YHOX.. NO Fuel, and invisible!

[Ultralights]

Just got my updated charts, ERSA etc, only to find YHOX is no longer listed, not in ERSA, or on any charts...

 

now, my question, with regards to the Hoxton special procedures, and the mandatory 4 legs of the circuit, as YHOX is no longer listed anywhere, neither are it special procedures, so, as i understand it, it is now a standard CTAF with appropriate standard CTAF rules, such as Straight in approaches are permissible, as is joining circuit on downwind etc, no longer are we required to fly the 4 legs, joining midfield crosswind.....would this be a correct line of thinking?

 

espacially as the closure of YHOX has been delayed thurther, possibly until march 09,

 

oh, except today, the BP bowswer was removed! so bring ya jerry cans!

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Thats a good point... whats ashley gunna do when they finally do pull the pin?/ has he decided?

 

 

[Ultralights]

in a few weeks, or when the new hangar is finally finished, we will be moving to Bankstown. only the driveway, and concrete connecting the hangar apron to the taxiway need to be poured, and its complete, as for training RAAus in CTA, Ash, myself and all other instructors are GA licenced. must admit though, i am looking forward to it! all we have to do now is show the GA community, in their heartland(YSBK) just how professional RAaus pilots can be.. not to mention showing them up with our superior performance aircraft! :thumb_up:

 

 

[motzartmerv]

lol...:thumb_up:thats the way... what about student solo's??

 

ps..i have a good "learn to speak indian book" you can borrow;)

 

 

[Ultralights]

the student solo flights are still in a bit of a grey area, and CASA are on the case, (so not much real hope of it being sorted anytime soon) i think solo students might get some dispensation if they are trained in the CTA environment and are familiar with the radio procedures? but dont quote me on that.. to be honest, im not real sure, ill find out tomorrow.

 

On a side note, with lack of fuel at Hoxton, we might need to stopover at Camden to refuel before continuing on our navex's!

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Oh ok...Yea, i wouldn't be holding ya breath on the solo thing either...we just went through all this with casa...the first thing they do is ask the tower guys what they think/want....and its the same guy from camden that they will talk to..me and the chief went to bankstown to discuss it with him after he knocked it back....he's a nice bloke, but.....doesnt want ultralights in his airspace...its not som much the jabiru's....its where do they draw the line....so what came out of it was we can use the jabs in the GAAP but only with GA licenced (ppl) instructor... no RAA students solo... I reckon this could severly hamper the training of your guys....how to get area solo's up and all that...nav solo's...

 

Anyway, keep hounding them...the more noise we make the better i reckon....

 

ps...this guy was very down on RAA standards...training and all that... reckons they (we) only half trained...so i asked him if he knows whats missing from the syllabus (compared to GA) and he didn't know... so finally got him to agree it was an assumption...but,,,, that didnt change his mind....

 

awelll....what can we do....good luck with it all... we should resubmit a proposal at the same time you guys have one in....like i said, the more noise the better...;)

 

 

[Guest Ruprect]

So I take it some time next year there will be RAA school at YSBK..... But no student solo flights??

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

What is it with these people. this controller can dictate what aircraft/pilots can enter HIS airspace! RAA schools have been forced to move from a non towered airport into a controlled airport and now the controller makes the decision as to who can fly in his airspace. what a wanker. just who is running aviation in this country.??? CASA? the RAAus ? airservices? or a non pilot in a birdcage? and you lot keep paying landing fees. what a joke. tell me are they going to waive the landing fees at Camden when you drop in there to refuel before heading back to Hoxton now BP have pulled the tank there?

 

 

[motzartmerv]

I know..i know.. but if we are going to get anywhere we need to approach it with a little restraint..

 

Most of you know what im like, so you can imagine the toung biteing going on when a controller tells me that the RAA pilot standards are lacking what it takes to fly under tower control.. And to be told the training is lacking...well... there are small differances but he didn't know what they were...

 

I doubt landing fees will be waived at camden..

 

We fly the RAA Jabs in the GAAP every weekend, and flat out most of the day to, and never have we had an issue with the tower.. All we can do is be as professional as the rest of em ( which isn't difficult) and hope to change some opinions..

 

What ticks me off...Is, a bloke with thousands of hours experiance can't fly his jab in the GAAP without a PPL, but, a student pilot (GA) with 10 hours total time (or less) can fly the jab (even an RAA jab) solo while the towers active..... Whats the story???

 

The story was, that they have no problem with the way we operate...but if they say yes to us, then they fear the floodgates will open and the cct will be full of thrusters and drifters, trikes and powered chutes.. So no middle ground can be found, its just shut the bloody gate...

 

 

[Ultralights]

once the CTA endo comes into action, only then will our students be able to solo in CTA. so again, its a race against time(casa)

 

 

[motzartmerv]

So will the CTA endorsment be issued to students?? before they have a certificate to have endoresments on??....

 

 

[Guest Graham Lea]

Interesting.. if it isn't on the charts, and not in the ersa I guess it isn't licenced.

 

So how do you fly in and out of an unlicenced airport in terms of insurance? Or are ala's covered?

 

Re: Camden and Raa matters: Many years ago Ashleys school (under a different name and owner) had to move from Camden due to the probelms with CTA - esp. solos and training after that. The then owner made losts of submision etc but in the end he left.

 

I hope Bankstown doesn't got the same way. I must say that if they start making Bankstown "bigger" more RPT and freighters etc then I don't hold out much chance.

 

That will probably happen one day.

 

Graham

 

 

[Barefootpilot]

RE: Bankstown.

 

Bankstown airport Corp don't want the aviation buisness that are already on the field let alone more so they won't be much help. We looked at trying to run some RPT flights from Bankstown and they are not in the slightest way interested as it meant they would have to do more work and would not make much more money from it. Its a sad state of affair old bankstown but thats what big buisness does to small GA.

 

I wish everyone good luck with the RAA training.

 

Oh BTW PPL students are allowed to fly through CTA without a CTA endorsment as long as its approved by the instructors and they have been trained for it so why should RAA be any different... oh that right because we are just a little organisation to be left out in the back waters!!!

 

 

[Guest Brett Campany]

That's such a pity about YHOX being shut down. My grandfather taught me the basics of flying and that's where my enthusiasm for aviation really started to grow from. Flying out of the NSW Police Aero Club was always something to look forward to when I ventured over east to see the family.

 

 

[Yenn]

Reading between the lines here the real agenda becomes clear. Get rid of recreational flying and also GA recreational flying, leaving the skies clear for Commercial and RPT, then get rid of commercial and RPT and the controllers can relax, knowing that there are very few movements to worry about.

 

Or am I being too cynical. Having been involved in flying for over 40 years I think not.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

The CASA objective

 

"An empty sky, is a safe sky"

 

 

[motzartmerv]

It seems they are trying to pave the way for RPT services, but how many of these services are viable?? we keep hearing reports of more and more routes being axed..

 

With hoxton gone.. whats left??..Bankstown, camden, wedderburn..the oaks.. Bankstown is out for RAA guys ( without a ppl) and so is camden on weekends....gggrrrllll

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

The RAAF say they need a base at Richmond for fast deployment of troops. maybe the RAAF should be moved to Holesworthy to save on the long drive for the troops and Recreational flying takes over Richmond..

 

Ozzie

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Whats that dissused strip SE of richmond, just inside the CTR zone??

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

Is it schofields or the old castleraigh drag strip that was a strip long ago?

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Not sure... looks a good length but.. bit of grass growing through it...but nothing some roundup wouldn't fix..hehe

 

 

[Guest Graham Lea]

Scholfields went the way of Hoxton years ago for the same reason as Hoxton. Government giving away a perfecly good airfield for nothing due in part to pressure from the new neighbours who didn't like the noise.

 

It certainly won't re-open.

 

A couple of years ago I went there to see if there was any possibility but it just won't happen.

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

there is a railway line at one end of the schofields strip. Some pollie wanted to set it up a a frieght hub due to the proximity of the rail line. the old navy base that the strip was originally part of is now a uni. When i was maintaining the SFC's warriors i found several holes in the tail of two of them, found some lead around the holes. turned out a market gardener was taking pot shots with a 22 at them as they came in to land. some people just born stupid.

 

Ozzie

 

 

[Guest Graham Lea]

>Quote:.. whats left??..Bankstown, camden, wedderburn..the oaks.. Bankstown is out for >RAA guys ( without a ppl) and so is camden on weekends....gggrrrllll

 

From my experience, Wedderburn is a no go at any time. I had a mate had an EFTO, ended up up side down in the trees got out ok, but never flew again. Mike Smith took off, had a probelm and the four of them died. Mike had heaps of hours on S&R type stuff.

 

I was a member there for a year or so and had to pay for not going to clean ups of the airfield. MInd you, it was always kept neat and clean. Driving there was a problem though. even the 4x didn't like it!

 

The Oaks is a great place but not for heavy use due to a grass strip and weather (rain and wind) and they would not want it for lots of outsiders I would think. I probably did the first couple of hundred hours out of there so know it well.

 

Graham

 

 

[Guest dijical]

Hi all. I'm curious, is Wedderburn really that big a problem?

 

I see they're sealing and extending the runway. Aside from the membership cost (and workdays) is the strip really difficult? Or is it that it seems to be surrounded by trees.

 

Cheers

 

Michael.