'Brien was a joke. Libs need a remake throughout the land and preselect some decent people.  Like Rupert Hamer. Nev

[BrendAn]

59 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Guy breaking the"PAIRS"agreement doesn't bother you.?  O'Brien was a joke. Libs need a remake throughout the land and preselect some decent people.  Like Rupert Hamer. Nev

Yes nev. That's why I said I would like to see all these career politician's replaced with people who genuinely care about the state and the people.  

[red750]

Photos on Facebook yesterday of work on the rail link to Western Sydney Airport which is scheduled to open in 2026. However, Melbourne Airport (Tullamarine), which opened 54 years ago, is still waiting.

[KRviator]

2 hours ago, red750 said:

Photos on Facebook yesterday of work on the rail link to Western Sydney Airport which is scheduled to open in 2026. However, Melbourne Airport (Tullamarine), which opened 54 years ago, is still waiting.

Don't feel too bad. Took Brisbane 76 years before they got a railway line to the airport - though they did have the old Pinkenba line running just outside the boundary of the old Eagle Farm airport...

[onetrack]

It took 78 years for Perth Airport to get a railway line to the terminals. Guildford Aerodrome was built as an RAAF airbase in 1942, and commercial aircraft were only grudgingly allowed to operate from it from 1944, due to airline complaints that Maylands Aerodrome was totally unsuited for the increasing level of commercial use, and the increasing size of commercial aircraft. Guildford aerodrome wasn't renamed to Perth Airport until 1952, and the first train ran to Perth Airport only in 2022.

[facthunter]

Why is RAIL better than Busses for that situation? Busses can handle baggage better and is more flexible and why should people who rarely fly pay for this feature. Melbourne Airport MONOPOLY even demands it be UNDER GROUND. Get REAL.  Nev

[onetrack]

Electrically-driven, multi-car set trains have the capability to handle up to around 400 passengers at once, unlike buses, which are limited to around 70-80 pax (up to maybe 160 on an articulated bus). 

Electric-drive train sets are also extremely low pollution level, and low operating cost on a per-head basis. They're faster than buses, and don't get caught up in traffic jams caused by car crashes.

Trains have a longer lifespan than buses, 15 years for buses, 30 years for the modern stainless-steel, electric-driven train car sets.

Electric train technology today is pretty advanced, AC drive motors, and regenerative braking operates down to 30kmh, meaning the disc brakes get little hard use.

[facthunter]

People go to Airports from EVERYWHERE. and often have a bit of luggage. When there's an outage or fault busses always fill in at short notice. They have flexibility and could be EV. Dedicated lanes on some roads are used.. Rail lines use a lot of real estate . Needs a high rate of utilisation to justify and block traffic where there's a level crossing . Not always easy to avoid having in flat areas.  Nev