Country Airstrip Guide. What you think?

[Moneybox]

44 minutes ago, spacesailor said:

I use "Avgas " or 98 Ron . Anything less is detrimental to my high compression VW type motor. 

I found that , leaving E10 fuel for extended periods can let the Ethanol separate. 

As I had a crook hip for longer than " Healthy " , my two vehicles were refilled once per year .

Compulsory  road worthy check l

spacesailor

 

spacesailor, If you lived in WA that problem wouldn't occur. We only have a roadworthy check on original registration of if you're picked up driving something obviously unroadworthy. Even when changing hands it's just a handful of cash and a handshake 😃 transfer is done online.

Edited 6 hours ago by Moneybox

[facthunter]

When I say "MOGAS" it's generic ie fuel sold  for motor vehicles with spark ignition. IN Brazil, Cropdusters were operated on 100% ethanol.  Nev

[onetrack]

As Turboplanner correctly states, fuel and refining standards are vastly different between the U.S. and Australia. As a general guide, Australia tends to follow European fuel standards more than anything.

 

The Americans use "octane rating" for their bowser fuels. Their bowser "octane ratings" are 87, 89, and 93 octane.

 

But U.S. "octane ratings" are calculated by averaging the RON (Research Octane Number) test result, and the MON (Motor Octane Number) test result. Some U.S. refiners even use another test called the AKI (Anti-Knock Index), and average the AKI and MON to get their octane rating.

 

Australian petrol comes in 91, 95 and 98 "octane". These grades are measured by using the RON test, ONLY - the same as the Europeans. Australian fuel standards are dictated by the Australian "Fuel Quality Standards Act 2000" legislation - which standards are regularly updated to reflect improved fuels, and lowered levels of toxic compounds. The accent in recent years has been on reducing the levels of aromatics in petrol, as well as lead reduction (since 1986).

 

The aromatics combined are referred to as BTEX - benzene, toluene, ethyl-benzene and xylene. These compounds are all regarded as toxic and carcinogenic. Benzene in particular is nasty stuff, it contaminates groundwater all too easily.

Benzene always has been a natural major constituent of petrol/gasoline, but the Australian legislation is intent on making sure refiners keep the BTEX levels down to around 25%-28%.

 

Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether (MTBE) was added to petrol/gasoline for decades as an oxygenation compound, designed to ensure complete combustion of the fuel. It was started to be removed from fuels in the 1990's, and the U.S. legislated for its eventual removal from 2005, but it is still being used as an additive in some U.S. gasolines at modest percentages.

In Australia, the level of MTBE in our petrol is only allowed to be a maximum of 1%.

 

U.S. Gasoline explained - https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/gasoline/octane-in-depth.php

 

Regulating Australian fuel quality - https://www.dcceew.gov.au/climate-change/emissions-reduction/regulating-fuel-quality#:~:text=for compliance purposes.-,Petrol,mg/kg sulfur to 2025.

 

 

 

[facthunter]

Most of our fuel is from Singapore. TAPIS?  Nev

[onetrack]

83% of our refined petrol and diesel comes from overseas. South Korea is our biggest supplier of refined fuels. I seem to recall Singapore is our biggest refined petrol supplier, and South Korea is our biggest refined diesel supplier.

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/674596/australia-petroleum-import-volume-by-country-of-origin/#:~:text=In 2024%2C South Korea was,12 thousand megaliters in imports.

[turboplanner]

47 minutes ago, facthunter said:

When I say "MOGAS" it's generic ie fuel sold  for motor vehicles with spark ignition. IN Brazil, Cropdusters were operated on 100% ethanol.  Nev

So, with OT's explanation are you going to stop using the US "Mogas"

[skippydiesel]

1 hour ago, Moneybox said:

I don't know if anybody takes the time to read previous posts but I find information in this thread quite confusing?

 

--------------------

I use  exclusively 91 RON in the last 30 years and on previous occasion 91 or 95 RON. 

 

I have never, repeat never, had a plug fouling, starting, carbon build up or any other fuel related problem, while using this grade of fuel.

 

Those that promote the use of higher RON fuels (including AvGas, WTF!!!!!) in such engines are, without so much as a sceric of credibility.

 

------------------

I have no experince and only anecdotal knowledge of using ULP in LyCons, Jab engines. My local flying school is exclusively Jab aircraft, they all run on ULP 98 RON, have done for very many years, apparently without any negative effects. My Rotax powered aircraft has a preference for 98 RON - will run on 95 RON and if needs be AvGas .

------------------

 

Perhaps I'm being a little picky but if you were trying to learn something by following this thread I doubt you'd have much success.

 

 

Fair comment.

 

I think you will find that, for the most part, the responses you have listed are in answer to a prior statemnt, by another contributor but may not be a logical continuance of the thread topic they are in.

It likly that your observation is the result of "Thread Drift" Thread Drift can be entertaining, informative, confusing and bloody frustrating,  depending on your personal perception of the drift you are reading.😈

 

 

[facthunter]

Us has entirely different terms for these things. What are you ON about Turbs?  Haven't you got something better to do?  Nev

[turboplanner]

On 20/01/2025 at 6:12 PM, NT5224 said:

Hi Team 

 

I have a question. Every year I get repeat billed by the ‘Country Airstrip Guide’ people for their  latest update. It isn’t cheap, (probably upwards of $50) and they don’t make it easy to unsubscribe. 
 

But as far as I can tell there are very few updates and differences year to year. So you keep paying  for the same document on repeat.

 

Furthermore, the ‘pilots touring guide’ that comes packaged in Ozrunways seems to contain virtually identical information and Ozrunways  itself provides the airstrip  diagrams.

 

Can anybody explain  to me what is the advantage of a subscription to the Country Airstrip guide? How does it compare with the pilot touring guide, and is it worth having both? Maybe there’s something I’m not getting…

 

Cheers 

 

Alan 

 

 

A subscription to ERSA may cost a lot less, and with ERSA you get updates.

 

 

[turboplanner]

4 hours ago, RossK said:

Mogas 98 at Tyabb

And Ross is that the genuine Mogas or has someone icorrectly labeled the pump?

[skippydiesel]

Onetrack,

I have to call you out on this statement:

 

"................fuel and refining standards are vastly different between the U.S. and Australia.

 

You are clearly the expert on Australian fuel BUT  "vastly diffrent" ???  if this is correct, how can the same engine run equally happily on either Australian or US petrol??😈
 

Edited 4 hours ago by skippydiesel

[facthunter]

MOGAS in this instance is a BRAND NAME just to add to the confusion. Google it, but it was mentioned.    Jack Vevers. (Vev, when he posted here), worked as a fuels technologist. I'm not suggesting any connection to the Brand but I think he would pick a supplier he knows is OK.. Nev

[turboplanner]

2 hours ago, Moneybox said:

I don't know if anybody takes the time to read previous posts but I find information in this thread quite confusing?

 

--------------------

I use  exclusively 91 RON in the last 30 years and on previous occasion 91 or 95 RON. 

 

I have never, repeat never, had a plug fouling, starting, carbon build up or any other fuel related problem, while using this grade of fuel.

 

Those that promote the use of higher RON fuels (including AvGas, WTF!!!!!) in such engines are, without so much as a sceric of credibility.

------------------

I have no experince and only anecdotal knowledge of using ULP in LyCons, Jab engines. My local flying school is exclusively Jab aircraft, they all run on ULP 98 RON, have done for very many years, apparently without any negative effects. My Rotax powered aircraft has a preference for 98 RON - will run on 95 RON and if needs be AvGas .

------------------

 

Perhaps I'm being a little picky but if you were trying to learn something by following this thread I doubt you'd have much success. 

The fuel you use in your engine should NEVER be chosen from a social media platform; NEVER.

If your engine stops, you are going down and several people who commented on this site, are no longer with us to emphasise that point.

Manufacturers list fuel and oil specifications. They are based on failures per 100 engines, so the manufacturer's recommendation will give you potentially the longest life.

It's quicker to get an answer from the manufacturer (not the dealer, because the dealer may get tangled up in the same things as social media posters), than is is to try to pick a winner from  the posts.

That's the engine.

Some car manufacturers will sign off their engines for Ethanol, but they note that they are doing that after signing off the whole car - everywhere the fuel sits or goes.

So, for example, If Rotax sign off on ethanol in an engine, that doesn't mean you can use methanol, unless you've gone through every item when the fuel sits or moves to ensure every component is ethanol-proof. No good having an Ethanol-approved engine if it's sucking up a soup of molten plastics and shuts down.

As some have mentioned, in selecting a fuel on the market for your country, the RON rating has to also meet the engine specification. 

And as a guide, whenever you see someone say "I use X", bin the information, unless he adds, after dyno testing 153 engines with this exact same specifications. I can remember one poster here who would post the engine he used and argue they were totally reliable if you did x, Y, and z. (which cost around a thousand dollars. The engines still failed and so did his.

[turboplanner]

35 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

Onetrack,

I have to call you out on this statement:

 

"................fuel and refining standards are vastly different between the U.S. and Australia.

 

You are clearly the expert on Australian fuel BUT  "vastly diffrent" ???  if this is correct, how can the same engine run equally happily on either Australian or US petrol??😈
 

I'll give you an example; Australia was not able to introduce a CO2 emission level (so Australian cars had no maximum enission level for CO2, like they did for NOx and PM), because fuel quality plays a big role in CO2 test results. 

You could build a very efficient engine, but the fuels being imported into Australia were so bad that we couldn't get stable CO2 results. In the finish the automotive industry and the fuel industry got together and made an agreement on the standard of fuel which would be imported into Australia goinng forward and it's that agreement that allows Australian suppliers to quote a CO2 output.

 

A second example was diesel distillate where the imported standard being sold in Australia was one of the lowest in the world.

[onetrack]

1 hour ago, skippydiesel said:

Onetrack,

I have to call you out on this statement:

 

"................fuel and refining standards are vastly different between the U.S. and Australia.

 

You are clearly the expert on Australian fuel BUT  "vastly diffrent" ???  if this is correct, how can the same engine run equally happily on either Australian or US petrol??😈
 

I've never claimed to be an expert on fuels, I merely summarise what I know, have used, and have read. Engines will run happily on a wide range of fuels, as evidenced by the old "petrol-kero" engines.

 

When I say refining standards are vastly different between the U.S. and Australia, I'm talking about fuel standards specifications, additives allowed, and octane ratings determined.

 

U.S. fuels vary more widely in constituents as compared to Australian fuels, and many chemical additives were added to U.S. fuels that would not be approved in Australia.

 

For many decades, there were no controls whatsoever on what went into U.S. gasoline. Only diesel in the U.S. had a fuel standard, ASTM D975, introduced in 1931.

Gasoline in the U.S. did not receive a specific ASTM fuel standard until 1988 (ASTM-D4814). The first attempts to regulate gasoline in the U.S. came with the Clean Air Act of 1970, and gasoline fuel conformity standards were not formulated until a Motor Fuels Task Force was appointed in 1984, which task force brought in set fuel standards, several years later.

 

Basic Australian fuel standards were in place by the 1950's, and have been regularly updated since that time. But fuel grade wasn't included in those historical standards, and lower octane ratings than the U.S. were acceptable. The biggest change to Australian Fuel Standards came in 1986 with the elimination of lead in petrol - and the total revision of the Australian Fuel Standards in 2000 set the tone for improved fuel quality.

 

Edited 3 hours ago by onetrack
addendum for clarity...

[skippydiesel]

Onetrack,

 

 I think I said "how can the same engine run equally happily on either Australian or US petrol"  - "happily" in this context means without apparent problem/loss of efficiency. If the fuel was "vastly" diffrent I doubt the engine would be happy. 

 

40 odd years ago my boss had a very high performance Fiat (can't remember the model). He pinched what he thought was petrol from the farm bowser - diesel. The car somehow traveled about 5k before he realised there was a problem. When I got the call for help, arrived some 20 minutes later, the car was still sort of running - wouldnt turn off. We used to call this "dieseling" proving your point,  that a high compression spark ignition engine, can start on petrol and continue on diesel (or shandy theroff). We got the engine stopped. The internal damage to the engine rendered the any thought of repairs uneconomic - I would not say it ran happily.

 

I would categorise your knowledge, in particular the historical developments, as being far greater than mine , if not expert than not far off.

 

Despite your superior knowledge, I still dont think whatever regulatory additive differences there are between US & Au petrol, the practical differences are minor resulting in no discernable (to the user) performance differences.

I do understand that the colder parts of the US & the World, have winter fuel formulations, to cope with the very low temperatures - this could be another topic in itself, does not have much application in AU.

[spacesailor]

So after a lot of toing & froing. 

what will I call the petrol  , that I put into my aircraft's fuel tank , other than " Avgas " .

98 Ron ( octane ) .

spacesailor

[facthunter]

Some of those early unleaded fuels were dreadful . One of them left everything with a PINK colour.   Valve seats recessed. nev

[facthunter]

 space "Fuel for my Plane".   Nev

[Moneybox]

Some of the old Ferguson tractors would start on petrol and then switch to kerosine and those engines worked hard and lasted forever. I guess some fuel requirements are overstated a bit. Good marketing to get us paying premium prices.

[kgwilson]

As I remember when the first unleaded fuels were released there were many older cars that were not supposed to be run on unleaded fuel and there were a number of additives to replace the lead to provide what they called upper cylinder lubricant. Now of course that is history and new vehicles will have recommended fuels with higher compression engines requiring 98 RON, some 95 RON and the more basic engines using 91 . Most European cars require 95 or 98. Europe has the highest fuel standards in the world. Until recently Australia had the lowest (in fact we had no fuel efficiency standards at all) & were on a par with Russia. New standards for new cars were made law from 1/1/25.

[onetrack]

Well Skippy, running a petrol engine on diesel, or a diesel engine on petrol is certainly not going to make them "run happily", they are vastly different fuels for each engine, and serious damage results in each case.

Diesel has a cetane rating, petrol has an octane rating, and the ratings are the polar opposites of each other. Octane rating is the fuels resistance to detonation, cetane rating is how easily diesel burns. When I said, "run happily", I meant within the context of the fuel type used in the correct engine.

 

My brother ran short of diesel on our minesite once, and needed to go to Kalgoorlie in his Landcruiser (HJ60 diesel turbo). He found a drum of lighting kerosene, nearly filled the Landcruiser with it, and then mixed in about 10% engine lubricating oil.

The Landcruiser ran like a dream on that mix, so he continued to use up all the lighting kero in the same manner, as we had no need of it any more anyway (the kero fridge we had blew up and caught fire, and burnt a cabin to the ground, but that's another story!)

[turboplanner]

20 minutes ago, Moneybox said:

Some of the old Ferguson tractors would start on petrol and then switch to kerosine and those engines worked hard and lasted forever. I guess some fuel requirements are overstated a bit. Good marketing to get us paying premium prices.

The engines and carburtors were designed for that.

With a kero tractor you would get the best result by turning the kero off and just as the engine stuttered, turning the petrol on so it ran on the petrol and kero residue. Start the next morning was instant on petrol and when the engine was warm the taps were reveresed; petrol off, Kero on.

 

On the diesel tractors the fuel cutout was pulled at the end of the day. The next morning the decompression lever was pulled up, throttle to idle and the engine started on petrol for 3 or 4 minutes then both levers were slammed down for a spectactular roar in the bigger models and you were ready for work.

 

It was a nuisance filling with two fuels, and that process was followed by the dedicated diesel where glow plus in each cylinder were held on for 30 seconds or so and there was enough heat to fire the diesel.

 

However, this interchangeability of fuels is a red herring. As a pilot your issue is an engine failure.

 

So your concern is what causes an engine failure and using fuel other than that specified by the manufacturer is the start of where you don't want to go. You may be lucky and get a No Start, so no crash. You may not and get a blockage in the fuel line, the carb, of if fuel injected, in enough injectors to stop the engine.

Edited 1 hour ago by turboplanner

[Freizeitpilot]

To answer the OPs question,I believe the answer is no - there is little value in renewing the country airstrips guide each year.

if you have a lot of spare time, you can collate your desired information from a combination of apps, such as Ozrunways / Avplan and then add petrol spy and maybe wikicamps…..and then Facebook groups such as Plan, Land and Stay.

 

 

[facthunter]

Nicely on topic.

       Kero tractors are the same as petrol ones but with lower compression and often chromed bores and an extra heating type Inlet manifold. to vapourise the Kero. They therefore give considerably less power and only made sense where kero was cheap. They commonly suffered from Oil dilution as well rendering the oil too thin and  requiring replacement.  Nev