Guest basscheffers Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 The J430 MTOW is NOW 760kg's (Jabiru pls update your website accordingly) and there is even a forum member on here who's running at the new 760. That's pretty good then. How long has it been like that? That page was updated 6 days ago! PS: The 760kg's has nothing to do with the plans for RA-Aus to have 760 kg's. This would only be of benefit to you if you are operating a J250. Wouldn't the stall speed be too high for RA-Aus at 760?
Guest Ken deVos Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 That's pretty good then. How long has it been like that? That page was updated 6 days ago! Wouldn't the stall speed be too high for RA-Aus at 760? The RA-Aus requirement is 45knt CAS stall speed with full flap. If you crunch the numbers on the J230 in the lift formula using: CAS stall speed full flap = 40knt at 600kg MTOW then MTOW at 45knts is.. 600 * sqr(45/40) or 759.3 kg.
Guest basscheffers Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Does the 250 have the same wing as 230? I didn't think so. Jabiru, in their wisdom, seem to have removed J250 specs from their site, but the Google cache still has them. They say 45kt at 700KG, so that will likely be the new limit when (decades from now) we finally have 760KG. But for a two seater, an extra 145KG under RA-Aus rules should give you a bit of extra camping equipment regardless! I'll assume your prediction for the J230 is accurate, however. :)
Guest brentc Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 You mean 250. Don't confuse yourself with all these numbers. The 250 stacks up very nicely as a candidate for 760'ish KG's or as a float plane it would be absolutely ideal with an excellent payload. In fact in a 250 you would probably struggle to load it to 760 kg's unless you had some pretty hefty bods in the front, aka 130+ kg's. Due to C of G you won't be able to load much in the back. The 760kg's at present is only for GA experimental but is approved by Jabiru so should become live shortly. Aside from that, if you are experimental GA you can actually go higher than the manufacturer recommends as long as you test it, then fly off the test period and don't fall out of the sky. Last time I checked a J430 kit was $67k + freight + paint + upholstery. Based on the $94k flyaway for the J230, you could get one factory assist GA for less than $100k.
BigPete Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 This wing thing is doin' me in. J120 has a wing 100mm (according to Jabiru website) shorter than a J160 and is max weight at 500kg (LSA) versus 540kg (RA-Aus) Was this deliberate (by Jabiru)? I mean, why didn't they put the 160 wing on it and call it 540kg Brentc - your J400 has a 700kg limit under GA - Isn't your wingspan close to a J160 (maybe 100mm wider? (Not listed on Jabiru's website anymore), and your stall speed at max weight is The J170 kit is under RA-Aus at 544kg, while the factory built J170 (LSA) is 600kg. When the new limit comes in can the kit built J170's be at a higher weight, say 650-670kg It seems the poor old J160 will be stuck at 540kg because of the 45 knot req. What is the GA registered J160 max weight limit and what is the stall speed at that weight regards :big_grin::big_grin:
Guest basscheffers Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Was this deliberate (by Jabiru)? I mean, why didn't they put the 160 wing on it and call it 540kg Because the bigger wing is more expensive and they wanted to keep the price down? Didn't want too great a usable load because it would make the popular J160 look bad value? Not everything in designing and selling aircraft is about engineering! :big_grin: The J170 kit is under RA-Aus at 544kg, while the factory built J170 (LSA) is 600kg. Looks like another case of Jabiru (hopefully) being better at making aircraft than keeping their website up to date... The J170 kit page lists it as 600, the "Model Chart" says 540. As far as I know, existing ones can apply to be re-certified for 600.
Guest basscheffers Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Just wondering: if a J170 is essentially a J160 with the J230 wing, could you replace the wing on your kit-built J160 and make it a 600/700/760KG?
motzartmerv Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Not too sure, but i think its rigged at a different angle...
Guest brentc Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 BigPete, I don't even know where to start when answering your questions! Bass, to answer your question, our flying school had their J160 converted by the factory to a J170, so yes it can be done. To convert a 95.55 aircraft to LSA, it has to have been produced after a certain date (when LSA was introduced) as LSA compatible and the factory has to provide a letter to state compliance with LSA regulations. This is probably only going to happen at the factory and not in your back yard or hangar. I'm thinking that the J160 wings may be slgihtly bigger / different to the J120 because they are wet wings and perhaps just come from a different mould. This wing thing is doin' me in. That's right BigPete, my J400 has a stall @ 700kg's at MTOW which is around 49 knots which is why under 95.55 it must be only 544 MTOW to be legal as a J200. My wing length / size is the same as the old LSA55 because the J160 wasn't invent when the J400 was built.
dazza 38 Posted July 3, 2009 Posted July 3, 2009 hi big pete the j120 is the original LSA 55 aircraft(mold) built back in the early nineties. It was built well before the j 160. hence why the wing is not the same as the j 160
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