Low Level Endorsement

[Spin]

qwerty, the photo was taken on the Broadwater a couple of years ago, at Tipplers Resort (RIP), Cessna 180 operated by Gold Coast Seaplanes. Unfortunately I didn't ever manage to get a good one of the DH Beaver that used to operate thereabouts at about the same time.

 

Tomo there is some video around of the team of Harvards doing a "spray past", looked to be a bit better than approach speed, but I wouldn't say anywhere near full taps. Loony thing to do I reckon, but at the same time nice to know the bloke poling your airliner has those sort of stick and rudder skills! I believe Scully has just retired from SAA as a training captain.

 

 

 

[Guest Qwerty]

I really am crap at explaining my thoughts. I'll try again.

 

Anything including a car or a bike will aquaplane at 100 kmh...hence car in paddock.

 

There is little friction between the wheels and the water so brakes on or off makes no difference either fast or slow in an aircraft. What causes the wheels to "dig in" is their increasing depth into the water as a result of diminishing lift when slowing down during the "landing".

 

Brakes dont make any difference.

 

How did I go that time?

 

 

[Tomo]

Yes I see what you mean Qwerty, and I'm not trying to be nasty, but why do they put there brakes on then? Likes of that in the Video in Watto's thread.

 

And also why would my instructor say it if it's not necessary, and Col Paye who flew the Air Tractor, he did it as well...

 

Please don't think I'm trying to be a 'smarty pants' etc... I'm just a bit confused now... One group says it helps, and one says it doesn't make any difference?:confused:

 

 

[JimG]

Tomo asked.

 

JimG, Just for interest sake, would you be willing to run through what you've done so far? On the Practical side?

 

I'm just curious

 

I've been very busy to reply until now so I won't attempt to go though all of it, that would take quite some doing , I'll just touch on a couple of things of interest.

 

Firstly, yes HEON i believe this is the same instructor you did your LL though so I'm sure you'll read some of this and reflect (hopefully without a cold sweat).

 

After not flying the drifter for near on 12 months most of the first session was just getting back up to speed in the plane, as all the drifter flyers out there know the drifter is all about stick and rudder,high drag and low enertia so you are really flying the plane in every sense.

 

Once back on the horse so to speak we set about learning to fly accurately over the ground at about 300 ft following dirt roads and tracks etc. with the main aim to locate as many power lines as possible using all the indicaters i'd studied and been shown.

 

To be honest I missed a few , they are so well hiden in places and sure we're taught all the stuff about obsticals at LL and lee side turbuence etc. but the instructor says obstructions we can easily see at LL and use common sence and with time and a bit of planning can be avoided but the power line itself you won't see and it will KILL you.

 

So with every session, ever sorty at LL its all about power lines,power lines.....!

 

I've learnt so far the fly the plane accurately with power, attitude and trim at 5 feet and that is honestly 5 feet for miles on end over paddocks ,crops, dams, fences, under many many power lines and to say that has your attention is an understatement. I did say the intructor is a current crop spayer, normal to him but me i can tell you my eyeballs are like dinner plates stuck on the visor.

 

i've done orbits around a hill with a NE@10knts in a constant medium rate turn getting progressively lower until ten feet about the tree tops when you are using all of the controls to fly the plane in updrafts,downdrafts,downwind losing lift and upwind pushing the stick forward.

 

Stalls and recovery at 500 feet, stalls and recover to full power vertical climb to almost second stall and a kind of flop over to level flight to simulate a LL stall and recover to climb over obstical .

 

Simulated engine failures at LL and aiming at the path of least danger, engine failures while climbing up mountain sides and turn away using wind direction to advantage etc.

 

Establishing climb with false horizons, turn back in valleys.

 

Thats just some of the stuff we've been over so far but i can tell you the last session was my favourite so far and that was flying a track over the ground that included figure 8's around 2 large trees at 10 feet doing steep turns with full power anticipating all the effects of the wind. Now that has you using ALL of the controls all the way around.

 

Finally my motive for doing this is to improve my skills as a pilot and as far as LL future flying is concerned there is no way in hell i would attempt this without an instructor or if need be an emergency.

 

cheers

 

JimG

 

 

[Relfy]

I have a formula I use in crash investigation for calculating the velocity of an object ie vehicle for it to begin aqua-planing. The three variables are weight, surface area of the tyre contact area width and depth and speed being the unknown which can be derived from the other known values.

 

I'm trying to work out though where a locked tyre may be different and the only reason I can think of it the gyroscopic force of an unlocked wheel beginning to turn, adversely effecting pitch control of an aircraft.

 

 

[Tomo]

Thanks a lot Jim, It's seems I've covered all the same as you have so far... so that's good to hear. Though it seems I covered it a lot quicker, possibly due to being pretty fresh in the ways of the Drifter.

 

When I first went under my first power line I instantly ducked my head... not gonna do anything, but It's funny how the reaction on the first one is there! If you can find any cleanish water, get you're instructor to fly you over that at a few feet, and see just how easy it is to drown yourself if you don't look at the horizon or bank in front of you...

 

 

[Tomo]

I'm trying to work out though where a locked tyre may be different and the only reason I can think of it the gyroscopic force of an unlocked wheel beginning to turn, adversely effecting pitch control of an aircraft.

Yes, maybe?

 

But then again, next time you find some really muddy slippery surface, drive up to it and stamp on the brakes, locking up the wheels you just slide along with minimal sinkage... if you do the same but just drive through it, it causes bigger tracks and you don't get as far as when you're locked up... I've done it before, and it's actually a little trick to cross a very soft spot without getting bogged, speed up, and slam on the brakes just at the edge and slip sliding over you go... So there must be a benefit in braking surely?

 

 

[HEON]

G'day JimG, and yes he tends to get your attention don't you think!

 

I personally found the VERY low flight around the tree's allowing for the wind took me completely out of my comfort zone as the room for error is so small. I had severe doubts if I could duplicate the skill in a faster/higher stall speed aircraft without constant practice, which increases the risk of a "training accident" to a level above which I am happy with.

 

I did the course as I had to do the above last year in WA for real. Got out of the situation only as I had high airspeed at the time which allowed me to do two very steep turns below tree top height. The lead up to that incident makes the whole human factors course gain meaning! I fully accept the saying that pilots start with a bag of luck and no expearance: the trick is to get the expearance before the bag is empty.

 

The practice and tips you will get on low and very low level emergencies I think are invaluable as when it happens for real you don't get the luxury of a re-run unless you get it right the first time! That to me makes the course (run with the right instructor) a must do.

 

 

[JimG]

Was meant to be doing some more LL training today but the Boss has cancelled due to the wind and dust.

 

Your excactly right HEON , it is the knowledge and skill to hopefully handle the situation if forced to very LL in an emergency like engine failure or low ceiling etc ( HF, I know ).

 

The lessons learnt like the amount of control deflection coming out of a steep turn in particular top rudder and the scalding you get if foolishly/instinctively try to use the rudder to tighten the turn, Oouch...! I read somewhere (I think it was in Stick and Rudder) that a pilot panicing using the rudder to try to tighter the last turn to a paddock or better paddock was 70% of the cause of spinning in from LL.

 

So to have all those things co ordinated automatically in your mind is what may save me. Cause i can tell you for sure if you use bottom rudder and heave on the stick to come out of a steep turn the plane rolls over the bottom wing almost instantly, a demonstation only done at altitude with no traffic around..!

 

The lessons are probably taught in a military style but I like that cause it really etches into my mind all the important not negotiable aspect of flying the plane, situational awareness and what not to do at LL.

 

Also its all about growing as a pilot, my logic is if I do nothing other than social flying the skills i learnt to pass my certificate would slowly deminish until I have a quick tune up before any BFR. So for the sport and pleasure of challenges I'm working my way though the various endorsements of interest. Earlier this year myself and two other enthusiastic young pilots spent 16.2 hrs collectively doing the Formation Flying endo and gee the was a great challenge and hugely rewarding and once finished Low Level i'll go on to Advanced Pilot and maybe work on an instructor rating , we'll see.

 

It's trying to be confident and not cocky, I still remember shortly after getting my wings being nervous about being in the circuit and hearing on the radio someone joining xwind .:)

 

Fly Safe everyone

 

JimG

 

 

[Tomo]

Mind Jogger Question

 

Got another little mind jogger question for all us new-ish pilots.....

 

What is the 2 heights at which you should ONLY fly at when flying low level?