CASA qualifications applied to RAA

[old man emu]

I was wondering. If I have a full Part 61 PPL, it means I can fly in controlled airspace. If I switched to an RAA certificate, would that Part 61 approval carry over?

[sfGnome]

Depends on what you mean by “switched over”. If you maintain the PPL alongside the PC, then yes. If you forego the PPL, then no. 😕

[Roundsounds]

2 hours ago, old man emu said:

I was wondering. If I have a full Part 61 PPL, it means I can fly in controlled airspace. If I switched to an RAA certificate, would that Part 61 approval carry over?

It sure does, but you must keep your Part 61 PPL medical and AFR current to exercise the privileges on an RAA RPC in controlled airspace. CASA argue you need the medical and AFR to be safe to operate in controlled airspace. However, glider and balloon pilots can operate in controlled airspace without any CASA issued medical or Part 61 quals. Camden is a classic example of glider ops in controlled airspace without the need to hold a PPL or medical (aside from a self certified one), these ops include motor gliders. A pilot holding only RAA quals can happily operate from Camden when the tower is closed, but not when it’s active. That implies it’s safer to operate when the tower is shut?
 

 

Edited June 3, 2023 by Roundsounds

[turboplanner]

The aircraft also has to be compliant.

[old man emu]

1 hour ago, turboplanner said:

The aircraft also has to be compliant.

Of course. I was simply wondering about the pilot.

 

9 hours ago, Roundsounds said:

you must keep your Part 61 PPL medical and AFR current to exercise the privileges on an RAA RPC in controlled airspace.

So, basically you have to be a dual  aviation citizen?

 

9 hours ago, Roundsounds said:

A pilot holding only RAA quals can happily operate from Camden when the tower is closed, but not when it’s active. That implies it’s safer to operate when the tower is shut?

Yep, at 160001 the skies above Camden miraculously are swept of all dangers until 075959 the following day.

 

There are schools at Bankstown that train with RAA aircraft. Does that mean that a student on first solo has the RAA RPC qualification?

[facthunter]

I've operated into Hobart at hours where the tower is not working.  NIGHT time. It's because there's very little traffic at those times.  Licences that are Perpetual are only valid when you comply with the RELEVENT conditions for their issue. You could have say a Commercial licence but you cannot operate RAAus planes even though your BFR counts. You would have to be a member of RAAus.   Nev

[Roundsounds]

3 hours ago, old man emu said:

Of course. I was simply wondering about the pilot.

 

So, basically you have to be a dual  aviation citizen?

 

Yep, at 160001 the skies above Camden miraculously are swept of all dangers until 075959 the following day.

 

There are schools at Bankstown that train with RAA aircraft. Does that mean that a student on first solo has the RAA RPC qualification?

The RAA schools operating at Class C or D hold exemptions allowing students to solo. Once the pilot has gained their RPC they can no longer operate in CTA, more CASA logic in place. 

[facthunter]

It's a limited exemption that allows those schools to operate, as I see it.  Nev

[old man emu]

1 hour ago, Roundsounds said:

Once the pilot has gained their RPC they can no longer operate in CTA, more CASA logic in place. 

I knew that there had to be some unsound illogic at play. 

[facthunter]

They were only allowed to operate out of that airport  in any case.  Nev

[turboplanner]

2 hours ago, old man emu said:

I knew that there had to be some unsound illogic at play. 

Not at all;if you go back through the pages of this site, where a new arrival asks "which is the cheapest path to a CPL", the answer is just about always "Start in RAA" It actually adds hours, but that's another story. The flying school ups the specifications of their RAA aircraft, the student from day 1 is at least taught the environment he/she needs to learn backwards to progress to PPL, CPL and having learnt basic flying and started NAVEX, and longer flights, progresses to the faster aircraft. So the regulations that are there are reasonable and suit these people. If you think about it someone who's flow from the same small town strip will be good at flying well, better than the city people with crosswinds, but has never had to practice serious traffic threading, or constant radio traffic where you may have to wait for two or three transmissions to get your correct turn report in...and then remember what to say in a couple of seconds. So if you want to go down that route and update your airctraft, you then need some training and get qualified and the best place to start asking what to do is a city airfied Instructor or CFI where you will get the lastest, most up to date answer.

The title of this thread is a little misleading; it more correctly involves complying with some RAA rules and at the same time complying with some CASA rules.

[Roundsounds]

6 hours ago, facthunter said:

It's a limited exemption that allows those schools to operate, as I see it.  Nev

Yes, very limited indeed. Exemptions are issued to individual schools and audited on a regular basis. The exemptions require renewal along with the going fee, quite different to the GFA and Balloon Federation certificate holders. Probably logical when RAA (AUF) airplanes resembled flying clotheslines, cruised at 25 knots and were fitted with Victa Lawnmower engines.

[BrendAn]

I enquired about doing some of my raaus lessons at Moorabbin last week.  I was told to go and get a class 2 air medical before I can fly there. Even though I am raaus.

[Roundsounds]

46 minutes ago, BrendAn said:

I enquired about doing some of my raaus lessons at Moorabbin last week.  I was told to go and get a class 2 air medical before I can fly there. Even though I am raaus.

A requirement for RAAus ops, but not GFA or Hot Air Balloon pilots in Class C or D. 

[kgwilson]

I can't believe that people seemingly think this whole issue is in any way reasonable. I don't know of anywhere else in the world where such archaic and contradictory rules exist. It is overdue by about 50 years that such stupid restrictions were removed for something that resembles common sense.

[BrendAn]

3 minutes ago, kgwilson said:

I can't believe that people seemingly think this whole issue is in any way reasonable. I don't know of anywhere else in the world where such archaic and contradictory rules exist. It is overdue by about 50 years that such stupid restrictions were removed for something that resembles common sense.

Common sense is illegal in Australia . 

Edited June 4, 2023 by BrendAn

[RFguy]

Turbs had an excellent point about threading yourself into traffic
So there is a practical limit for an uncontrolled AD -  with # aircraft in circuit- what are other intensive ADs like when it comes to maximum aircraft within 3nm ? 
Come to Cowra during a busy week. Up to 7 flying school aircraft circulating within 3 nm  going different speeds (some cherokees, some twins, 182 etc) and continuous radio traffic due to proximity of other busy CTAF (Cowra really needs its own CTAF so it doesnt pollute the skies)  ...   I dont think Bankstown is any worse, except that there isnt any dead side when at Bankstown with the twin RWYs.  Problem at Cowra can be no taxiway to runway threshold, which if someone wants to get out and backtrack, that bottles things up a bit as folks slow or extend downwind etc.  I know the instructors actively limit traffic to 5 aircraft in circuit, which is fine when we are all flying PA28s. 
But we manage OK, its not often it gets really hectic where you have 2 aircraft on downwind  , 1 crosswind, 1 on base,1 climbing off the runway , someone waiting to ENTER and backtrack,  AND  just to top it all off, someone joining midfield-crosswind threading into the downwind to make 3 on downwind...and an AG plane at 100' doing a right base...AND  a GA charter coming in wanting to do a straight in ............. and perhaps a helicopter doing low level work... ("where is that aircraft ? where you want/need to call an aircraft to exactly locate it but hesitant to add even MORE radio traffic ) .  That was a true story last week....Still a fantastic AD. great approaches, a 1km grass cross,  no landing fees and no hills and good minimas and plenty of options for EFATO on all runways..

 

 

Edited June 4, 2023 by RFguy

[old man emu]

1 hour ago, RFguy said:

Problem at Cowra can be no taxiway to runway threshold,

If you look at the majority of airports in rural areas, you will find that those essential taxiways don't exist.  

[kgwilson]

I did my initial training at a controlled airport. There were about 4 international flights a day and 20 or so RPT. Helicopter training and instrument approach training plus the Aero Club with its 2 x 152, 3 x 172s, 2 x PA28-181s & a twin Comanche. There were 3 full time instructors (CFI + 2) & about 12 part time. Everything was easy as with ATC using binoculars, radio and the old ticket system.

 

Then in the 90s a British Flight Training company called CTC arrived & built a dormitory, offices & hangars & eventually had 40 odd Diamond DA20s & 40s operating. The controllers were very busy at times but it all worked well but it did mean a lot more orbits at different times for sometimes several aircraft when a Saab, ATR, 737 or A32O was on the way.

 

Everything worked and I can't remember any situations occurring.

 

This is over the top for somewhere like Cowra but maybe there is a case for CA/GRS that has been in place at Ballina for a few years now. A tower is planned for Ballina so then the CA/GRS will disappear. It would mean improved safety and situational awareness but would add landing fees.

 

 

[RFguy]

I reckon miles over the top for Cowra- there are only 'peak busy' transients...  - but a different CTAF would reduce the intense  pollution of the CTAFs  for miles around. 

[spacesailor]

The Oaks airfield only has a helicopter,  !. Occasionally practising landings . Besides you as you take-off or land .

Makes for a sudden crosswind. 

spacesailor

[old man emu]

What ever happened to Flight Service Units? There was one at Dubbo when I was a young bloke. 

 

The FSUs seemed to be able to handle briefing, flight plan acceptance and flight monitoring. 

[facthunter]

Cost cutting.  Nev