Notam question

[Thruster88]

I viewed this notam this morning before flying to said location. The times for the closed runway did not seem to make sense, however I am easily confused by UTC.

 

So answer in local time, what times was the runway closed. Central NSW.

[facthunter]

We are ahead of UTC. If the difference is 10 hours  it 1630 to  1900 + 10= 2900 is O500. next day.  It's been a long day here, check it. Nev

[Thruster88]

Flightradar24 shows the SkyEcho2 equipped Musketeer arrived at cootamundra at about 2304052110 utc or 7.10am local time.  Would you expect the runway to be closed according to the notam?  

[spacesailor]

But were is the " clocks go back  " time in the , ? .

Shouldn't the 10 hours be 9 or 11 due to the ever changing seasonal time ? .

Isn't that the REASON to use GMT/UTC .

I lost the plot , & don't know how to write  the acronym  for daylight saving & daylight losing time .

spacesailor

[Carbon Canary]

Most smartphones have the ability to provide the current times in many locations including UTC. Just search for UTC on your phone clock.  This is a simple way to confirm local time to UTC particularly around daylight savings changeover.

[old man emu]

I like

"Exc for Emerg Actf with 30 Min PN"

 

Oi, Mate! I don't care  if your engine has seized and you've got to put down. 30 minutes prior notice is 30 minutes, not right bloody now. Go into a holding pattern for a while."

[Bosi72]

There is a difference between "emergency aircraft" and "aircraft in emergency".

[RFguy]

NO No NO !!! the question here is not about how to convert UTC to local but that the NOTAM was issued in LOCAL time not  UTC !!!

https://www.airservicesaustralia.com/wp-content/uploads/NOTAM-Data-Quality-Requirements-for-Airservices.pdf

 

Here is where people lodge this stuff, let's take a look at it - NOTAMS are supposed to be lodged by an Authorised Person. 

https://www.airservicesaustralia.com/industry-info/flight-briefing/notam-originator/

 

It is well explained !!! 2.1.4, 2.1.5  in NWS-User-Guide.pdf   clearly spells that out

5.2 NOTAM Authorised Persons verification of 
https://www.airservicesaustralia.com/wp-content/uploads/NOTAM-Data-Quality-Requirements-for-Airservices.pdf

 

 

so, WTF ???!! If it was UTC, and they were running behind on their overnight work, then they should have realised this 2 hours before and issued a new  NOTAM.
CAN YOU TELL i HAVE A SORE BACK RIGHT NOW ?

 

 

Edited April 10, 2023 by RFguy

[spacesailor]

C C

 ''  Just search for UTC on your phone clock. This is a simple way to confirm local time to UTC particularly around daylight savings changeover. ''

If we all use UTC ! , Then we ALL have our clocks are set WRONG . and those ' school hours ' will be costing us Big $ fines .

So I'll keep my clocks on local standard & winter time to stay in bed longer , on those cold winter mornings .😃

spacesailor

Edited April 10, 2023 by spacesailor
smiley

[facthunter]

Ther's only standard and SUMMER Time. For you it's EST and ESST  and we should all use the 24 hour clock. Sometimes UTC is called Zulu.  Nev

[RFguy]

and if you really want more. then there is Kilo (+10) and Lima (+11).  etc. Sydney time EST is KILO.  so, in event stuff if we need to write local time, we might write "doors open at 1930kilo" 
https://www.ozatwar.com/usarmy/militarytime.htm

 

[facthunter]

Never used them, but Zulu will come up now and again..  Nev

[onetrack]

I like that Perth was on "Hotel" time. What time is it? ... "Hotel time!"  

 

I must say, I've never heard of those Wartime, time zone codenames previously. You learn something new every day.

[RFguy]

To remove ambiguity, when writing time in UTC, suffix the time group with Z. then, there is no ambiguity. this is common practice. put a stroke through the Z if you want to further disambiguate from "2"

 

[old man emu]

And to start wandering down another track, isn't it time that NOTAMs were broadcast in plain text, rather than secret squirrel abbreviations? Those abbreviations worked when NOTAMs were broadcast by telex and the sender paid for the number of letters. I bet now that a regular type of NOTAM would not involve more than a couple of hundred kilobytes. 

[Bosi72]

Notams are not used by RAA/GA pilots only. They are used by everyone, visiting pilots, international flights. Notams are standardised across the World. Some may never visit other countries, but if they do, the good thing the same English abbreviations (standards) would be applicable everywhere. Imagine learning e.g. French abbreviations ?

 

UTC is the same as GMT (Greenwich Mean Time, known by the borrow in London, UK), which is accepted as Universal Time and never changes regardless of local laws. To my knowledge WA, QLD don't have Daylight Savings, the SA is running in +30mins, some roadhouses along the Nullarbor are in +15mins offsets, so many local rules which I am not aware of.... but the great thing is the UTC/GMT never changes.

 

To move forward, I suggest start learning Notam/TAF aviation acronyms and learn adding +10, or +9:30 or +9:15 or whatever time difference is in your local state of residence. It is not that hard.

[Bosi72]

The information about difference between local time and UTC for any aerodrome can be found in ERSA.

 

[old man emu]

It's stupid for a country of such great longitudinal spread, but scant population, and instantaneous electronic communication to have three time zones. The time zones adversely impact on business and commerce. For example, if a business has an office in Sydney and one in Perth, both open from 9 to 5, then the worker in Sydney can't interact with Perth until midday, Sydney time. And the worker in Perth can't interact with Sydney after 2:00 pm Perth time.

 

The logical thing to do is to have one time zone based on 135 East, or UTC +9.5. That meridian basically bisects the continent East/West:

Of course there would be whingeing at first, but the benefits outweigh the disadvantages, just like it was with Daylight Saving. Just consider the benefit to commercial air travel. It's about a five hour flight from Sydney to Perth. If you read your ticket it would suggest that by comparing departure time to arrival time you would think that the flight only took two hours, but coming the other way would take eight hours. Imagine the confusion trying to arrange relatives to pick you up at either end.

[RFguy]

(frivolous) I want to see "NSW" cut into two states, north NSW and south NSW . IE cut NSW east-west at  Hervey Bay. OME can you put a line in for that please, also on your new Australia map. I think the existing queensland border is in the wrong place. 

 

Edited April 10, 2023 by RFguy

[Neil_S]

2 hours ago, Bosi72 said:

The information about difference between local time and UTC for any aerodrome can be found in ERSA.

 

 

And if you use AVPlan (and probably OzRunways) the screen will show both local time and UTC. It's really not that hard.

 

Cheers,

Neil

 

 

 

[spacesailor]

But , were oh were , is that U T City ? .

We all know that Greenwich is in London England ! .

And is marked into the floor ,

But why is it 'Mean ' .

spacesailor

 

[facthunter]

The earth rotates towards the east too.  If the sun shines on you first your time is theirs PLUS some,.  Arc to TIME. 180 degrees of longitude equals 12 Hours.  Nev

[facthunter]

Mean means something like an average.  Nev

[Garfly]

I don't think anyone here really has problems with UTC/local time conversions.  

I think Thruster was setting a trick question to get us thinking - about the trustworthiness of NOTAMs.

RFguy tipped the wink above with

"NO No NO !!! the question here is not about how to convert UTC to local but that the NOTAM was issued in LOCAL time not  UTC !!!"

[facthunter]

South New South Wales??? ALL the states names are ridiculous. It's either Sinney or the Bush. . The sun should be at max height at mid day. Thats NORMAL Anything else starts to muck up your circadian rhythm. Shift work is life shortening. You are not meant to PLAY all night unless you are an OWL or something. Ther's no queens in Queensland either . ask any Queens lander.  Nev