Class 5 medical declaration. My experience

[Kyle Communications]

Rodger thats also the same for a std MV licence holder let alone any of the other CASA licences

 

[walrus]

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Posted June 4

If you have a crash and it’s determined you didn’t declare a (known) condition that contributed to the accident, irrespective of whether you’re flying on a Class 1, Class 2 (incl. Basic Class 2) or a Class 5 medical, you’re in strife. 

 

,,,,,Rodger thats also the same for a std MV licence holder let alone any of the other CASA licences.

 

- And that is about as likely as being nibbled to death by a duck, which is why Britain and America went for self declaration in the first place.

 

The whole medical disaster that is aeromed rests on the erroneous presumption that a medical examination is able to detect a medical condition that the pilot is not aware of that catastrophically decreases her ability to fly safely. The WHOLE POINT OF SELF DECLARATION IS THAT THE EVIDENCE DEMONSTRATES THAT THIS FOLK BELIEF IS BULLSHIT.

 

The experience shows that pilots are the best judges of whether they are medically sound or not. That does not mean they are perfect, but that they are streets ahead of the medical profession, and that they can and do accuratey certify  their own fitness to fly every time they take the controls.

 

AhHa! you say, but what about drugs, alcohol and  mental illness? The answer to that one is that the medical profession will be the very LAST to detect such conditions.

 

Please please also do not confuse a medical condition that is dangerous to the long term health of a pilot with a medical condition that is going to render them unfit to fly. For example what CASA considers is excessive alcohol use.

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[turboplanner]

3 hours ago, walrus said:

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Posted June 4

If you have a crash and it’s determined you didn’t declare a (known) condition that contributed to the accident, irrespective of whether you’re flying on a Class 1, Class 2 (incl. Basic Class 2) or a Class 5 medical, you’re in strife. 

 

,,,,,Rodger thats also the same for a std MV licence holder let alone any of the other CASA licences.

 

- And that is about as likely as being nibbled to death by a duck, which is why Britain and America went for self declaration in the first place.

 

The whole medical disaster that is aeromed rests on the erroneous presumption that a medical examination is able to detect a medical condition that the pilot is not aware of that catastrophically decreases her ability to fly safely. The WHOLE POINT OF SELF DECLARATION IS THAT THE EVIDENCE DEMONSTRATES THAT THIS FOLK BELIEF IS BULLSHIT.

 

The experience shows that pilots are the best judges of whether they are medically sound or not. That does not mean they are perfect, but that they are streets ahead of the medical profession, and that they can and do accuratey certify  their own fitness to fly every time they take the controls.

 

AhHa! you say, but what about drugs, alcohol and  mental illness? The answer to that one is that the medical profession will be the very LAST to detect such conditions.

 

Please please also do not confuse a medical condition that is dangerous to the long term health of a pilot with a medical condition that is going to render them unfit to fly. For example what CASA considers is excessive alcohol use.

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Don't think I would have written that Sunny; social media posts are evidence.

[Red]

1 hour ago, turboplanner said:

Don't think I would have written that Sunny; social media posts are evidence.

In this instance evidence of what?, having an opinion?

[turboplanner]

2 hours ago, Red said:

In this instance evidence of what?, having an opinion?

Just let it all play out; we're starting to get theories on theories.

You have to declare any known medical issues; it's as simple as that.

[facthunter]

Even when you have done the full medical at the highest level you MUST notify the CASA IF you get some other issue that would affect your ability to fly and when you recover. Nev

[walrus]

Yes turbo, but I you miss the point; I am not a scofflaw. The evidence demonstrated that  accidents attributable to medical conditions nominated and detectable by the medical profession are vanishingly small in number therefore the entire prgram has been and remains a total waste of  time.

 

This is not to say that there are not accidents caused by gross medical conditions (alcohol, tiredness, stress., etc., etc,) but that such conditions are detectable and best managed by a pilot and that the Doctors will be the last to know.

 

The saddest submission to the consultation was from an obvious Avmed apparatchik who opined that there were thousands of pilots hiding dangerous medical conditions from creatures such as himself and that surveillance must be increased to detect these malefactors. Once again he ignored the evidence; if both allegations were true: hiding conditions and conditions cause accidents, then there should be a continuous background "noise" of medically related accidents - and there aren't.

 

Certificate 5 rules are crap compared to the British ones anyway. I particularly disliked the crap on neurological condtions - alleging that sufferer could not be trusted to recognise their own conditions. This is especially troubling considering that many such conditions take years and years to be pronounced enough to make a firm diagnosis.

 

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[facthunter]

Dehydration and food poisoning  are to be avoided. . stress ECG's  prove little and often bring a heart attack on about 12 days after it's done. IF some doctor says do one get a 2nd opinion BEFORE doing it.  If you can't talk when you walk or puff easily, go see a cardiologist without delay  Read up on heart EVENT symptoms   Drink more water even at night. Nev

[derekliston]

I had a heart attack 10+ years ago which was fixed with a single stent. Since then I have had not one iota of pain, breathlessness or fatigue which could be health related. So consider please, pre-heart attack when I was effectively an accident waiting to happen, my DAME was happy to sign me off every two years and Aeromed happily accepted that! Post heart attack they have required me to have a medical plus a stress echocardiogram annually. For ten years I have passed with flying colours, but that doesn’t affect their requirement! So I have the extra expense every year on an already expensive hobby! I have decided that CASA and Aeromed have finally won and I am going to give up flying!

[skippydiesel]

Hi Deek,

 

I hope you wont give up flying.

 

I understand your frustration - the problem is you are bringing logic/reasonable & substantiated argument to the debate.

 

Unfortunatly bureaucracies & politicians (servants of the people?)  have great difficulty with making informed decisions, that may not quite conforme to the "rules" at hand - "Computer Says NO!"

 

If not already tried, I suggest contacting your local MP.  Formally, request him/her to intercede on your behalf. Be sure to have all communication in writing. For face:face and phone conversations ALWAYS follow up with a letter (email) confirming the salient points/agreement discussed. Keep a record/file of all communications, with names/times & dates.

 

The written word has real power, with public servants. Verbiage can always be denied, alternative understandings made.😈

[facthunter]

Politicians can't interfere in  such matters and avmed may see your actions as hostile. Stress ECGS can Cause heart attacks often about 10 days after.. The older you are the more risky the procedure is. How successful a stent is long term depends on your lifestyle and how blocked your arteries are.  Nev

[derekliston]

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

Politicians can't interfere in  such matters and avmed may see your actions as hostile. Stress ECGS can Cause heart attacks often about 10 days after.. The older you are the more risky the procedure is. How successful a stent is long term depends on your lifestyle and how blocked your arteries are.  Nev

Point taken Nev, every year that test gets harder. I’m 77 this year and will probably see if I can do it, not because I want to keep flying, but I’m not getting any interested buyers and I don’t want the plane sitting deteriorating!

[skippydiesel]

I do not agree with "Politicians can't interfere in  such matters...."  Australia may be a very flawed democracy, but it's still a democracy. Polly's are our servants. We elect/pay politicians to lead & represent us. If you genuinely have a case, not just having a whing, go for it!!!!!

 

While this may be a little overly optimistic, get a polly in your corner if you don't think the bureaucracy is being fair/reasonable with you, is talking to the management/boss of the bureaucrats.

If you start down this track, be aware that you may have to get expert medical opinion ($$$?) on your side, to present to the polly as evidence.

Ultimately this will come down to one expert opinion versus another. If the outcome is not clearly in your favour - the Gov will err on the side of caution and support the bureaucratic ruling.

 

Good luck

[Arron25]

It seems that once the trigger word 'safety' is introduced the bureaucrats have free rein to impose whatever they desire, politicians bumbling along, not willing to impose Anything (regardless of purpose or incompetence) that is associated with the 'word' safety ... and with no path or process for reduction or removal (ie ASIC)

[FrankPilot]

My recent Class 5 went OK, altho’ I saw a few ways it could be improved which I fed back to them. Cheers.

[WIngsWithoutBarriers]

Got mine 1st try. No issues whatsoever.