Western Sydney Airport fuel to be supplied by tankers.

[red750]

No work has been done to build a pipeline for fuel to Western Sydney Airport, so all fuel will have to be trucked in by tanker. I cannot supply the article of which I saw the headline , it's behind a damn paywall.

[turboplanner]

4 hours ago, red750 said:

No work has been done to build a pipeline for fuel to Western Sydney Airport, so all fuel will have to be trucked in by tanker. I cannot supply the article of which I saw the headline , it's behind a damn paywall.

Hard to believe someone forgot that; a lot of B Doubles per day.

 

[planedriver]

OMG! You can almost hear the announcements coming. "Flight No XXX now has an expected departure of XXX, as the fuel truck is delayed in heavy traffic on Camden Valley Way".

"She'll be right" as the saying goes. 😜

 

[440032]

It must be true, I saw it on the internet!

 

What do they do for fuel at Wellcamp (Toowoomba west)?

 

I must say though, I have asked around a little, how does jet fuel get to say Melbourne Tullamarine, is there a pipeline from Yarraville or somewhere? Or do they truck it to just over the road from the airport?

I travel past there a lot, I've never seen a steady stream of fuel trucks coming and going.

Let's say there is a pipeline, and there probably is, WHERE is it, what underground route does it take, how did it get there - is it three feet under roads (unlikely!), what if it gets damaged by some muppet and his backhoe.

With all the freeways and tunnels built and being built, a pipeline would have to be seven thousand feet underground to have not been chopped up yet.

If it was put in when the airport was built, it's 50 years old now. Unless it was made of Wakandan Vibranium, it would need replacing at some point. It's never sprung a leak?

I've always wondered about this. Yep, too much time on my hands.

 

Edited September 24, 2022 by 440032

[old man emu]

Here's the story from a different place https://australianaviation.com.au/2022/09/no-pipeline-means-trucks-to-take-fuel-to-western-sydney-airport/

 

Campbelltown Labor MP Greg Warren said, “When the operation reaches full capacity, the airport could potentially require 50 to 65 B-double fuel tanker deliveries per day, which would add to congestion on Sydney’s urban road network."

 

That's a typical comment made for political point-scoring. Even though made by a Labor Member, you could expect the same if the Libs or any other Opposition Party said it, so it's not worth the breath it took to say it.

 

Here's the route most likely to be taken from Port Botany to Nancy Bird-Walton Airport:

 

That route is already taken by hundreds of B-Doubles all day, every day. The only times that the fuel trucks would be affected by heavy traffic volumes are during the morning peak hours on the M7 and the afternoon peak hours on the M5. Between 7:00 pm and 5:00 am you could shoot a cannon along those Motorways and not hit much at all.

[planedriver]

Possibly things have changed in the fuel supply network OME.

Many years ago I did the automatic security gates at the JUHI fuel installation at Kingsford Smith Sydney Airport next to the international terminal, and they had a direct pipeline to the refinery at Clyde.

I looked after the complex for many years.

I was told back then, that due to underground water from the Cooks River, much of the airport was actually slowly sinking, which made one think about the security of underground pipes. In fact the the area surrounding the adjoining office had sunk to the point that it became necessary to have an additional new step built to get into the offices, whereas it had once been level.

The building is still there, so all's well that ends well, they say.

 

[facthunter]

There's plenty of pipes around carrying GAS to individual premises.  nev

[old man emu]

If the bulk storage facility for Jet-A1 is still at Clyde, then the route to Nancy Bird-Walton Airport places less stress on the road system than if the fuel was taken from Botany.

[planedriver]

That's true! and would halve the distance for it to travel. Not sure if it still comes from Clyde.

[onetrack]

There are pipelines (and cables) by the hundreds everywhere you drive or even walk. They carry fuel, water, gas, and communications. They're buried under roads, under footpaths, under private land and under Crown Land.

If you have half a working brain, you never dig into the ground anywhere without going to "Dial before You Dig" - nowadays simply shortened to "Before you Dig" (www.byda.com.au).

That site will tell exactly where all the underground services are located when you want to dig a hole in the ground. Digging a hole and damaging a pipeline or cable, without locating services will cost you dearly - and sometimes even kill you.

 

A little research will reveal that a major fuel farm will be constructed at Western Sydney airport, with pipelines running from the fuel farm to the airport refuelling points. The fuel farm will be filled by road fuel tankers - exactly the same as the hundreds of service stations are refuelled around Sydney every day.

The road fuel tankers nearly always run at night when congestion is non-existent - and if a holdup in tanker deliveries occurs, the airport fuel farm will have adequate fuel reserves to run flights for probably a couple of weeks or more.

 

https://www.duratec.com.au/news/western-sydney-international-nancy-bird-walton-airport-further-fuels-duratecs-growth-in-the-energy-sector/

[pmccarthy]

In the late 1970s / early 1980s VicRail moved into the petroleum business, entering into a joint venture with a number of local oil companies to build operate an oil pipeline between the Altona refinery and a tank farm beside the North East Railway at Somerton, where another pipeline took jet fuel to Tullamarine Airport. The tank farm was never built.

The pipeline was sold to private interests by the 1990s and is still used to carry jet fuel to the airport, and since 2008 no fuel has been carried by rail in Victoria.

[facthunter]

Reducing fuel tanked by road has always got to be a good aim, especially  the more tunnels we create. I like to put a good distance between me and them when on roads.. The amount used by jet Planes can't be compared with a "normal" service station.  Nev

[onetrack]

Nev, have you seen the queues in some servos when there's a rush on? I reckon Costco at Perth airport put nearly as much fuel through their servo there, as what Perth Airport uses!

[jackc]

Large fuel customers should be supplied by rail and the local storage should be quite some distance from the users facility for safety reasons.

[facthunter]

One track I don't know what the real comparo figures would be. Some Euro servos have a massive turnover. but fuel onloads for A-380 and B 747 must be large. The fuel load  SY -Perth was 27 tons for the B727. Nev

[Roundsounds]

8 hours ago, facthunter said:

One track I don't know what the real comparo figures would be. Some Euro servos have a massive turnover. but fuel onloads for A-380 and B 747 must be large. The fuel load  SY -Perth was 27 tons for the B727. Nev

An 380 would burn around  200,000kg SYD / LAX, a B787 a bit under 80,000kg. 
a B-Double carries about 35,000kg. 
lots a road traffic to keep up supply. 

[Old Koreelah]

In some parts of Europe the pubs are supplied via pipelines from breweries. If they can install beer pipelines across historic cities, why can’t we install fuel pipelines before it gets congested? 

Clever country.

[old man emu]

5 hours ago, Old Koreelah said:

In some parts of Europe the pubs are supplied via pipelines from breweries. If they can install beer pipelines across historic cities, why can’t we install fuel pipelines before it gets congested? 

Clever country.

Number one would be the cost of acquiring the land at Sydney prices. Then the environ-mentals would crack up about damage to the already created environmental desert that is the Sydney Metropolitan Area. They are creating a big enough stink about all the civil engineering for the whole of the infrastructure. 

[facthunter]

Then it becomes UN-Civil Engineering?   Nev

[jackc]

They have had many years to get this together, I remember all the arguments in the middle 70s when I was doing Army service at Moorebank, Sydney.  This country is hopeless at building ANYTHING…..

[Roundsounds]

3 hours ago, jackc said:

They have had many years to get this together, I remember all the arguments in the middle 70s when I was doing Army service at Moorebank, Sydney.  This country is hopeless at building ANYTHING…..

I would have to disagree, the country is very capable of building most things. The execs controlling the purse strings are too lazy to put together a case for funding projects, instead taking the easy bonus producing offshore options. 

[jackc]

IF they are too lazy to work out funding, then there is no hope of getting anything done.   All they want to do is sit at computers and go left click BUY 10 submarines from somewhere, same when buying planes,  even shovels.  Too lazy to get off our backsides and make anything except a few Bushmasters etc, at least the Ukrainians like us 🙂.  I watched our Council take 6 months to build a roundabout in Rockhampton, in the process they ripped it up twice.  Sorry, lost the faith in this country 😞 

[Roundsounds]

3 hours ago, jackc said:

IF they are too lazy to work out funding, then there is no hope of getting anything done.   All they want to do is sit at computers and go left click BUY 10 submarines from somewhere, same when buying planes,  even shovels.  Too lazy to get off our backsides and make anything except a few Bushmasters etc, at least the Ukrainians like us 🙂.  I watched our Council take 6 months to build a roundabout in Rockhampton, in the process they ripped it up twice.  Sorry, lost the faith in this country 😞 

I’m sure those at the coal face want to produce quality goods, it’s the greedy minority decision makers ruining / have ruined the country.

When these greedy individuals say the cost of labour is too high in Australia, they are really saying let’s get offshore slave labour with unsafe work practices to produce a substandard product. 
The people making these statements are those taking home 6 figure performance bonuses, bonuses paid to manage the destruction of Australian industries. 

Edited September 27, 2022 by Roundsounds

[Old Koreelah]

How often have I spoken to people keen to invest in their new venture or business expansion. The common theme is local government finding never-ending impediments to put in their way.

 

Any government fair dinkum about supporting economic growth should appoint a single person to facilitate, guide and advise anyone willing to invest...and hold them responsible for the plurry delays!

 

 

[jackc]

Just take a look at Aviation, we have the most broken down rules in the World, holding back Aviation in Australia because the peak bodies and Govt egos are so big, you would not get over them in a U2 Spy Plane 😞.  And Aviation is just one sector amongst many in this country…….