I don't get it...

[crazy diamond]

Hey guys,

 

Been looking at alternative ways to get in the air a bit cheaper than the old Warriors etc which are now renting for the $200 plus mark. Love the idea of Microlights but can't understand why most places charge at least $190 an hour dual for them, surely they aren't the expensive to run??????

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Sorry mate, can't help you there... I fly aircraft....

 

 

[Guest taildragger]

Hey Crazy, Microlights hey!!! Quickest way for a GA pilot to kill ones self. Think about it. At the moment when you want to go up you pull back yeah...... when the ^%$%^ hits the fan in a microlite and you pull back instictively where you gonna go???? yep... down...ouch!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

[crazy diamond]

You're all too funny guys! LOL

 

I'm quite intrigued by it, don't mind the slower speeds and happy to learn till I'm comfortable in them but don't understand why they're nearly as much as much older/much more complex GA style a/c like C150's etc...

 

 

[Guest taildragger]

Sorry Crazy I don't mean to be contaversial. I have had a TIF long ago in a trike and absolutely loved it. Why are they so expensive...sorry no idea either. Maybe for insurance reasons????. Good luck with 'em though they are fun.

 

 

[Guest taildragger]

Have you had a good look at Ra-aus aircraft? You can really get bang for your buck in this class of A/C. and not spend a fortune doing it.

 

 

[crazy diamond]

Hi CFI,

 

Well I am somewhat interested in why "minimalist" style of flying cost's roughly the same as ordinary GA from which I am coming, if I decided to do my certificate etc and purchase a trike what would I be looking at to fly it on an hourly basis? My concern is that the cost is not much different to normal GA aircraft, which is why I'm getting out of GA flying, I was under the impression anything less than GA was mch more affordable, am I reading it wrong? Also, where I fly currently has enthusiastic, eager and experienced guys keen to indulge in big adventures, extremely experienced instructors, great facilities etc so I don't get why a machine that cost's so much less cost's the same to learn in...

 

 

[Guest taildragger]

CD,

 

don't forget that you're 95% there for a RA license. So a conversion in that respect certainly wont be as expensive as a certificate in weightshift.

 

 

[Mc Guyver]

You're all too funny guys! LOLI'm quite intrigued by it, don't mind the slower speeds and happy to learn till I'm comfortable in them but don't understand why they're nearly as much as much older/much more complex GA style a/c like C150's etc...

An Airborne XT912 with all extras: chute,radio,intercom,helmets etc sets you back 80 grand.

Training is limited to early morning / late afternoon but when experienced you can fly all day long:big_grin: You are also looking at 7hrs endurance @ 65Kt if your bladder can take it:laugh:

 

It can at times take a 3 axis pilot longer than an ab initio pilot to convert, but this depends on how quickly the individual can adapt in stressful situations! 15 hours would be about average!

 

 

[crazy diamond]

Hi Mac,

 

So the $15-20K Edge's etc I see on here and eBay and the RAA for sale, how would they go cost wise per hr if I was to buy one?

 

 

[Tomo]

G'day Crazy D.

 

Are you talking Microlights (trikes), or small aircraft in general? From what I gather you're interested in both sides.

 

I can hire a Jabiru 120 for $110 tacho hr - Cruise at 100kts, modern instrumentation, Gps, transponder, radio's etc, endurance of about 4 hrs, using about 14ltrs an hour, two up and a bit of luggage room.

 

Or I can hire a Jabiru 230 for $143 tacho hr - cruise at 120kts, about 21ltrs an hr, endurance is over 5hrs, modern instrumentation with all the gimso's stated above, huge amount of luggage area, two up.

 

Drifter Ultralight - $95 tacho hr, cruise about 60kts, about 18lts an hr (two stroke), full tanks can get you about 4-5hrs endurance, basic instruments, radio etc...

 

So you can see what I would use if I was going somewhere, and only needed a two seater.

 

Anyone that charges more than that for two seat recreational aircraft, loose customers I reckon, and why would you pay $190 an hr for a two seat Jab, when for $200 I can hire a Class cockpit modern 172, with 4 seats.

 

Keep recreational flying affordable I say.

 

Sorry that doesn't really answer your question though. :black_eye:

 

 

[crazy diamond]

Hi Tomo,

 

You're sort of there, I was primarily referring to Trikes however you do raise a good point, it is cheaper to fly Jabs etc than trikes, WHY????

 

 

[Guest sypkens]

Anyone that charges more than that for two seat recreational aircraft, loose customers I reckon, and why would you pay $190 an hr for a two seat Jab, when for $200 I can hire a Class cockpit modern 172, with 4 seats.

Hi Tomo,

 

to the best of my knowledge I think the RAA flying schools in the SE Qld district are charging rates round about the $190. And it is my sentiments exactly that if I was going to spend any further dollars on training I would probably go the GA route and at least get the ticket. Having more theory thrown at me will at least give me more bang for my buck.

 

similarly paying for $50K for a reasonably old plane vs the $100K plus for a plastic fantastic is also starting to look attractive. $50K is a lot of flying hours.

 

Regards,

 

Jan

 

 

[BigPete]

There's plenty of good second hand Jabiru's out there for less than 40k.

 

regards

 

 

[Guest Crezzi]

I was primarily referring to Trikes however you do raise a good point, it is cheaper to fly Jabs etc than trikes, WHY????

If you're talking about tuition, a top-of-the-range trike costs similar to an entry level Jabiru but you can't train in them for as many hours per day. So all the fixed costs are proportionally more per flying hour. But not "trainable" isn't the same as not "flyable".

 

So the $15-20K Edge's etc I see on here and eBay and the RAA for sale, how would they go cost wise per hr if I was to buy one?

Once you are qualified, owning something like that would be way cheaper - I was speaking to a guy a while ago who worked out his 500 trike hours averaged about $35 per hour IIRC. Might be a bit more now due to fuel prices.

 

Quickest way for a GA pilot to kill ones self.

Only true if you are referring to ga pilots who haven't been properly trained to fly trikes. Lots of people fly both 3-axis & weightshift entirely safely.

 

Cheers

 

John

 

 

[shags_j]

I disagree with some of the pricing some people have identified ($190+???)

 

I paid $172 (or there abouts) for dual and $132 for solo.

 

I just checked my first invoice I received from the school at archerfield i went to (and from memory they were all about the same price) and 1.2 hour flight cost me $310. That was 2 years ago. That was in the cherokee. The 172 was an extra $20 per hour.

 

1.2 hours at Caboolture with an instructor = ~$210

 

Not sure how you can compare the two.

 

 

[markendee]

Crazy Diamond,

 

The whole situation is subjective I think. What does an old Warrior cost to replace compared to a new XT?

 

I had a recent experience with a GA pilot who had just restored an Airtourer. (which I like so don't go crook!) He asked me what my Savvy owed me and when I told him he looked amazed and said "you could have had an Airtourer for that"

 

To which I replied "two Airtourers"

 

It's horses for courses. I try to keep my opinions on what others do and think (because I don't care what they do) to myself but it isn't always easy.

 

I think RAA is the way to go but that does not mean you have to. Affordable and justifiable flying, lower maintenance costs etc. etc.

 

Hope that helps somehow.

 

Mark D

 

 

[skeptic36]

Sorry mate, can't help you there... I fly aircraft....

Hi Merv,

I was in the kitchen the other day cooking breakfast when I heard a commotion outside. Of course I immediately ran out and there before my eyes a Flying instructor(3 axis) who flys lots of aircraft out of Jaspers Brush was getting the absolute suitcase beaten out of him by a bunch of Trike pilots .

 

All of a sudden the sheer horror of what was happening hit me..................................

 

my toast was burnin'!

 

Regards Bill

 

 

[Kev]

An Airborne XT912 with all extras: chute,radio,intercom,helmets etc sets you back 80 grand.

......or you can buy a 912s for around 63k (without a chute). With the exchange rate from UK being so good at the moment this drops to around $51k :thumb_up: We burn around 9.3 ltrs/hour (Premium Unleaded) so fairly cheap to run.

 

Our previous Edge X 582 used about 12 ltrs/hr so equally cheap to run and just as much fun to fly.

 

Safe flying

 

Kev

 

 

[Guest Maj Millard]

Recently sourced possible insurance coverage for a trike to be used for training. Just not possible to get it for training. I was told that one school in Vic has coverage because he has a good track record with them, and pays a lot of money..............................................Maj...

 

 

[planedriver]

Hi Crazy,

 

Bankstown prices on Warriers, not forgetting the landing fee and time wasted on the ground, got too dear for me years ago.

 

Why not take a ride down to The Oaks one weekend? You will find a very friendly bunch of guys there, who all love their flying.

 

Daves Flying School have Jabiru, Lightwing and Bantam

 

Contact details: David Rolfe. Airport 02 4657 2771. Mobile 0414 740 766

 

or, Sydney Recreational Flying Club 02 4657 2604 (Normally only weekends) Mob. 0425 251 939 They have a Lightwing and a very nice Foxbat A22.

 

Either way, you could go flying for little more than half the Bankstown prices.

 

Hope this is of some interest to you.

 

Kind Regards

 

Planey

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Skeptic. Im afraid im unfamiliar with the term TRIKE PILOT. Was that a typo??

 

Seriously though, Im sorry to hear about your toast. Trike drivers often beat up on PILOTS, poor frustrated fellows they are. I do recall the incident you speak of, i did manage to scare the trike OPERATORS away, i mentioned the word "crosswind" and they vanished..hehe..

 

 

[Guest Crezzi]

The crosswind limit of a J160 (for example) is a whole 2kts higher than an Airborne XT

 

It would appear that you are just unfamiliar with trikes - period.

 

Cheers

 

John

 

 

[motzartmerv]

Yea, it would appear your unfamiliar with the word "joke" -period.

 

 

[moy71]

i just love the friendly banter that goes on here....