RAAus - Time to first solo

[timshel]

Yeah that sounds about right - my processor was fine in the local circuit and had ample "headroom" to "smell the roses" - but get me out of the comfort zone and my processor was all backed up with the extra tasks. I need more RAM?

 

Doing the trip again tomorrow so we will see if my performance improves.

 

 

[facthunter]

Performance under pressure.

 

Timshel, glad to hear of your experiences. Flying is certainly a real-world phenomenon ANYONE can be overloaded, so if that happens you must load-shed & prioritise. Ie. Do the most IMPORTANT things. This is the essential part of MANAGING the situation. Often stated as Aviate , Navigate, Communicate, very much in that order. Examination of many air disasters shows failure in this area.

 

Regarding HOURS TO SOLO, There are so many factors to consider and while anything is up for discussion, I'm a bit uncomfortable with putting much emphasis on it. In the long run it is much more important to get the basics right, and that you have not picked up any bad habits or incorrect techniques or gaps in your basic skills , as these may stay with you, and bite you one day. Nev...

 

 

[Guest brentc]

You are in good hands Tim with your instructor. Next time you are there, ask him what his RA-Aus membership number is and you might realise why I said that!

 

 

[Flyer]

I've just had a re read of this thread and it makes for some interesting reading.

 

I learnt to fly in a Piper Warrior originally. From the time I hopped into the cockpit to the time I went solo was 15.4 hrs. However, 43.8hrs had elapsed by the time I had reached and passed my GFPT exam. I then finished my PPL adding another 41 hrs or so along the way. In total somewhere around 85 hrs training.

 

The day I received my ticket, my instructor said, You have a license to learn, go practise. That was in 95.

 

I kept flying until 99 and did my last BFR in July of 2000 and then stopped flying due to kids mortgage etc etc.

 

A mate started flying jabs out of Tooradin a few months ago and He suggested that I have a go as well.

 

So 7 years after my last time in a plane I made a committment and kick started my flying again.

 

GA to RA conversion time is a minimum 5 hrs according to the book, 4 hrs dual and 1 hr solo. It took those first 5 hrs for me to go solo again. I've since done a 2 hr navex and I need to finish flying off the 1 hr required solo time and then sit an exam. By the time I get my ticket, I'll have about 10 hrs in my logbook.

 

Jabs aren't as easy to land as a PA28 warrior or C-172.

 

Bottom line...enjoy the journey......

 

Can we start a poll for time to convert from GA to RA ? just for interests sake......... I'm about 10 hrs...

 

Regards

 

Phil

 

 

[Guest High Plains Drifter]

Just discovered this thread.

 

When I purchased my first aircraft (single seat Thruster - Robin 440) I enquired of the previous owner about how to fly (this was just before pilot certs) - He said the way He did it, was to do high speed taxis until you became comfortable with it - then just taxi faster. At the time I thought this to be sound advice and proceeded to fly myself.

 

I later did the GA Lic, aerobatic, IFR and Helicopter.

 

I do beleive I'm lucky to be here and am now a fanatic for the requirement of good instruction.

 

HPD

 

 

[facthunter]

Try it yourself?

 

HPD. I wholeheartedly agree with your conclusions. Apart from the thrown into the middle of the Atlantic to learn to swim aspect of the first airborne experience, (for which you are totally unprepared), nothing beats knowing and understanding the task and the skill(s) required correctly from the very beginning, after all, this is the foundation on which you build the rest of your subsequent flying knowledge. How sound it is will determine how good a pilot you turn out to be. Nev..

 

 

[motzartmerv]

I learned in a taildragger skyfox..my log says i soloed after 6.8 hrs, and the solo brouhgt up my 7th hour total time...I think this fast solo time was a refelction of my instructors techniques more then anything..from my very first flight i was in control moments after liftoff..rather then the usual climb to 3000 and hand over...we were on a quiet strip and would always do 2 or 3 takeoffs and landings in the one run..we would even do teardrops on calm days, 2 or 3 takeoffs and landings then a teardrop turn back to the strip and land the other way...hehe...a bit nervy, but an exellent way to get the skills up...

 

cheers

 

 

[Yenn]

Motzartmerv. The Skyfox pilot wasn't name of Gouldstone was he.

 

I did some skyfox time way back and the instructor was tops for making every minute count.

 

I was reading on Avweb the other day about how an instructor used to get his students doing all sorts of things on the way to the training area, sounded like a good idea.

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Yenn, no his name was Mcgrath.. Unfortunatly he's no longer with us.. Both he and his son died when a wing departed the skyfox in flight..

 

I think letting the student do most of the flying is a key to minnimising time spent b4 solo.. On my first flight with Greg he let me fly the whole time, talked me through lining up on final and only took over for the flair...In hindsight he was probably doing a lot more then i thought he was at the time..Rudder and throttle etc...but in my mind at the time i flew thew thing right down to the ground and man,,,, was i hooked...

 

cheers:thumb_up:

 

 

[Yenn]

Greg is sorely missed. I did a BFR with him years ago, and he was active around the Dawson Valley area.

 

 

[David S]

solo

 

Hi Folks,

 

I am much older , therefore must be much wiser:laugh: than most of you young fellas.

 

I consider myself to be a competent driver , having done a considerable amount of motor racing( historic,open wheelers etc). the gap between 'P' plates and travelling at 250+kms is vast.

 

I am just about to learn to fly and regard solo as my 'P' plate.

 

Soloing early isn't high on my agenda. Staying alive is extremely high.

 

Therefore learning to fly competently is to me of much more importance than gaining my 'P's

 

My bit

 

David S

 

 

[MrH]

Gaining solo & endorsments to me are just the begining of the learning curve.

 

I have gained my pilot certificate & am endorsed for Radio, passenger, & cross country but in no way do I feel I have enough knowledge or experience to leap out into the airspace with confidence just yet. I am a very low hour pilot & I still want to learn more from others with more experience before I venture out with passengers, let alone into the midst of Melbournes air traffic.

 

I had a null in my training, I imagine like most people, where it felt as though I was going backwards - this, I believe is a natural phenonemom with all humans. It's amazing how the "next day" things improve & once again you are all smiles, learning again & generally you never look back after that point in time.

 

I also found that any more than 2 hours training a day (1hr in the morning & 1 hr in the afternoon) would have been too much (for me anyway). You need time to absorb what you have learnt - to ponder it & work it through in your mind before you tackle it again. Cross country was a massive multitasking feat that takes time to come to grips with.

 

So what I'm now looking for is a club or group that fly from preferably Tooradin or Lilydale, so I can join in & be able to fly, learn & socialize with like minded people.

 

Are there any options out there???

 

Cheers

 

H

 

 

[Gibbo]

I had a bit of a strange experiance getting my ticket. I will leave airstrip names out of it.

 

I Started flying in September 07 averaging 4 hours per month. It took me 36 hours to go Solo. Of these hours, 10 of them were spent on a cross country to Narromine for Natfly. All these were at airfield "1" where I was starting ask "what am I doing wrong" without getting a decent answer.

 

While at Natfly (and while enjoying a few) I started a gentle conversation with a CFI from airstrip "2". A fairly heated discussion started around the table about instructors training styles and "nasty habits". End result being that I took the CFI's offer up for a check flight and I ended up going solo during the check flight. One monkey off my back.

 

"2" was a real eye opener and was able to effectivily to "fix" my landing problem in about 10 minutes of dual time. I suspect that many hours had been wasted at "1" as the real motive was not teaching but making money.

 

Naturally, "1" was a bit peaved that I had "jumped" the queue and had some solo time up on my next lesson with him. I kept lessons up at both schools and within another month was sitting my Flight test at "1".

 

I Sat my flight test at 56 hours when I had 10.5 hours of solo and had already completed 7 hours of Navs. I couldn't do much more, without the pilots certificate, as I needed to complete my solo Nav excerise.

 

My flight test also included my PX and Radio endorsements.

 

I then did another 7 hours of NAV's at "2" as "1" was too busy to fit my Nav exam. I failed my first attempt at my NAV flight test at "2" but was then able to pass it the very next day. $ive way to do it.

 

I learn't more in those seven hours at "2" than I did in 20 hours at "1". An effective debrief and a understandable comminication method makes a massive differance.

 

Since I received my ticket 2 months ago, I have managed to spend seven weeks flying around the countryside clocking up another 65 hours of very solo NAV time. My total hours are now at around 140.

 

Lessons I have been taught...

 

* If you have some doubt, get a second opinon.

 

* Don't use the school unless the pre and post flight lectures are up to scratch (if they run them at all). Trying to teach yourself is not an time effective method.

 

* "Shop around" for a style that puts you at ease. Spin recovery's on lesson four scares the crap out of most students.

 

* "stability" flying works.

 

* Clouds are not my friend.

 

* A pilots certificate is a licence to learn, not to fly.

 

Gibbo

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

I cant remeber how long it took and it is of so little relevance that I wont bother to look it up.

 

What is solo....simplistically its that time when your instructor is satisfied that you'll come back home in one piece.

 

If there was ever a time when you needed someone who has your wellbeing at heart to err on the side of caution its here.

 

I cant speak for all schools, but at my school the cost for solo vs 2 up training was the same. That being the case solo isnt some financially driven requirement.

 

Under training vs signed off and able to aviate.... whats teh difference.... Under training means that you have a back up system. In reality the educational value of both can be similar. So why hurry it. Also where I learned being signed off and let loose didnt fully divorce you from the instructor, in fact after sign off there were a couple of times when the instructor would grab me and say....Lets go up and practice X, I think I can show you something important about it.

 

Before being signed off it seems the desire is to get rid of the passenger as quickly as possible, after you look forward to having him/her back with you. One of lifes little puzzles

 

Andy

 

 

[facthunter]

Why?

 

Something to do with EGO, and self-image. The challenge is to get the most out of the instructor, if he's good enough, the whole thing should be a revelation., but you are part of the deal too. Good training is priceless and saves you finding out things the hard way, and it never stops, if you want to go the next step or have a "warts and all" assessment sometime in the future, not just "pass" the requirements. Nev..

 

 

[Thx1137]

Did my first solo today. Ive had 9.7 hours of dual instruction. the feild that I fly from is near the coast, and has a hill ridge right next to it so it is nearly always windy and bumpy. Makes for a good challange as the wind direction is constantly moving.

Contrats. Same strip and exactly the same hours and me by the sounds of it. Aldinga can get a bit feisty can't it :-)

 

Clearly it doesn't matter how long it takes. Just enjoy the journey. That is easier said then done sometimes, especially when the journey seems to take foreever!

 

As to whether someone is ready or not at 20 hours. Most of the accidents I have seen are from people with hundreds or event thousands of hours so I don't know that time itself should be a factor. The instructors should overload/challenge us so we can experience in safety what we will almost definitely experience in real life. Pulling the throttle to idle for a forced landing doesn't cause a sweat, we know it is a simulation. Easier to do if we are in simulators I guess, there are certainly some things we really don't want to practice in a real aircraft!

 

Steven.

 

 

[shags_j]

Jabs aren't as easy to land as a PA28 warrior or C-172.

Don't say that... My first flight in a Jab tomorrow after 15 hours of 172's...

 

 

[PeterW]

As I am learning... time to solo seems to be governed significantly by the weather... I am currently getting lots of great experience in the cct at YTDN in strong crosswinds (10+ kts) but until I happen to get down there on a calm day I won't be going solo...

I am also doing my training at YTDN which has been a mixture of Jabiru J-170 and J-160 and I first started with my TIF just prior to winter. I went solo at just under 25 hours and I thought I was just about all circuited out by the time I did. Most of my lessons were in the afternoon and most had crosswinds to varying degrees and I just could not seem to get those landings right. I would become a little pessimistic with some of the strong winds and the hard work it was in the circuit and would wonder if I was really worth having the lesson sometimes. However, looking back and I only have 36 hours logged, I think they were invaluable experience and because I have changed to early morning now when it does seem to be calmer, I think my landings are all the better for it. I don't expect to get my certificate for a while yet as my instructor and I made the decision to do my pax at the same time. The weather has still been playing a bit of havoc and this has kept my solo hours down to 4 at this stage.

 

Peter

 

 

[Guest Pop-top]

Can I pose a new, but on topic question;

 

Once the hurdle of solo'ing has come and gone, what was the average hours (in total) that people took to complete a Nav solo?

 

 

[Gibbo]

After a very messy first attempt at the Nav flight test, 13 hours. Have racked up another 70 since in the last few months. :)

 

Still glad that Brett (YLIL) failed me on my first attempt as it 'forced' me to work a little harder.

 

Giles

 

 

[Guest Biggles Jr]

interesting topic

 

hey, i am 14 and are ready to fly solo after 8 and a half hours. i have to wait a few weeks though because i am not old enough. on the other hand i have had a good run and dad didn't, going on a cruise and a lot of wind didn't help.

 

ryan:clown:

 

 

[lazerin]

+1

 

Yay! hehehe :big_grin:

 

 

[Guest drizzt1978]

I am also doing my training at YTDN which has been a mixture of Jabiru J-170 and J-160 and I first started with my TIF just prior to winter. I went solo at just under 25 hours and I thought I was just about all circuited out by the time I did. Most of my lessons were in the afternoon and most had crosswinds to varying degrees and I just could not seem to get those landings right. I would become a little pessimistic with some of the strong winds and the hard work it was in the circuit and would wonder if I was really worth having the lesson sometimes. However, looking back and I only have 36 hours logged, I think they were invaluable experience and because I have changed to early morning now when it does seem to be calmer, I think my landings are all the better for it. I don't expect to get my certificate for a while yet as my instructor and I made the decision to do my pax at the same time. The weather has still been playing a bit of havoc and this has kept my solo hours down to 4 at this stage.Peter

They need to set up some type of club for us guys at tooradin. When i finally got to fly without a crosswind i was very confused!! But yeah, we will be prepared for bad weather!!!;););)

 

 

[Guest Pop-top]

I'd really like to see a poll on how frequently learners have lessens on average, if one hasn't already been done.

 

ie I'm young, have a crap/average salary, don't have parents who can afford to credit card my lessons etc.

 

I'm wondering about other people in my situation and is there any hope of fulfilling the dream? or do you have to be rich already to get your dream job? I don't think I'm eligible for any scholarships either, so I'm plodding along working my butt off. I'm sure there are many more like me out there...?

 

 

[Guest Brett Campany]

I'd really like to see a poll on how frequently learners have lessens on average, if one hasn't already been done.ie I'm young, have a crap/average salary, don't have parents who can afford to credit card my lessons etc.

 

I'm wondering about other people in my situation and is there any hope of fulfilling the dream? or do you have to be rich already to get your dream job? I don't think I'm eligible for any scholarships either, so I'm plodding along working my butt off. I'm sure there are many more like me out there...?

Make a new thread Thumper, I reckon it'll be a good one.

 

I'm the same though mate, can only afford it after all the bills, rent etc are paid. If I don't get any bonuses for work then I don't fly. I had lessons booked for Monday but have to cancel now because of the lack of funds which means a 4 week break between lessons. Not happy about that!