582 Silver Head -- OK?

[randy]

I recently found a lovely little Avid Mk-IV with a Rotax 582 in it, and I'm thinking of buying it. But I'm hearing many bad things about the 582 "Silver Head" motor (which is what this one is). This motor has 184 TT hours on it, but has been in storage for the last three years. From what the owner says, it's been prepped pretty well for storage (Stabil in the fuel, cleaned the carbs, fogged the carb while running 'til the motor quit, covered intake and exhaust, removed the battery, drained the tanks). The price for this aircraft is on the low side of OK, but not a truly stellar deal. But I'm worried about that silver head 582. What is likely to be the lifespan of this motor? Can this be rebuilt and be a solid motor?

 

What are your experiences with the older 582s? Should I just plan on replacing this motor (which would significantly reduce the amount of my offer to the current owner)?

 

Please advise... I've never had a Rotax.

 

Randy

 

 

[skeptic36]

Hi Randy,

 

Mine has 380 hrsTT on it now and has given no trouble so far.

 

When it does give up I will replace it with a new one as I don't think the difference in cost compared to rebuilding is worth it, also the resale value of your aircraft would be better with a new rather than rebuilt motor.

 

Regards Bill

 

 

[robinsm]

I am in the process of replacing a grey head motor at the moment. It has 652 hrs on it. The motor is still going well but I need the mental comfort of as new one as I have some long trips planned. The motor has performed beautifully since I have had it with the only problems being of my own making. If they are fed properly they will last as well as any other motor of their type. I have replaced it with another 582 (new blue head).

 

My old grey motor already has another prospective home.

 

Cheers

 

Maynard

 

 

[randy]

Maynard, and Bill,

 

Fabulous, thanks! This aircraft is pretty close to what I can afford to buy, and I won't have the money to replace the engine for a while. So that's why I'm a bit worried.

 

Sounds like you have had great success with your 582s. That's very encouraging. I'll look at the plane and see how everything else looks. If it's been stored in good conditions, and we can get it running... I'll see what the owner is willing to take for the airplane. Hopefully we can come to terms that works for the existing owner, and can make me comfortable that I can still handle potential issues. (Three years in good storage isn't that long, I suppose.)

 

Thanks,

 

Randy

 

 

[Guest 172M]

582

 

There is very little difference between the Grey and Blue head 582's. The biggest is alteration was the re engineering of the Water pump/RD valve common drive sealing arrangement, which, on high time engines was always an on going problem. As the engine is "old" in time you would be well advised to replace the inlet manifolds ( which do not age well with a fuel oil mix) all of the coolant lines and replace the coolant before first flight, check the carb floats for wear on the brass spindles(flat spots caused by vibration) If the aircraft is running a C or E gearbox you will have less maintenance issues due to vibrational load than the old B box as they were diabolical for passing vibration thru the engine and airframe and had an overhaul life of 150 hrs on a good day!

 

Good luck

 

Leigh :yin_yan::thumb_up:

 

 

[facthunter]

Advice.

 

All pretty good so far. 2-strokes seem to survive storage better than the poppet valve variety, as there is generally oil everywhere.. The engine should be good for 500 hours if it has the mixture set right. The gearbox ... I would listen to the experts there as some are better than others. I prefer premix to the oil pump type anyhow, but they have advantages when you are going cross country. Don't let your premix go stale. Two strokes are alright if they are fairly new and operated properly. I have seen some that are more worn out than I would run a lawn mower.. Good flying. Nev

 

 

[randy]

Excellent advice, all. Thanks. I'm compiling a nice list of things to check/fix/replace to make this a good motor. Wonderful.

 

Now... since I really cannot fly this thing before I buy it (based on much of the advice I'm getting for things to do before the first flight), I'll need to figure out a good way to assess the condition on the ground. Perhaps a conditional sale agreement with some description of a maximum cost of getting the motor back on line?

 

Randy

 

 

[facthunter]

Complex.

 

That idea is a bit hard to manage in the real world.. Check how the compression feels and remove the exhaust system and have a good look at the bores and the visible pistons. You should remove all the loose carbon in the port(S) and exhaust pipe near the gasket, as it can come loose after sitting for a while and enter the motor, Squirt a bit of oil into each cylinder, Clean the carbs, setting up the cables so the slides open equally, and run it. Fast idle for a while, (never idle too slow) and a thorough warm-up before you give it the lot. Good idea to have both EGT gauges working, and if any are indicating HOT, ( above normal for the throttle setting), don't keep running it without transposing the gauge, to see if it is a faulty indication. With clean fuel in the tank and no sediment there it should run fine. The diaphragm fuel pump should be overhauled and all rubber hoses replaced before you fly it. Replace the oil in the little plastic tank, and check for oil trace in the coolant. Nev

 

 

[bernardc]

Hi my 582 did 800 hours without touching it , ( they are meant to have pistons done at 300 )

 

the pistons were at maximum wear limits wrist pins too , the roller bearing on the flywheel end of the crankshaft had worn the shaft , I rebuilt it with a 2nd hand 100 hour crank and new non genuine pistons, about $ 900 for parts , done another 100 hours since and no problems, these are good reliable solid motors , just dont run them too lean and dont forget the oil and you will be fine

 

 

[facthunter]

Longevity.

 

Looked after the original motors seem to do 500 hours and after that it all varies.

 

I believe part rebuilds are a waste of money/time unless you are a two stroke proficient rebuilder, and get the parts at the right price.. The crank can not be trusted above about 600 hours. (I believe the factory says 300) Which is pretty good really. This subject has been covered previously with some concensus arrived at, I thought. Nev.

 

 

[David S]

Randy,

 

Look after it and it will look after you. Mine has only done 140 hrs but I coddle it like a newborn. I would expect to get it thoroughly checked at about 300+ hrs. Runs like a Swiss Watch

 

David S

 

 

[randy]

Thanks again to everyone for the fine information. I am flying out to see the airplane and "try it on for size" on this Sunday. The seller is asking an amount that is near the lower end of a "reasonable" price range, and is already saying that he will entertain offers. And I've not even seen it yet. The fact that it's a two-stroke, plus it's been in storage, plus it's a tail-wheel, all will make it hopefully more affordable. If I can factor in some motor work -- or a full replacement in the worst case -- and still have an aircraft that has a somewhat reasonable cost, I will be a proud new owner.

 

Fingers crossed.

 

Randy

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

You won't have any problems with the 582, use good coolant mixed 50/50 with demineralised water, and Castrol 2T oil. As far as the AVID goes you could call Ian Ellis on 02 66891501 or Mob 0429 891501 or Email [email protected] as he was an Avid importer and would know a fair bit about them. Tell him Ross Millard sent you. Cheers and good luck.