Ozrunways and Android tablets

[RFguy]

SO I've loaded Ozrunways onto a Samsung A8 64GB wifi tablet. good tablet.

But the Ozrunways Android seems very much half baked.

bugs everywhere. 

unsupported features

documentation unsuitable

same price. this is a bit piss poor. Is a Ipad the only  descent option ? glen.

[kgwilson]

I believe that Ozrunways was developed with Apples IOS and the conversion to Android that is called RWY for Android has not been done that well nor is it fully functional. IOS is Apples proprietory tool and while it is good, costs are continuous so everyone pays and pays. Android is Open Source and you can modify it as required and there are no continuous costs. Apple even tried to build in redundancy so you were forced to upgrade when they made older versions of IOS to slow down. Of course iPads are also good quality but expensive.

 

I believe that the Android version of AVplan works well. AVplan is generally preferred by GA pilots. I don't use either.

 

There are a lot of good tablets available for Android. I bought a Teclast P20HD (8GB/64GB now superceded) on line for $180.00 & it is excellent & I have a 256GB SD card in it & have all my documentation & photos on there & room for tons of stuff. iPads cannot be upgraded and do not have card slots. 

Edited June 21, 2023 by kgwilson

[RossK]

The Android version of Avplan works well and so far I haven't come across any bugs.

My only gripe is that it is also written for IOS, so the Android version misses out on features.

I get an email every wednesday informing me of all the great features of Avplan and how to use them, most of which are only available on the IOS package 😒

But for a VFR pilot, the Android version works fine, and my Samsung A7 lite is yet to overheat.

 

[Ian]

5 minutes ago, RossK said:

My only gripe is that it is also written for IOS, so the Android version misses out on features.

While I would have preferred to use the android version I found there were too many features missing for it to be viable. It's worthwhile on a phone or tablet as a backup but not the main version. However then you're dealing with two different apps.

You need to buy the more expensive ipads with a phone sim as the standard ipads don't have GPS.

I suspect it's because most older people who own planes uses apple devices.

[KRviator]

Same for me, @Ian. I have an 11-year-old iPad 2 exclusively for OzRunways, but apart from the kids iPads everything else we own runs Android. I hate the Apple mentality of them deciding they know what's good for me and having to use Itunes to load anything onto it, rather than just plugging a USB cable into my laptop and doing the drag-and-drop.

I tried AvPlan on the iPad many years back and it was far too glitchy for me, but I would be prepared to give their Android version a go at some point in the future when my iPad eventually kicks the bucket.

[Garfly]

22 minutes ago, Ian said:

I suspect it's because most older people who own planes uses apple devices.

LOL ...  Yeah, well I guess times have moved on.

(Anyway,  jeans, sneakers and T's are still the go  ;- )

 

 

[RFguy]

mmmmmm. avplan.
yeah if the documentation for RWYS Android app was separate and up to date, it wouldnt be as much of a cluster-firetruck....

Simple stuff is wrong or doesnt work, like editing the altitude in a flight plan, and you must click "Discard changes" to have the altitude numbers take hold- that sort of problem, from my point of view as a professional software developer means I should doubt ANYTHING that OZ runways presents to me that has that sort of bug. IE I can't trust the information being presented if those sorts of problems are in there. That and numerous error messages and faults when trying things described in the documentation - faulting because they're not supported is unacceptable.

Edited June 22, 2023 by RFguy

[RFguy]

has anyone been able to LODGE a flight plan with the Android version ? I get some weird hex code and ' unknown error' FFS.

[Kiwi]

I've never had the problems you described so went onto Ozrunways and yes there seems to be a few problems since the last update, won't let me change altitudes or LSALT.

Definitely has issues that weren't there last weekend. 

 

Edited June 22, 2023 by Kiwi

[Blueadventures]

1 hour ago, RFguy said:

has anyone been able to LODGE a flight plan with the Android version ? I get some weird hex code and ' unknown error' FFS.

Best to ask their IT support, send question; I'm sure they will get back to you.   Also ask question on Facelook and Bas or others will answer you.  Found them helpful in past.   One thing I would like to see is when tracking or traffic is not being received and it's activated the info box to highlighted red.

[Ian]

Essentially from Ozrunways perspective, apple is a first class citizen and android is a second class citizen.

It's a little bit the office apps on a mac or MS teams on linux. The updates are late, some features don't work and they might just stop supporting it at some point.

It's simply business, most of their users now have apple devices and their competitors are also focused on this app.

 

What might drive change is another vendor focussing on android.

 

[RFguy]

it's piss poor. the flight plan lodgement stuff is flakey. it's terrible. will try Avplan.

[Blueadventures]

1 hour ago, Ian said:

Essentially from Ozrunways perspective, apple is a first class citizen and android is a second class citizen.

It's a little bit the office apps on a mac or MS teams on linux. The updates are late, some features don't work and they might just stop supporting it at some point.

It's simply business, most of their users now have apple devices and their competitors are also focused on this app.

 

What might drive change is another vendor focussing on android.

 

When asked at a forum in Whitsundays they explained to me that the big issue is that Apple is a system and that Android is many systems with different codes.  They first write systems for Apple and then convert as best possible for Android devices and as many androids are slightly different the issues occur.  Sounds right to me.  I have purchased ipad mini for this reason to have the best version and features possible.  

[Ian]

Not really true, android has version number and device capabilities which you just target for compatibility reasons.

The reason that they target apple is that

1. That's what they're primarily familiar with, and
2. Most people who own planes are have apple phones.

To develop across both platforms requires a completely different codebase so essentially you're doing twice the work. That's not a business proposition which is particularly appealing. However it's not worth ignoring completely as a competitor might jump into that spot. So you make a half arsed effort at it, just enough to keep the competition away.

[CAV0K]

On 22/06/2023 at 10:10 AM, KRviator said:

Same for me, @Ian. I have an 11-year-old iPad 2 exclusively for OzRunways, but apart from the kids iPads everything else we own runs Android. I hate the Apple mentality of them deciding they know what's good for me and having to use Itunes to load anything onto it, rather than just plugging a USB cable into my laptop and doing the drag-and-drop.

I tried AvPlan on the iPad many years back and it was far too glitchy for me, but I would be prepared to give their Android version a go at some point in the future when my iPad eventually kicks the bucket.

I dont know anyone that uses iTunes to transfer anything. Use your icloud account and download icloud for windows. You should then be able to drag and drop as you see fit.

 

https://support.apple.com/en-au/guide/icloud-windows/icwddbc813bd/icloud

[KRviator]

2 hours ago, CAV0K said:

I dont know anyone that uses iTunes to transfer anything. Use your icloud account and download icloud for windows. You should then be able to drag and drop as you see fit.

 

https://support.apple.com/en-au/guide/icloud-windows/icwddbc813bd/icloud

Never even knew that existed. But am I right from reading your post that it still has to be installed and you logged-in on the PC you're using it from?

That'd still limit me in a lot of situations, like work PC's that are software-managed by IT

[kgwilson]

6 hours ago, Blueadventures said:

When asked at a forum in Whitsundays they explained to me that the big issue is that Apple is a system and that Android is many systems with different codes.  They first write systems for Apple and then convert as best possible for Android devices and as many androids are slightly different the issues occur.  Sounds right to me.  I have purchased ipad mini for this reason to have the best version and features possible.  

No, both IOS and Android are operating systems and both were originally based on Unix. Both generate GUI (graphical user interface) and commands using gestures. The main difference is that IOS is proprietary and only Apple products can use it. Android is Open Source so the code can be modified by hardware manufacturers & each hardware manufacturer can have a different flavour of the same version.

 

That said it does not alter the functionality of the standard version, they just add stuff to it to try and out perform competitors. When a new version of Android is released phone makers like Samsung, Xaiomi and the other hundreds of brands add their bits to it and they create apps that need their extra functionality. Other App creaters will ensure that their app runs on the standard version so it will run on any brand of android smartphone using that version.

 

Apple make sure they have control to keep prices high and they keep preaching to the converted who often have an almost fanatical loyalty to Apple even though there are plenty of Android phones that are equal or better and a lot less expensive.

 

So Oz runways are telling porkies because they don't have the expertise or development expertise in Android. I have an iPhone SE (2022 model) provided by SES. My own personal phone is a 2017 LG G6 (bought in 2019 for $270.00) The G6 was ranked as the best flagship smartphone available when it was released but LG now don't make smartphones. It is still a great phone now and runs rings around the iPhone SE. 

 

Ozrunways need to smarten up ther act because not everyone is going to continue to buy expensive iPads when there are hundreds of Android tablets available with better features for half the price.

[Blueadventures]

1 hour ago, kgwilson said:

No, both IOS and Android are operating systems and both were originally based on Unix. Both generate GUI (graphical user interface) and commands using gestures. The main difference is that IOS is proprietary and only Apple products can use it. Android is Open Source so the code can be modified by hardware manufacturers & each hardware manufacturer can have a different flavour of the same version.

 

That said it does not alter the functionality of the standard version, they just add stuff to it to try and out perform competitors. When a new version of Android is released phone makers like Samsung, Xaiomi and the other hundreds of brands add their bits to it and they create apps that need their extra functionality. Other App creaters will ensure that their app runs on the standard version so it will run on any brand of android smartphone using that version.

 

Apple make sure they have control to keep prices high and they keep preaching to the converted who often have an almost fanatical loyalty to Apple even though there are plenty of Android phones that are equal or better and a lot less expensive.

 

So Oz runways are telling porkies because they don't have the expertise or development expertise in Android. I have an iPhone SE (2022 model) provided by SES. My own personal phone is a 2017 LG G6 (bought in 2019 for $270.00) The G6 was ranked as the best flagship smartphone available when it was released but LG now don't make smartphones. It is still a great phone now and runs rings around the iPhone SE. 

 

Ozrunways need to smarten up ther act because not everyone is going to continue to buy expensive iPads when there are hundreds of Android tablets available with better features for half the price.

Thanks KG.  I hate my Iphone 13,  was a Samsung user before retirement last July.  Only got Iphone for Ozrwy and my wife and daughter have Iphones.   I should have bought the Samsung 22.  It is a shame all feature upgrades don't occur quickly on androids.

[IBob]

Yep. A couple of years back I had some simple RWY questions, and was very impressed by the prompt response and follow through.

I was also told they had lost their Android developer but would be getting RWY up to speed soon.

 

Just recently I had an issue with my uAvionix Ping occasionally dropping out, sent off an email and got a generic and nonspecific response days later.
In the interim I had sorted my problem by messing with the Android settings (and somewhat contrary to the brief how-to on their website), relayed that back to them FYI and got a response to say 'Yes, that would work'. I came away with the sense that whoever I was dealing with had no Android insight.

[CAV0K]

4 hours ago, KRviator said:

Never even knew that existed. But am I right from reading your post that it still has to be installed and you logged-in on the PC you're using it from?

That'd still limit me in a lot of situations, like work PC's that are software-managed by IT

Yeah from what I understand you will need to install and log in (cant confirm as I am a mac user). Yeah fair call it does seem it would be restrictive on work PC's. I believe you can also access your icloud account just through a web browser but not sure if you can drag and drop into the browser.

 

Alternatively if you add your email to Apples Mail application, could can always email yourself what you need on your ipad provided they are not too large for email.. again limiting but gives you another option.

[RFguy]

Well, I tried AVPLAN on android.

lots of DIFFERENT problems. not bugs or not-working features (like RWYS Android buggy) - --, very much confusing and irritating user interface problems. Like text sizes resizing when you dont want them to, screen things being masked in portrait/landscape mode but it doesnt tell you. Non responsive GUI when some function not applicable to the mode, generally less intuitive user interface than RWYS. Seems to be stronger on flight planning, and MUCH LESS fluff than RWYS. 

I was unimpressed- I uninstalled it. 

 

[RFguy]

OK,

OZ RUNWAYS have fixed the bugs I complained about (so far) in the past 

New  is 5.3.7 apparently..

 

5.3.6 is on the play store, so a fix is in the pipeline.  

 

Well , that was pretty good.  I have forwarded another few bugs to them....

 

[coljones]

On 22/06/2023 at 6:25 PM, RFguy said:

has anyone been able to LODGE a flight plan with the Android version ? I get some weird hex code and ' unknown error' FFS.

Mine works fine.  Lodge a support request with RWY.  They are pretty responsive.

[Bosi72]

On 24/06/2023 at 7:00 AM, RFguy said:

...Like text sizes resizing when you dont want them to, screen things being masked in portrait/landscape mode but it doesnt tell you....

Probably too late, but at what feature (option) did you get text resizing?

I found some options equally counterintuitive both at Avplan and Rwys, but for these you check the videos and/or ask support.

 

(Avplan on old Samsung Note 9)

 

[Kiwi]

15 hours ago, RFguy said:

OK,

OZ RUNWAYS have fixed the bugs I complained about (so far) in the past 

New  is 5.3.7 apparently..

 

5.3.6 is on the play store, so a fix is in the pipeline.  

 

Well , that was pretty good.  I have forwarded another few bugs to them....

 

Updated this morning, went for a fly and all seems ok.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Kiwi