bilby54

Thanks DJ, I wanted to know for my own information. Is there another organisation other than ICAO that onon icao members may belong to but just don't want to be associated with icao as possibly a bunch of other manufacturers have just as high standards but are not in the accepted club as defined in 95.55?? As for testing, the Thruster was the first certified aircraft on the register and was rushed through for political expedience so was never completely tested but is a rugged little aeroplane with documentation to back it.

Can anyone explain why we have to have ICAO signatures for aircraft to fly and the reason behind it?? As was mentioned by Dazza in a previous post, ICAO is probably corrupt and to my understanding, payment of money to some distant organisation doesn't suddenly make an aircraft safe to fly. The old school tie syndrome

I only cross hire this particular aircraft so other documentation is held at the maintenance facilty off field. The flight manual only refers to documentation for the country in which it is registered so I surmise that it is with the maintenance and technical records but not in this particular aircraft.

John, I'll be over at the airfield today taking a trip down memory lane so will have a look

Ahh the Scout!! Now there was an aircraft you could stack in the air!!!

Hi John, I am only (was) the operator of this aircraft for my flying school and now trying to get my old Gazelle back in the air which incidentally, was grounded due to a non standard propellor - Sweetapple versus Allsize

Officially the reason for the grounding - from RAA # Firstly the aircraft manufacturer does not hold a production certificate to produce a Type Certified Aircraft in accordance with our regulation CAO 95.55. #Secondly the aircraft itself does not have or hold a Type Certificate issued by any country that is recognised by CASA., EASA or any other ICAO aviation approved countries. as far as we can find . # The aircraft has no Compliance Statement signed and approved from the manufacturer stating that the aircraft conforms to any LSA ASTM standards. It still begs the question as to how it got approved in the first place and not a witch hunt against Tech Managers

Hi Sue, I just saw your reply and ask if you managed to get the aircraft certified with the Bolly prop? There was a lot of testing done at Caloundra and the performance of the Gazelle was considerably improved with the 3 blade set up

The requirement is for every owner to be notified in writing by registered post within 24 hours with a complete description of the reasons and the relevant regulations This is going to become a very messy and expensive event for the RAA.

At the time of my posting, I did not know the circumstances behind the grounding and never having had an aircraft grounded before, I did not know how to react except to get the info out. I fully support the importer of the Ibis as he is a bloody good bloke and has done a remarkable job in promoting the product and supporting all of the owner / users. See how you feel when your aircraft is grounded and flying school shut down- without warning - without any idea of why except that it was NOT airframe related. As I stated previously, someone previously in command of one of our organisations that deal with aircraft 'licensing' needs a number 10 planted in his backside. There is no suspision from me and I do not understand what your issue is here

In the order of ten +/-, so in excess of a $million for the current fleet . I use one for training - sorry used one up until Thursday and several along the coast are also trainers. The point of the posting was to highlight that someone in authority has stuffed up big time and somone else doing audits has found out so don't be surprised if other aircraft are suddenly grounded without notice and not posted with any 'substantive' information. This is nothing to do with airworthiness but is a huge "clerical" error be it CASA or RAA

From the speed at which things have happened, I don't think there was time to post it on the web site but all owners and operators were contacted immediately the ban was imposed. Not so much as the aircraft was "kit built" in this country as many imported factory aircraft are assembled and completed. This issue is related to paperwork for a type certificate for our regulations and other miscellaneous things in relation to 'our regulations' specifically 95.55 The thing that bothers me is why after 6 years on the register and all registered with 24, did it picked up now? Surely that is supposed to happen when it is put on the register and approved by both CASA and RAA. Who did the job on this one??? A lot of owners and operators with what was an approved aircraft are in shock and things could possibly get a little ugly if not sorted soon

RA-Aus has grounded all Pacific Ibis aircraft from 1138 today. Tough luck for those of us using them for training as it is a paperwork issue from several years back and nothing to do with the integrity of the aircraft

Thanks Aldo and yes it was a typo. I was just recovering from a dose of the shakes after someone else's arrogance and supidity. I am not in the business of 'putting people in' and usually prefer to talk to them but just recently it would have taken more of my time than flying :) If it had been some sort of emergency or a request then it would have been easy to deal with and we do it all the time but arrogance topped off with complete disregard for training aircraft rates very low in my book! Thanks everyone for listening to my gripe

I have reported it to CASA as I am sick of being targeted by idiots. I operate in a very busy airspace and manage to turn out students with a lot of co-operation from Q-link, RFDS and all of the crew change aircraft. We are not talking about low time pilots or the odd genuine mistake; these people are flying high powered aircraft and have a fair few hours to exercise that priveleged. I am over it quite frankly and do not have any hesitation about informing whoever that problems exist in regional centres. Just think of how you would feel if was you or a family member.

Hi everyone, Over the last week I have managed to do around 30 hours of instructing and have seen some of the most unprofessional, dangerous and don't give a damn flying from all sectors of the flying commumity. There was only one incident from an RAAus pilot in a Jabiru that busted the circuit right in front of me, on the wrong frequency and then did a wonderfull display of dangerous aerobatics with a split arse turn onto final. The pressurised Cessna 210 at approximately 300' doing a right hand turn onto final against the circuit traffic. The Cessna something that had the Q Link Q400 Dash8 do a go around and a Piper Malibu that decided that due to "Operational reasons" would fly contrary to the other aircraft doing circuits and land on a collision course while I was still taxying. What is it with the poor airmanship that is happening around the regional airfields? I have reported these incidents to CASA as I am becoming worried for my well being while flying from a few idiots who don't care about anyone but their own precious self. Hiding poor airmanship behind "operational constraints" just doesn't cut it.

Yes, a damn shame!

Like Pud said, it is most likely an earthing problem. I had an intermittent fault in a Drifter like you described and turned out to be a faulty terminal connection. It is quite possible that the earth lead from that magneto is earthing through other instruments rather than straight to frame and they can be mongrels to find at times.

I gotta tell you TP, I have a lot of respect for your inputs but you lost me on this last one. The average bog standard aircraft has a mechanical fuel pump and quite often an electric (boost, auxillary, optional or call it what you will) pump. We are all good pilots and read the flight manual so take off and land with the electric pump on - no issues so far. In cruise, if the engine shuts down for whatever reason we turn on the electric pump and the engine continues to produce power. We could feasibly conclude that the mechanical pump has failed and that is the extent of identifying the underlying problem so that is why I openly stated that it does not matter how the fuel system works because essentially they all work in very similar ways. I know about floats sinking in boiling fluids within the float chamber and appreciate that it has been aired in this post. As for the needle valve opening being "a series of opening valve-filling chamber-closing valve-opening valve etc" I think is not entirely correct. At very low power it does happen that way but at cruise power it becomes a process control situation and the needle valve throttles to supply the demand from the float chamber level. Fuel is continually entering the chamber to replace that being sucked up the main jet. As I mentioned earlier, 15 litres fuel flow per hour - Jabiru Flight Manual - is 4 millilitres per second and as the float falls, fuel starts to flow and will maintain the valve opening to provide a constant level in the float chamber. This can be seen from any breed of fuel flow indicator fitted in the aircraft and seems to have started this whole session off. I also stated that the fuel flow indicator can indicate an increase in fuel flow but not necessarily into the engine - I think that you and other mentioned exactly the same thing. The carby on Jabiru engines is located below the engine so any excess fuel will tend not flow down the throat but would more likely over flow the float bowl as someone else mentioned. I could accept this as being a reasonable cause of the accident that I had to clean up.

Hi, sorry for my earlier frustrations but I, like everyone else, am only trying to find out why this happened. I have had practical experience that it does occur and all of the components in the aircraft were the ones supplied by the manufacturer. I remember asking the pilot at the time if he could smell petrol while flying and there was no smell inside when I picked it up from the paddock. I cannot ask him anymore questions as he is no longer with us. It really doesn't matter how the fuel system should work, there maybe an underlying problem that either has not been addressed or admitted by the manufacturer or has not been reported to them.

Any more theories?? The needle does not shut off in normal operation as it is supplying fuel to the engine.

Hmm! Lots of contradictory stuff in this post. FD - You are correct in saying that having the electric pump on does not change the fuel used 'by the engine'. Read #12 where I said there was no change to the engine power as that is almost impossible due to the carby float as was well described by Will K. I referred to the fuel flow increasing when the boost pump was on. Interestingly enough, this aircraft was not fitted with a fuel flow indicator at the time of the accident but was fitted after it was repaired. The stain on the underside started very close to the vent line from the mechanical pump and the aircraft got through 65 litres of fuel in exactly 3 hours and 10 mins of engine time. 15 litres per hour is just over 4ml per second so pulsing from the pump is not an issue but high pressure in the delivery line is and is why it is called a 'boost' pump so it is very feasible that the mechanical pump is relieving.When the aircraft was flown with the electric pump in the off position, it would fly safely for almost 4.5 hours. When the engine was checked, it still was almost full of oil. The Flight Manual states that all flights are to be planned at 15 litres per hour so where did the fuel go on that trip?? Why are questions asked in this forum if no one likes to hear the answers? Wouldn't everyone like to know why this happens because what if one day you have a mechanical pump fail so turn on the electric pump and then run out of fuel short of your alternate.

The Jab referred to above ran out of fuel after 3 hours and 10 minutes which is around 20 litres per hour with the electric pump on. Fuel burn without the pump on was approx 14 lts per hour See the picture for the fuel stain on the underside of the fuselage

We have one in our hanger. Great for hanging the washing on especially on windless days!!

I had this same problem with the Aero Club SP480 Jabiru. When the electric pump was running, the fuel flow increased by around 3 litres per hour (I think) but there was no difference to the engine output. The aircraft was run out of fuel and forced landed in a paddock due to the pilot leaving the pump on for the duration of the flight - yes, and not monitoring his fuel load but this was covered in another post some time back. I could never satisfactorily find where the fuel was going with the boost pump on and even bench testing the complete fuel system did not solve the mystery. The underside of the Jab had a very distinct stain and I can only assume that excess fuel was coming from somewhere around the mechanical pump. Jabiru were unable to help with the problem then either.