Guest Macnoz Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Step right up folks! The last of the myths now On the weekend during a type conversion I was reminded of one to the earliest tricks I was introduced to but could never seem to discover myself – “the step†I spent many a pound, punt, euro and several different denominations of dollar chasing this magical plateau but failed to ever experience it to my knowledge or awareness. Well on Saturday, unknown to myself I was in this utopia of aeronautical mojo but then lost it as advised by my CFI after a short descent to avoid a CTA step. He suggested that it would be nice to get back on it by increasing power again and leaving it on while I levelled out. I wonder how many more of us are out there chasing this mythical creature and propagating its existence in folklore. Come on someone and prove to me that it exists and don’t get it confused with either the “drag bucket,†or being on the “backside of the power curveâ€
Guest pelorus32 Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 It's a furphy...about the only aircraft that get up on the step are those that take off from the sea. Getting up on the plane on their floats or hull is also called getting up on the step. Of course they leave the step when they take off :clown: Regards Mike
Guest High Plains Drifter Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Heard of it but never been able to achieve it in what I've flown - just put it down to poor piloting skills... One of my spam cans did something simular - just sideways. In cruise if I noted the ball out to one side a little, a touch of correcting rudder would put the ball out the other side where it would happily stay. Basicly the aircraft is happy to fly in a slight slip in either direction ? i_dunno .
Matt Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Can someone enlighten us as to what "the step" refers to? Sounds similar to an experience I've had a few times surfing mountain waves into and out of Canberra - increasing IAS / increasing Ground Speed / less power needed while on the "front of the wave" and decreasing IAS / decreasing Ground Speed / full power needed while on the "back of the wave". It was no furphy, you could definitely feel the effects of the air mass flowing like ocean waves.
Guest pelorus32 Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 The Step Can someone enlighten us as to what "the step" refers to? Sounds similar to an experience I've had a few times surfing mountain waves into and out of Canberra - increasing IAS / increasing Ground Speed / less power needed while on the "front of the wave" and decreasing IAS / decreasing Ground Speed / full power needed while on the "back of the wave". It was no furphy, you could definitely feel the effects of the air mass flowing like ocean waves. G'day Matt, I'm sure that what you experienced was real, it's just not what is referred to as "the step". This idea comes from the pre and post second world war airline pilots. Ernie Gann talks about it a lot. They believed that the way to get the best out of an a/c in the cruise was to set it up "on the step". This involved climbing beyond their assigned altitude then descending back onto the assigned altitude then throttling back to cruise power. The idea was that you would end up with a faster cruise speed for any given power setting than if you had simply climbed up and leveled off then throttled back and trimmed. Maybe one of our heavy metal brethren can comment on their views. I think it has been debunked and indeed I think that Wolfgang Langeweische also claims that it is a myth. Regards Mike
Bruce Robbins Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Can someone enlighten us as to what "the step" refers to? ....... Hi Matt, Ever "captained" or been for a ride in a tinnie with a little outboard motor attached? Grab said tinnie, sit yourself and Kaz up the back so you can hang onto the control arm attached directly to the outboard motor and Kaz at the same time. Start 'er up (the motor that is), point the bow out to sea and twist the throttle to the stop. The nose of the old tinnie shoots up to an angle of attack resembling the start of an aileron roll and stays there while the motor howls away and the tinnie plows along at a fabulous five knots. Let go of Kaz for a minute and ask her to go up the front of the boat and hang on. Voila, as Kaz moves the CofG forward, the nose comes down, the hull starts to plane instead of plowing, and all of a sudden you're "on the step" and belting along at twenty knots with the same power setting that was only producing five knots a minute ago. The concept can be applied also to flying. Pour on full power and set climb attitude in the old CT44 Mk33. The nose sits up in the air, the airspeed stays at some pre-defined "climb speed" and you convert fuel into noise, heat and height. Once you've reached your chosen altitude you can level out a number of ways. 1) Reduce power to cruise, lower the nose, and watch the airspeed gradually creep up towards normal cruise for that power setting. Keep re=trimming for the next two minutes as the speed increases. 2) Leave climb power set, lower the nose to what you already know is close to the normal cruise attitude, wait a few seconds while the aircraft accelerates, then reduce power once you see normal cruise airspeed. Hold attitude for a couple of seconds then trim, probably only once. 3) Overshoot desired altitude slightly, reduce power at the same time as you lower the nose, and dive down on to desired altitude. Trim. Methods 2 & 3 are what people refer to as "getting on the step". While it may be a nicer/better/faster way to level off, I don't know whether it will actually get a higher cruise speed for the same throttle setting. Some of the old-timers believed it did, and they have many more hours behind the stick than me. I tend to use and teach method two because it just seems to me to be a neat and logical way of leveling out. Cheers, Bruce
facthunter Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Step? Probably used to describe the situation where you are slower than the minimum drag speed, and consequently if you slow up further, you need more and more power. If at that point you increase speed ( by applying significantly more power, or descending ) you will, by increasing speed , get back to a situation where you need less power. The minimum drag speed is self explanatory, and is the speed where you will have the lowest fuel flow (suitable for holding). ..... Jets flying at High cruising altitudes may be only 20 or so knots above the stall, ( and only 15 below the speed at which buffetting due to compressibility, (local supersonic separation ) occurs, or less if the pilot is not very safety conscious. This close to the low speed stall boundary produces a fairly speed unstable situation, which I have tried to describe in the first para. Pilots used to describe it as "getting back on the step" and in this context, it has some relevence. Nev...
Guest Macnoz Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Im still listening but so far my money is with Mike the Myth Buster
Flyer Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 I have flown on the step once. Managed to get there by means unknown. Silky smooth air and 115kts IAS out of a warrior at 2450rpm. The instructor commended me on finding the step and then promptly gave the column a nudge and we were back to 105 kts IAS again.... What I do remember about it was that I felt like I had quite a pronounced nose down attitude and at any minute could tumble off the top of the wave.....the plane seemed to fly effortlessly too.... I believe that some Maule aircraft have negative flaps for achieving this attitute in flight and increasingtop speed.... could well be wrong on that too. I have chased the elusive step again and never found it... Regards Phil
Matt Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 Great explanation Bruce with some good supporting info from everyone else. I'd not heard of "the step" prior to today...as the saying goes - learn something new everyday...and usually one of those is from this site. I use method 2 as described by Bruce to transition from climb to cruise...not because of "the step", that's just what I was taught. Cheers, Matt.
skybum Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 I would gladly set up an experiment to prove this myth. If anyone would care to donate money to C Ash. I will happily apply my considerable skill in the final outcome to determine the correctness of this myth. I would envisage at least 100hrs in a Millenium Master type aircraft should be enough time to prove the existance of "The Step!"
Ben Longden Posted May 26, 2008 Posted May 26, 2008 If you look on the VTC, you will see the step... lots of them... Only too clearly... ;) Go over it, without The Nod and you can be sure you will hear about it from ATC....:hittinghead: But I guess thats just one sort of 'step' we can be talking about... Ben
Ardydublu Posted May 27, 2008 Posted May 27, 2008 Climbin' Stairs! Yeah, I had a lot of trouble grasping this step concept for a long time too. But then I conceptuallised climbing up a set of steps, nose up looking where I was going -- all up hill -- trudging heavily, hard work and slow. Finally when I get to the top, I can drop the nose and look ahead normally and the workload reduces dramatically. The going is easy now. I'm "on the step" Ever watched a heavily loaded aircraft dragging it's bum through the ether seemingly never able to trim into a comfortable cruise? The step is simply that nice place where the aircraft is perfectly trimmed and cruisin' sweet with minimal drag. Method 2 or 3 above is how you get there, but some people have trouble doing it.:thumb_up:
Yenn Posted May 27, 2008 Posted May 27, 2008 It is perfectly easy to get on the step. As described by Bruce Robbins. Boats do it at the interface between air and water, so to do it in a plane you have to rise through dense air then settle back from the less dense air to the dense air. The only problem is finding that sharp demarcation of densities, but I am sure that if you believe in the step you will believe in your ability to do it.
Guest Macnoz Posted May 27, 2008 Posted May 27, 2008 All I’m seeing are parables and rephrasing of the legend. So far no proof though?. The tongue in cheek answers are really good and probably indicate the dichotomy on this topic. Hands up – not off- all of you that are going to try chase the dammed elusive pimpernel when next you fly. If you find it continue on your merry way to a rainbows end for verily I say onto thee that there you will find a leprechaun and he shall hand over to thee a pot of gold
facthunter Posted May 27, 2008 Posted May 27, 2008 Observation. Macnoz, one day when you are in an introspective mood, get yourself in a low wing aeroplane and attach some tufts of wool to the top of the wing so that you can observe them while you are flying, Put them from from the trailing edge to the max thickness point, and fly the plane over a speed range. Better if it's fairly heavy. Be smooth. Clue, Eddies are persistent (Have their own inertia) and they cause drag and loss of lift. Nev..
pudestcon Posted May 27, 2008 Posted May 27, 2008 Steps, stairs- what's this talk about carpentry? Being from a carpentry background if you are on the step then you are on what's known as 'the going' (tread of the stairs or horizontal component) the vertical component of the stairs is known as the 'riser'. I've never heard of 'on the step' in aviation terms but I can say that when I'm flying I'm either climbing the stairs or decending the stairs, sometimes when my intention is to climb only:laugh: Just as in aviation the correct ratio of 'going' to 'rise' (best angle of climb-Vx) is important for safety and efficiency. Pud
John Brandon Posted May 28, 2008 Posted May 28, 2008 1. The term "on the step" generally refers to waterborne operations where an aircraft taking off or taxiing fast is using the hydrodynamic lift from the 'planing hull' [the hull portion forward of the transverse step] to support it rather than using the buoyancy of the whole 'displacement hull'. When on the step water drag is at its lowest and the centre of buoyancy is close to the step so that the pilot can rock the hull forward and back so assisting the break-out when water conditions are calm. When alighting the aim is to touch down "on the step". 2. The term "on the step" was also fashionable for a while prior to 30 or 40 years ago when people were debating the transition from climb to cruise. The thing to bear in mind in that transition is that unless you use extra power [i.e. greater than cruise power] to accelerate the aircraft from climb speed to cruise speed then it is going to take a long time to accelerate to that cruise speed normally reached at your selected engine settings. Some aircraft may just not get there if altitude is held. So normally you facilitate the acceleration by leveling off near cruise altitude, maintaining climb power until cruise speed is reached then reducing to the cruise settings. Or you can do it by extending the climb, setting cruise power and then using the potential energy of height to supply the energy for acceleration to cruise speed at cruise height. Probably the best practice [but not for passengers] is a combination of both; i.e. continuing the climb for maybe 200 feet past the required cruise altitude then pushing over enough to unload the wings a little [perhaps to 0.6 to 0.8g] so that induced drag is reduced while maintaining climb power, thereby enabling the fastest acceleration to the required cruise speed. If done nicely cruise altitude, maximum cruise speed for that setting and cruise power all come together quickly and at the same time. cheers John Brandon
poteroo Posted June 1, 2008 Posted June 1, 2008 As John has noted above, this 'step' idea was very much part of training in the 60's. My instructor could easily demonstrate that he could trim out a Cessna to fly several kts faster than I could. (He was a crusty old WW2 driver). I often try it on my students, and generally can demo 3-5kts increase in GPS g/s in the Jab 160. I'm not convinced that this isn't anything other than just the ability to more accurately setup for cruise. Once students accumulate experience - the differences narrow down. happy days,
Guest brentc Posted June 1, 2008 Posted June 1, 2008 I do it every time I fly. + 100ft on assigned, then - 100ft to build up speed and get 'onto the step.' I've been doing this ever since I can remember. Otherwise it takes forever to build up speed and in many cases you simply won't get that speed.
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