Abolish ASIC

[skippydiesel]

Reference ; Trying to get  the need for  private pilots to hold an ASIC card , for access to to small rural Security Controlled Airports, abolished

 

I have written to RAA - Got a two nice replies from Maxine (CEO)  - in summary,  total abdication of their representative function.  Advised to contact local member.

 

Have written to local member - as expected no response. If this changes will advise accordingly.

 

The reality is, any politician contacted about this matter, is likly to do the vote maths v risk  and decide its not worth their time.

 

31,000(?) private pilots , spread over the entire country, do no represent a significant lobby UNLESS their representative organisations take up the cause.

 

"'She'll - be -  right - mate" (apathy) rules the day😈

 

[facthunter]

 You've been told that before. You're flogging a Dead horse. I don't like it either/ It doesn't even count points towards a Passport being issued.  RAAus represents the CASA  Only something LIKE AOPA can do anything. . Nev

[Headwind]

18 hours ago, facthunter said:

 You've been told that before. You're flogging a Dead horse. I don't like it either/ It doesn't even count points towards a Passport being issued.  RAAus represents the CASA  Only something LIKE AOPA can do anything. . Nev

Like AOPA, but not AOPA? AOPA seems to bugger all. 

[facthunter]

There's no one else so you're up that Creek without a paddle. Nev

[spacesailor]

Except for " licensing " what is the difference between CASA & RaA .

1.  Insurance,  any difference in the two  agencies.  

Could CASA ' MAKE ' A loophole for any members willing to be under CASA.  spacesailor

Edited Saturday at 03:53 AM by spacesailor

[facthunter]

CASA doesn't insure aircraft or pay for it unless they Operate it. . Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

Thanks, @skippydiesel - I know others are bored by it, but it is a fundamental right to express discourse at government policy, and continue to do so if you feel wronged. Of course, this is a private forum and those entrusted with moderation can close it down, but I knew what this was before I clicked into the thread, and if I was that affronted by it, I simply wouldn't have clicked.

 

But, I agree with Nev.. so far, you have pursued both organisational and direct representation. For some reason, the organisations have decided not to pursue - maybe they have been told it is flogging a dead horse by the relevant department (it's not CASA, but some other department that is responsible).

 

But that doesn't mean you (or anyone else who feels passionately wronged) should give up. What are your options? Here's a couple that may or may not be pragmatic:

• Go to the press. This is unlikely to be a vote winner of any consequence, so the bigger outlets are unlikely to take it on, esp during a federal election, but try some nice journals that are complimentary to aviation such as the yachties ones, gun runners, and the like.. Cross pollination can help.. Also, look for a situation that has occurred where the ASIC resulted in some hardship, especially disproportionate to the risk it is supposedly mitigating.. did someone crash and die in deteriorating weather by possibly making a decision to divert to a non-ASIC required aerodrome when an ASIC one would have been better (look up Strasser scheme in the UK, where Strasser managed to convince regional RPT airports in the UK to waive extortionate fees in the case of real emergencies as pilots were crashing and dying as a result of diverting to less suitable airfields).
• Go on Social media - YT, Tick Tock and the like and do the press thing yourself. You would be surprised at how much of a following you can get if it resonates. And with a following, you become the representative.
• Find a pollie that is in some way affected by it and lobby that politician. GA were complaining here for years at the erosion of their plight to all sorts of pollies until someone realised the one they should be complaining to is the one that has a PPL (Grant Schapps).. Next thing, he is a senior minister with a portfolio over the CAA and things did improve slightly. Yes, Dick Smith tried it at the helm, but he wasn't an elected pollie.
• Maybe join one of the major political parties (the one more likely than not to be in government - regardless of your affiliations) and try and engineer change from within. Again, this is not a vote winner, so this will probably not yield great results for the effort.
• Go streaking across your nearest international airport with a banner saying stop asic at regional airports. You can be guaranteed some publicity (and a few nights in jail - so maybe take this one in the way it is intended - not an incitement). But, you can organise protests...

 

Seriously, you are fighting a big machine that saw points in implementing it and very few points in removing it. There are many on here (myself included) that support your position. But even collectively, that is not a large number and we are already converted.. Need to preach to the unconverted with as many converted visible as possible. It will be a long process.

 

Edited Saturday at 07:35 AM by Jerry_Atrick

[skippydiesel]

My faith in humanity is restored - Thanks Jerry_ Atrick.

 

Seems to me that Australians are particularity uninterested in fighting for their rights " she'll - be -right - mate".

 

I am not against having my rights infringed/reduced, where it can be demonstrated that there is a greater good .

 

ASIC not only infringes my rights without a demonstrable benefit BUT also costs me (all of us) as a taxpayer. 

 

Australia has the unenviable reputation of being one of the World's' least democratic democracies - ASIC is just a small example of this.

 

It seem that private plots (on this Forum) are quite content with this double rort - if they weren't then their voices would be heard by RAA (our representative body) and something would have to be done, but noooo, all toooo  hard. The fact  is, no one/or organisation has made a significant effort to get this crap law modified. so that it does not apply to small rural airports.😈

 

[spacesailor]

"CASA does not insure aircraft"

But we do need insurance from some company. 

so is it cheaper for a Raa  Jabiru ' or an equally appointed ' Vh jabiru ' ,

Seems a simple question .

spacesailor

 

[RossK]

Skip, I don't think anyone here thinks the ASIC has any real merit, it's just the system we have.

That being said, you might get more traction with the RAAus Board members rather than the CEO, they are our elected officials.

The CEO is just there to implement the wishes of the Board.

[skippydiesel]

56 minutes ago, RossK said:

Skip, I don't think anyone here thinks the ASIC has any real merit, it's just the system we have.

That being said, you might get more traction with the RAAus Board members rather than the CEO, they are our elected officials.

The CEO is just there to implement the wishes of the Board.

 

" ......it's just the system we have."

 

No offence RossK but I am appalled by this statement. None of us should settle for a bad system or part thereof.

 

".......more traction with the RAAus Board members....."

 

Thanks for that advice. I actually wrote to RAA, assuming that correspondence is readout & discussed at Board Meetings (as per standard Club/Organisation practice). The response I received was from Maxine CEO. I am now wondering if the response is her position or RAA's position😈

 

[RossK]

19 hours ago, skippydiesel said:

 

" ......it's just the system we have."

 

No offence RossK but I am appalled by this statement. None of us should settle for a bad system or part thereof.

 

 

I don't like the system either, it's just I have other "fish to fry" that occupy my time.

It's about picking the battles that I'm likely to succeed in.

[jackc]

20 hours ago, skippydiesel said:

 

" ......it's just the system we have."

 

No offence RossK but I am appalled by this statement. None of us should settle for a bad system or part thereof.

 

".......more traction with the RAAus Board members....."

 

Thanks for that advice. I actually wrote to RAA, assuming that correspondence is readout & discussed at Board Meetings (as per standard Club/Organisation practice). The response I received was from Maxine CEO. I am now wondering if the response is her position or RAA's position😈

 

I would allege any correspondence from Maxine, would be penned by others, I can guess who but won’t name them.

A reply I received from Maxine, in good faith was worded exactly as I would expect from a certain person.

It would be horrible sad if she goes down with the ship, if it all turns pear shaped.

But I hope the man in question?  He deserves to end up living in a Bunnings Tent, his history precedes him.

[skippydiesel]

5 hours ago, RossK said:

I don't like the system either, it's just I have other "fish to fry" that occupy my time.

It's about picking the battles that I'm likely to succeed in.

I acknowledge that your can't be bothered approach, is in the majority - thats why nothing will be done!

 

I am sad that neither you or your majority friends, care to even try to correct this wrong.

 

All you have to do is put pressure on our representative body (RAA)  to put this matter "in the book" & keep it there, until is satisfactorily resolved.😈

[Red]

On 12/04/2025 at 9:39 AM, skippydiesel said:

 

Australia has the unenviable reputation of being one of the World's' least democratic democracies

 

 

Pardon the selective quoting but I've never heard anyone express that before

You rank better than us here in the UK for a start

 

https://www.democracymatrix.com/ranking

[coljones]

32 minutes ago, skippydiesel said:

I acknowledge that your can't be bothered approach, is in the majority - thats why nothing will be done!

 

I am sad that neither you or your majority friends, care to even try to correct this wrong.

 

All you have to do is put pressure on our representative body (RAA)  to put this matter "in the book" & keep it there, until is satisfactorily resolved.😈

Rather presumptuous - this isn't RAAs fault.

It might be better to beat up on your local member of parliament - they enacted ASIC - they are the roadblock

[skippydiesel]

3 hours ago, coljones said:

Rather presumptuous - this isn't RAAs fault.

It might be better to beat up on your local member of parliament - they enacted ASIC - they are the roadblock

Coljones,

 

Those of us who are financial members of RAA, have a reasonable expectation, that the organisation will represent the memberships aspirations and concerns,  to whatever authority is deemed appropriate.

 

RAA has done this with the aircraft  Max weight increase and are in the process of achieving entry to CTA - good stuff for those who wish to take advantage of these changes..

 

If we expect this sort of representation, what is so hard/unreasonable about taking on ASIC, as it applies to private pilots wishing to access Security Controlled small regional airports?

 

As for individuals approaching their parliamentary  representative - "Snowflake's Chance in Hell" of getting any action through this mechanism -I didnt even get a reply to my letter to my member.

 

Ennui reigns supreme 😈

 

[RossK]

18 hours ago, skippydiesel said:

I acknowledge that your can't be bothered approach, is in the majority - thats why nothing will be done!

 

I am sad that neither you or your majority friends, care to even try to correct this wrong.

 

All you have to do is put pressure on our representative body (RAA)  to put this matter "in the book" & keep it there, until is satisfactorily resolved.😈

Skip, I'm sad that you get on here and lambast those that are busy doing other things more important to them than to spend time fixing your complaint.

If ASIC is really that offensive to you, how about you do something real about it. Jerry Attrick has given you sound advice, and I agree, there are many that would support you.

But, you need to lead the push, don't expect others to fix your problems for you.

You've built a plane, you can do this if you set your mind to it.

 

 

[rodgerc]

It’s been suggested in the media that The Member for Kennedy may be a king maker in the coming weeks…..He loves an “issue”…..Does anyone here live in Kennedy?

[skippydiesel]

5 hours ago, RossK said:

Skip, I'm sad that you get on here and lambast those that are busy doing other things more important to them than to spend time fixing your complaint.

If ASIC is really that offensive to you, how about you do something real about it. Jerry Attrick has given you sound advice, and I agree, there are many that would support you.

But, you need to lead the push, don't expect others to fix your problems for you.

You've built a plane, you can do this if you set your mind to it.

 

 

I apologise if my frustration has been a tad obvious.

 

One BIG POINT this is not "my complaint" it affects all private pilots, particularly those who wish to tour (as I do) in Australia.

 

AND as an infringement, for no good reason, on all our civil liberties - the right not to be burdened/subject to unreasonably restriction is part of our law (constitution ? common law?).

 

The impact of the unreasonable/ineffective ASIC,  is on a very small percentage of the population, so will garner little interest from the politicians, media and the public at large. Of the latter, there is a common misconception, that people who fly for fun, are the rich elite, so little sympathy will come from that direction.

 

The only hope is that RAA and similar organisation, will take up the good fight and have this stupid law rescinded.😈

Edited 14 hours ago by skippydiesel

[facthunter]

You are talking to the converted here. Meanwhile, Get on with your life. It's a lot better than GAZA, Ukraine and Sudan.  Nev