Camera for cockpit video

[DarkSarcasm]

Hi gang,

 

It seems that lots of people are mounting video cameras to take videos of their flights. While I wouldn't be doing it dual, I will (if nothing untoward happens) be licenced in the nearish future and rather like the idea of putting a camera somewhere in the cockpit to record flights. I definitely don't want to mess around putting cameras on the outside of the aircraft though.

 

So, a few questions:

 

What sort of camera do you use? I don't own a video camera so would be looking at making a purchase, so advice would be good. Nothing too expensive, but I'd like one that does reasonable/good quality videos. I found an oldish thread talking about 'GoPro Hero', are they still recommended?

 

Any ideas about how/where to mount it? It'd be in a J160 (at the moment anyway) and I'd like to put it somewhere inside the cockpit. Maybe on the dash? Or clipped onto the back of the RHS seat? Ideas (and ways of actually mounting it) would be good :)

 

Is there any way of adding audio input (i.e. radio calls) and is it even worth trying to? Or is it just a waste of time bothering with extra cables and such?

 

Any help or advice would be appreciated, thanks all :)

 

 

[perthjay85]

hey darky I know you will get better advice than mine but what i did is:

 

bought an olympus tough 8000 because i wanted a still camera thats waterproof and the video isnt to bad and i also bought one of those gorilla stands.

 

video quality:

 

 

gorilla stand:

 

Gorilla Pod Original Camera TriPod Mini Camcorder Stand - eBay, Tripods Supports, Photography. (end time 03-May-10 06:15:09 AEST)

 

this is a very basic setup that worked for me. overall cost about $550 with a waterproof tough camera.

 

as far as sound goes im to useless to organise something like that but im sure it could be done somehow

 

Jay

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

(i hope your not talking inline with last nights chatroom... dual flying etc.)

So you've worked out what we were talking about now have you? (and NO it is not for that!)

 

Sound is possible with a cord, might be easier with your fancy headset to plug it in, otherwise youll most likely end up with the engine noise, and in that case it would be better to just have no sound at all and add in music later...

I was wondering about the headset but I thought it was only input, rather than output. Any ideas anyone? (I have a Zulu btw)

 

gorilla stand:

Gorilla Pod Original Camera TriPod Mini Camcorder Stand - eBay, Tripods Supports, Photography. (end time 03-May-10 06:15:09 AEST)

How stable is that? It looks a bit like it'd be in danger of toppling over every time you decided to turn...

 

 

[perthjay85]

the gorilla pod legs are very flexible and bend around almost anything.

 

i used it in a boomerang and wrapped a smaller version around one of the steel bars behind the two seats.

 

you can contort it in many different ways so its as stable as you want it to be.

 

most big stores sell them like big w so go in and check them out.

 

but first thing is pick your camera your going to use first:

 

this is the specs and info on my camera

 

Olympus Australia | Digital Cameras | Digital SLR | Digital Lenses | xD Cards - Mju Tough 8000 details

 

 

[Matt]

If you're interested in video - there are a couple of very light/capable cameras which can mount on just about anything.

 

This site has details on the better ones available: Self Contained Helmet Cameras | Launch Helmet Cams

 

If you want to use a standard video camera, there are some neat "G clamp" style mounts available for under 20 bucks...I'll find a link and post it for these ones.

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

The GoPro cameras look pretty good (the non-HD ones, can't afford the HD ones), anyone got any opinions?

 

 

[perthjay85]

the go pro camera is pretty kick a$$ but you do pay for it.

 

one of the car forums i use the administrator did a pretty godo write up and had some video footage of the results:

 

HD 1080p Helmet/Car/Plane Cam A must For All!

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

the go pro camera is pretty kick a$$ but you do pay for it.one of the car forums i use the administrator did a pretty godo write up and had some video footage of the results:

HD 1080p Helmet/Car/Plane Cam A must For All!

Awesome thanks. I wouldn't get the HD one (can't afford it) but I can get the standard motorsport one (with some stands and stuff) for $220. The quality looks really good for a camera that small.

 

Not so sure about the fact it takes AAA batteries though, see that getting expensive I can. I guess you can get rechargeable ones though?

 

 

[perthjay85]

yeah batteries can get pretty expensive.

 

best bet is to contact them and see what they have to say about rechargable batteries as some electronic components aren't fans of them.

 

other option is buy batteries in bulk and you will be just fine.

 

 

[Ultralights]

I use the GoPro HD, have 2 of them, awesome little camera. use it for far more than just flying.

 

 

and for videos like this, suction cup hold very strong even at 100 kts, plus, did not move even on friends motorcycle at 280 Kph!

 

[YOUTUBE]<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nsPfOz4TBQ&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nsPfOz4TBQ&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>[/YOUTUBE]

 

or the most recent video, Flightygirl making her first unassisted landing..

 

camera is simply suctioned to the top of the windscreen upside down.

 

unfortunatly being HD, the movie files are huge and you need a decent computer to edit them, mac laptop does them fine.

 

[YOUTUBE]<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdzjc9-Hlxc&hl=en_GB&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdzjc9-Hlxc&hl=en_GB&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>[/YOUTUBE]

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

Does it bother you not having a screen to check videos and setup angles and such?

 

I hadn't thought of sticking it on the windscreen. I was considering sticking it to the RHS door, so then you can see me plus out the windscreen...

 

 

[Ultralights]

nahh lack of screen doesnt bother me, its a 170 degree wide angle lens, so as long as its pointed in the general direction, you frame it pretty well.

 

 

[country kid]

hey darky iv seen a few set ups using a cheap set of cctv cameras on a recording loop running into a PDA, but thats a little expensive and is more semi perminent, you can use a web cam. and have a lap top set up on the RHS seat but depending on how much you would want to spend the best set up which is what iv got i use it for hunting its a camera build into a pair of sunglasses great idea really dosent cost that much and you can veiw the footage as you go on your phone the link for its hear http://www.usedguns.com.au/scopes_accessories.html#accessories hope this helps.

 

Cheers CK

 

 

[flying dog]

Darky,

 

Nikon Coolpix S8000. It does HD movies and it is small enough.

 

 

[perthjay85]

if your going to get a normal camera that can be used for every day things get a tough one.

 

the new olympus 8010 is $403 delivered from ebay waterproof to 10m and if its anything like the 8000 i can vouch for it

 

drop proof from 2m

 

and crush proof to 100kg and handles -10 degrees celcius.

 

it is 14.2Mp and now it does HD video, my 8000 doesnt but the quality is just fine.

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

I'd prefer to spend under $250 if possible

 

 

[Guest ozzie]

The HD Pro is the hottest little camera to come along in a long time. There would be at least a dozen being jumped on our drop zone. the reproduction is amazing. can also be set to take still instead of video. We found the card size was a bit small to fit a whole days activities on it. The other short coming is they don't do well in low light conditions.

 

Darky hold off and save up for the HD you will apreciate the extra quality.

 

Shop around. I found the best price was with a mob called 'Karnage Krew' when he has them. maybe with the exchange rate try some US distributers.

 

Ozzie

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

I'm just wondering if I won't use it enough to jusitfy an HD one...seems a fair price difference. I guess it'll probably last a fair while though.

 

Question for those who have one: how long does the battery last (roughly)?

 

They certainly seem to have good reviews, these GoPro cameras

 

 

[Tomo]

Not sure if you've seen my set up with my last video?

 

 

======

 

- The camera mount is this gizmo I made up after work one day -

 

[ATTACH]10492.vB[/ATTACH]

 

It attaches on the drop down ledge behind your head on the roof, works great actually. Not sure how it'd go with a passenger but in a 160 it might be more room and you could fit it between your heads. (better view that way )

 

- Camera type is just a Sony camcorder (8mm digital vhs type - old I know but works still). - But I made the mount to fit anything, as you can see one of my still digital camera's on it when attached to the dresser cabinet. You just screw the screw up on the bottom into the camera.

 

- Sound recording was just camera speaker, but I can record intercom by hooking up a line recorder on the passenger headphone output jack (just use an adapter).

 

- Editing software is iMovie on the iMac computer, my iBook G4 is just to slow, so I have to use Dad's iMac.

 

Next time I want to mount it in such a way so you can see the ASI and a few more instruments. That way you can see exactly what is happening.

 

========

 

 

 

[Foto_Flyer]

My set-up (sorry, no pics or vids to show you...yet!) is a little like Tomo's.

 

I looked at those GoPro camera's and, while good for what they do, just weren't quite what I was looking for. For external shots, they're great. And the fact that some car and bike "race" teams use them with the supplied suction mounts, tells me that the mount will handle the sort of speeds we do!

 

But I wanted something with a bit more clarity (as in optics) inside the cockpit. I've noticed that the standard definition GoPro's don't like spinning props if facing out through the screen. Due to the frame rate of the camera a distracting liner stobing effect occurs. (I couldn't think of how else to describe it) However, I believe this is much better with the HD version.

 

I use a Digital Sony Handicam with a wide angle lens attached. It's an older one so it uses DVT (digital video tape) but these days they just record to a SDHC card. The advantage here is that the LCD screen can be rotated to face you regardless of where the camera is pointed so you can set up different shots in flight (if you wish). Most will also allow you to take stills, so if you didn't want to record a whole flight, you can just take some snaps of anything of interest along the way. Plus, the battery lasts hours and I can use the camera as a normal video camera for anything else too! If choosing this route though, I wouldn't use a HDD camera as the hard disk has a tendancy to shut the camera down in turbulence or on a hard landing to protect itself! (Not that you'd have any of those, right!)

 

I use a suction mount for this set up with a RAM arm and camera mount. This works very well and can be quickly adjusted to almost any angle. However, Tomo's mount looks good for forward facing, between the seats shots! might have a go at making something similar myself. (as long as you haven't taken out a patent on it, Tomo!) I did spend a bit of money and buy a dedicated photo clamp but just haven't been able to use it successfully due to it's bulk.

 

Oh, and as for the AAA batteries, get some NiMH or Lithium rechargeables. Bit expensive but last a while and usually have no problems in these sort of gadgets!

 

 

[Tomo]

G'day Foto Flyer, sounds like we use the same camera, I wanna update sometime though!

 

And my thing isn't patented, (not a bad idea though )

 

Darky: for sound you can get an adapter (similar to what you have now for your headphones to plug into your computer, but just the other way around, with a female connection one end). Plug that into the passenger side headset plug and put your lead into that, I record it onto either the iPod or my old fashioned MD player, then if you want you can just add that to your video when editing. iPod is great because you just Sync it into iTunes and makes it really easy to add to any video. We use thing thing - Belkin TuneTalk Stereo - The next best invention to cable ties I reckon! :thumb_up:

 

If you have a passenger with you, it makes it a bit different cause they'll want a headset and hear you also! But 90% of the time, I don't want to record sound with a pax anyway!! ;)

 

If you get a HDD camera, make sure it's a 'solid state Hard drive', that way it won't shut down on you when bumped and jiggled. (as Foto states above)

 

 

[DarkSarcasm]

Few more questions:

 

Do the GoPro cams have an image stabiliser thing? (you can tell I'm not particularly into photography huh)

 

Do g-forces affect cameras?

 

 

[perthjay85]

battery looks to last for about 2.5 hours according to website which I dont think is that good.

 

G forces shouldnt affect the camera at all and the motorsport go pro will handle the bumps from turbulence easily.

 

I did see another camera on a site that sells the Gopro so check that out aswell if you get time. :

 

VHoldR ContourHD 1080P Helmet Camera | Launch Helmet Cams

 

 

[Al B]

The wide-angle GoPros do have the advantage of capturing a good chunk of the aircraft when mounted on a wing. A normal lens would mean you would focus on a small part of the plane and not see much else - and after the first few shots, the plane is the most boring part of the picture.

 

As a bonus, if you put it on your car near the road, you look like you're doing 150 clicks when you're doing 80.

 

For batteries I'd buy cheapish lithium AAAs from somewhere like Soanar (website is https://www.soanarplus.com/default.jsp?xcid=1)

 

I wouldn't be too worried about the suction cup falling off. If you attach it to a clean surface you feel like you're going to break the cup before it'll pull off.

 

A little bit of camerawork done at my airfield with a GoPro:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7UMQ2rCzuY"

 

 

[Foto_Flyer]

The GoPro Wide (Std. & HD) doesn't have image stabilizer, but due to it's extreme wide angle, the vibrations are barely noticeable to non existent on the footage. (see "Ultralights" footage on page 2) The standard GoPro has a narrower field of view so the engine vibrations etc. maybe more noticeable.