flying dog

Brazil. 4 people on a helicopter. Sorry can't give more details, as it was only a 20 second video. But the helpicopter shook itself appart after/upon landing.

Ok, here's the question: There is this show called "Banged up abroad" which is where people get them selves into silly/sticky situations while overseas. Why anyone would do it, is beyond me, but it poses a question: What happens if you are overseas and someone threatens you to do something - like carry drugs - and if you don't they DO have enough information on you to make your life "difficult". I know it is a no brainer what to do, but WHO do you go to? Going to the local police they would probably laugh at you and lock you up. Anyway, I know nothing about what to do, the scenario is described. Thoughts/comments?

Good to see this is keeping itself alive. The replies have been interesting to say the least. Now, indulge me a bit more thought on the topic thus: We've covered the "event" and how to deal with it - kinda. Though mostly with number 1's rather than 2's. My next stumbling point is AFTER THE FACT! Ok, 1's will - maybe at worst - be a wet stain on the trousers. Easily explainable away as spilt water while flying. But sersiously, what about number 2's? Oh, and I don't mean the ones which are nice and dry. I'm talking about the ones like mud. Runny, wet and pretty well full on yucky! Yeah, ok, not a nice thing to think about/what ever. Hey, I am only asking. I feel by talking about it we can learn to "accept" how it would feel and, if by some bad luck, you are ever caught or see someone who has been caught out, know how to act so as to not make it any wore for the parties involved than it already is. But I can only try to imagine a plane landing and the pilot (or PAX) getting out with a somewhat obvious brown stain. Reguardless of the face they would have enduring the smell. And then ofcourse there is the problem of cleaning out the plane. Eeeeewwwwww.....

That's a good point and one I should have mentioned earlier. Ok, for glider pilots it is not as easy, but for plane pilots: If you are in this situation close to the end of the flight, don't think "I'll hold on until I land then go." If you are busting to go, abort the landing, get somewhere "safe" and do it. Don't try to empty the bladder WHILE landing. When it is that close and you are un-certain if you will make it, get out of the circuit area and deal with the problem away from other aircraft. Don't try it in the circuit or while landing. It isn't worth it.

I'm going to have nightmares about some of this you know.

Now there is a good (if not great) movie! Got the two DVDs.

Reading the glider link and article: I would hate to have a hairy appendage. Shaving around the "bottom" of it would be difficult enough, but have to shave the actual length as well. Yikes!

Interesting. Oh, the insiration came from watching "Top Gear" and they were saying how needing to "go potty" affects your ability to drive. Looking at some of the replies; my thoughts: 1 - Landing on an old road and "getting the business done". Fair enough, but what happens if you mess up the landing? What legal minefield have you entered? 2 - Flying within your limits. Granted. I don't want to seem to be advocating exceeding your limits. That can be very dangerous. 3 - Tieing knots.... Well, I'll be modest and say mine isn't long enough to do that. 4 -Guernsey Intersting. But again: I won't bite, though I am tempted. If you are flying "high" it also takes time to descend, and as you do, the air pressure increases on the bladder and this makes it worse if it is a number 1 you are wanting to do. Other things which were mentioned: Get your priorities right. I agree. Aviate, Navigate, Communicate. Everything else after that. Facthunter, thanks for the honesty. Biggles, hope you are going good with resolving the problem. I guess what I really mean is how you "deal with" the sensation/fact of actaully having it happen to you, and the resultant smell until you land and clean up. I"ve had a couple of close calls with "number 1's". I think people are "conditioned" that when we sit on the dunny, releaving ourselves isn't a problem. But sitting in a car/plane/any seat other than a toilet it is difficult to feel ok as it happens. Sure it isn't something you want to "simulate" it so you "get used to it". Heaven forbid. I was just wondering what people would get their heads around the scenario.

OK, Bad title - kinda. But I don't know how better to attract people to the thread and (maybe) get some serious discussion going. Scenario: You are going on a Cross Country trip. You've planned it, weather good, fuel stops at good places. A couple of long legs between airports, but nothing to worry about. Now, to the question/problem: You are off, everything is good. About an hour into the flight and "in the middle of no-where" you need to go! I'm not talking about, rumble rumble. I may need to go in about 30 minutes. You need to go NOW! Say maybe 3 minutes at the outside. I know it is part of planning allowing for these kind of things, but "$hit happens" as it were. Sometimes you can't pick when this sort of thing is going to happen. So in a moment of curiossity, I was seriously wondering: What would you do? Obviously land and deal with the problem, but I mean at the actual time it happens. Yeah, ok, not nice to think about. But seriously, it can happen - though I don't think I would wish it on anyone. Thoughts?

Yenn, There are different types/styles of pumps. There are the centrifical ones, and then there are the ones like the one discribed as the "engine pump" where a cam lifts a diaphram so suck in fuel, and then the cam "retracts". There is a spring which is then used to return the diaphram to the normal position and so expelling the fuel at a given pressure. And then there are other types as well. I'm not into that so I shall stop there.

Ah. Appologies.

Yeah, well that doesn't work. Tried logging in with this username/password. Not allowed.

GUYS! Hello!? This is getting a wee bit "off thread". I am asking about Jabirus and the increased fuel flow when the electric fuel pump is turned on. Not other aircraft. Not centrifical pumps. Not fuel injection systems. I appreciate there is a bit of lattitude, but this is just getting WAY OFF the original question.

Rocketdriver, I can't argue with that, but the "increase in pressure" is another thing. Can anyone say - definitivley - how much more pressure the electric pump put in/on the fuel? A car's electric fuel pump - as an analogy: Most blokes can pi$$ faster/harder than the pump. The needle/seat in the carb should negate the extra pressure - unless we are talking about going from (example) 2 PSI to 20 PSI. It would be foolish to add a fuel pump to the system which (by default) puts too much pressure for the carby to handle. Fuel injection systems as you mentioned are another kettle of fish and do have the extra things, so really theyy aren't applicable to this. Are they? Now to something you posted: This is because the float has to push harder to close the valve, which can only happen if the fuel level in the float chamber increases. Sorry? The float level doesn't change irrispective of the pressure. When the fuel is at "level x" the needle pokes into the seat and bloks the fuel flow. (Again, this is with normal pressures. If you push the pressure into another set of figures, the needle/seat won't work.) So I can't understand what you are wanting to say here. P.S. (via edit). And you mentioned "COMPETITION ENGINES". I agree that they have special tricks they do to optimise their systems. But again: How does this relate to Jab' engines? And how much "richer" will all this make? less than 10%, less than 20%, 30, 40...? A small increase of mixture would be "ok" and this would need quantative testing to see what really happens to fuel consumption. Also EGT's would need to be measured. (And/or CHT)

Bilby, Yes, I am saying that having the electric fuel pump turned on (always) should not/will not change the fuel used by the engine. RE post 12: Can't say. Insufficient details.

I'm laughing all the way to the bank. I weigh 40-50 Kg nominal. I don't own scales. (I'm not a fish - sorry.)

Bilby, Well I have asked, asked and done research. What I have found - and belive to be true: The fuel pump is in the wrong place and it is interfering with the sensor. The sensor SHOULD be as far away from the pump as possible, OR: BEFORE the pump. Leaving the electric fuel pump on does NOT change the fuel consumed by the engine. There is a slot/slit/groove in the pump's piston which allows the fuel to back flow once pressure is reached.

No worries. I am just asking. Live and learn!

David, I agree, but "they" say there is no "return line" from the carb'. I should have mentioned the problem with the explination but I wasn't wanting to put him off-side. He was on the spot and was only sumising - he actually admitted he didn't know and I am kind of respectful of him for admiting that. Not many people can admit they don't know something, especially if it is to do with something they should know about. Anyway, I'm still stuck on what is going on with the extra fuel.

Just spoke to Jab (won't say the person's name.... - parly because I've already forgotten it) He offered the possibility that with the electric fuel pump on, the mixture is increased and so the engine would be running with a higher fuel/air mixture. And.... As the butterfly isn't any more opened, the revs won't increase. Makes sense I guess, but he wasn't 100% sure. Anyone with thoughts on that?

Ooops, dislexia. Yeah, the Newcastle club...... Sorry.

Thanks. So, riddle me this: (wink wink) The reves on the engine are determined by the ammount of fuel. The ammount of fuel governs the ammount of fuel/hour the engine uses. After I start the engine I get a Litres/hour figure shown. Swithing on the electric fuel pump the number increases BUT the revs don't. There has to be a return line: Otherwise the "extra" fuel flow is not being burnt/combusted/used. Or am I missing something?

Though not at Maitland, but a few miles to the west, there is going to be a bit of a get together at Luskintyre airport that weekend. Contact RNFC for more details. Ask for Phil (Lucky).

Yeah, the radio is one of those small round things which are the "norm" for Jabs. Alas a lot of testing will have to wait until next time I am down that part of the world - it is 1.5 hours driving - so it is not every day I am close to it.

Yeah, I've seen that a long time ago. Would love to know how to download and save it. Tried, tried and tried. Failed, failed and failed.