Can a 100+ton Airliner disappear into a steel columned concret tower building?

[Flightrite]

The human mind is the most complex organ in our fuselages and we know very little about it, it is however easily fooled for some!

Can any of us imagine what it would have been like watching those towers collapse after impact knowing a family member worked in them? Just unimaginable on all fronts to think it wasn't a real terrorist event!

[M61A1]

Pretty sure that is one of the inner walls.

[ATTACH type=full" alt="download.jpg]53477[/ATTACH][ATTACH type=full" alt="september-11-pentagon-design-gettyimages-1328633.jpg]53478[/ATTACH][ATTACH type=full" alt="debris.jpg]53480[/ATTACH]

Quite likely. I imagine someone has tried to pass it off the outer wall. The images you link are the ones I have seen. Plenty of debris and scorch marks where the wings hit .

[onetrack]

If you really want the objective, definitive, total story, of the attack on the Pentagon, then the U.S. Navy link below provides it as a book with the utmost detail.

 

It is 215 pages of exceptional details, that no conspiracy theorist has obviously ever read.

 

The book is the U.S. Govt report on the 9/11 Pentagon attack, and it was collated via reports from thousands of people - survivors, first responders, military people, eyewitnesses. To try and pitch a story that this report is a conspiracy, is lunacy.

 

The hole pictured above, is what is referred to as the "punch-out" wall (an inner wall) where the final large parts of the aircraft penetrated the last inner wall of the building.

 

It is quite amazing that is a nearly circular hole, but no Cruise missile has ever left a circular hole in anything.

 

https://www.history.navy.mil/research/library/online-reading-room/title-list-alphabetically/p/pentagon-9-11-footnotes.html

[Methusala]

It is quite amazing that is a nearly circular hole, but no Cruise missile has ever left a circular hole in anything.

 

[Methusala]

[ATTACH type=full]53482[/ATTACH]

[onetrack]

You'd have to admit, that a missile of whatever sort it was, that the Houthis lobbed on those Saudi oil tanks, wasn't exactly a huge success - because it's pretty obvious they failed to explode!

 

No such luck with the "Cruise missile" that hit the Pentagon! The explosion and fireball was captured on video!

 

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/911-pentagon-attack/

[M61A1]

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Wanna bet? I've personally seen (and walked through) a hole in the superstructure of a ship made by a Harpoon missile almost perfectly round. The missile wasn't fitted with a warhead as it was just a test, but still made a hole just like that. There were a few small parts around, but virtually nothing recognisable from the missile.

[facthunter]

A depleted uranium (Armour piercing) projectile would probably make an even round hole where a dum dum type wouldn't. Nev

[Flightrite]

Crazy world we live in that's for sure!☹

[Jabiru7252]

Maybe folks should include in their posts what qualifications, experience and credentials they have to make some of their weird and amazing claims. A farmer for instance shouldn't make bold claims about the effects of missile strikes or burning skyscrapers. It's embarrassing.

[jackc]

Maybe folks should include in their posts what qualifications, experience and credentials they have to make some of their weird and amazing claims. A farmer for instance shouldn't make bold claims about the effects of missile strikes or burning skyscrapers. It's embarrassing.

 

This qualify?

[danny_galaga]

To the OP, 'alternate media' is not that if the people aren't presenting it aren't trained journalists. Most of these guys don't even know anything about logical fallacies for instance and so can't even determine if an argument is sound or not. And then their 'research' comprises solely of going to tinfoilhat.com .

 

These conspiracy theorists are flourishing now because of the internet. And people lap it up because we all like to think we know something others don't. That's the psychology of it. I've been a victim of that myself. But you can't live your life thinking everything around you is a conspiracy. That road leads to paranoid schizophrenia.

 

Understand that you can't know everything that is going on around you and you will lead a happier life.

[Flightrite]

To the OP, 'alternate media' is not that if the people aren't presenting it aren't trained journalists. Most of these guys don't even know anything about logical fallacies for instance and so can't even determine if an argument is sound or not. And then their 'research' comprises solely of going to tinfoilhat.com .

 

These conspiracy theorists are flourishing now because of the internet. And people lap it up because we all like to think we know something others don't. That's the psychology of it. I've been a victim of that myself. But you can't live your life thinking everything around you is a conspiracy. That road leads to paranoid schizophrenia.

 

Understand that you can't know everything that is going on around you and you will lead a happier life.

 

Too true, but those who are 'different' also have the right to their 'odd' opinion even if it is so tragic, we need them in this world if for nothing else other than entertainment!?

[Methusala]

Maybe folks should include in their posts what qualifications, experience and credentials they have to make some of their weird and amazing claims.

Should this forum have a set of restrictive rules so that participants will never encounter opinions that conflict with their own? Like a modern version of Pravda or The Chinese Peoples Daily.

Years ago, in response to such questions, Ian started What's up Australia. A number of us were pleased to remove our"offensive" discussions to that area. This has now been replaced by "Off Topic". That is where, at the kind suggestion of Willedoo, I posted this thread.

I suggest that anyone who is "embarrassed" to read or comment on a wider range of topics should avoid this area "like the plague". Don

[Methusala]

I would respectfully also argue that making gratuitous judgements on the character or motives of fellow forumites is an addmission that you have no meaningful input to add to the topic. Thanks Guys. don

[kgwilson]

The internet is how people like Trump flourish. He may be a 6 times bankrupt, narcissistic, racist, misoginistic, reality TV host idiot but he still managed to become POTUS. Great entertainment for the rest of the world & his use of the internet (& lies) got him there.

[jackc]

Too true, but those who are 'different' also have the right to their 'odd' opinion even if it is so tragic, we need them in this world if for nothing else other than entertainment!?

 

They, usually end up in Parliament:-)

[onetrack]

I don't have any missile engineer qualifications, but as a Vietnam veteran, I've seen and inspected plenty of explosive armaments results, and I was often the target, or part of it.

I am a trained military engineer, with qualifications in mine warfare and explosive demolitions - and practical use of explosives in civilian life, as an agricultural earthmover, and also as a mining contractor.

 

The hole in the inner Pentagon wall was made largely by the remnants of one of the engines of the Boeing.

If a cruise missile goes through an object (steel ship superstructure or hull, or a building wall), it will either explode on the other side - or not explode (due to faults in construction or design) - whereupon the missile remains largely intact.

 

The conspiracy theorists fail to explain the precise sequence of events involving the "cruise missile" that supposedly struck the Pentagon. Yet the outside walls of the Pentagon suffered extreme explosive damage and fire damage.

This means that whatever blew up against those walls expended its explosive energy upon contact with those walls.

 

Yet the conspiracy theorists would then have us believe that the "cruise missile" then continued onwards to the inner ring wall of the Pentagon and then made a fairly neat circular hole - after having exploded against the outer walls??

Give me a break, this is complete and utter BS of the highest order, developed in a warped mind that sees conspiracy in two people speaking to each other, where they can't hear the conversation.

[Flightrite]

I don't have any missile engineer qualifications, but as a Vietnam veteran, I've seen and inspected plenty of explosive armaments results, and I was often the target, or part of it.

I am a trained military engineer, with qualifications in mine warfare and explosive demolitions - and practical use of explosives in civilian life, as an agricultural earthmover, and also as a mining contractor.

 

The hole in the inner Pentagon wall was made largely by the remnants of one of the engines of the Boeing.

If a cruise missile goes through an object (steel ship superstructure or hull, or a building wall), it will either explode on the other side - or not explode (due to faults in construction or design) - whereupon the missile remains largely intact.

 

The conspiracy theorists fail to explain the precise sequence of events involving the "cruise missile" that supposedly struck the Pentagon. Yet the outside walls of the Pentagon suffered extreme explosive damage and fire damage.

This means that whatever blew up against those walls expended its explosive energy upon contact with those walls.

 

Yet the conspiracy theorists would then have us believe that the "cruise missile" then continued onwards to the inner ring wall of the Pentagon and then made a fairly neat circular hole - after having exploded against the outer walls??

Give me a break, this is complete and utter BS of the highest order, developed in a warped mind that sees conspiracy in two people speaking to each other, where they can't hear the conversation.

 

Ah come on 'one track' don't ruin the entertainment we are getting from a certain poster??? We couldn't dream this sh1t up if we tried??

[M61A1]

I don't have any missile engineer qualifications

Neither do I, but as an ex-RAAF armourer, I've had plenty to do with guided weapons and seen a lot of the damage they can do and the results of a few CFITs in fast jets.

[Paulmilo]

The stupid thing about these conspiracy theories is that these ppl look for all these little ‘potential‘ discrepancies but fail to acknowledge the elephant in the room, that there were literally thousands of ppl all watching it unfold real time, and not just on TV. There is NOTHING REMOTELY SENSIBLE about the conspiracy theories.

 

Has anyone ever tried to accomplish something even remotely complex? It never works as planned. In the Army we would say the strategic plan only gets you to the point of crossing the line of departure. After that you will be reacting to what ever was thrown at you and playing it by ear all the way to the objective.

 

if the planes that EVERYONE saw hit the building did not bring it down, then what did? Explosives rigged in the basement? ...oh hang on, anyone watching this saw that the top floors imploded and then the weight of that collapse cascade down the building. I was watching a news anchor talk about blah blah, and on the screen behind them you got to see the building start to implode. It was amazing and crazy knowing there were still people inside.

 

the most amazing thing is that the somewhat basic plan by the terrorist actually worked on any level, from taking control of the aircraft, to actually hitting the building to having it collapse.

[danny_galaga]

Soon after those attacks, I remember a visiting american intelligence officer saying it was a brilliant commando operation. And it was. They were able to execute their objectives almost perfectly, other than the plane that crashed before it hit anything. The question of why is another matter, but from the perspective of a plan coming together, it was brilliant.

[Flightrite]

It's worth remembering that pre 09/11 security was not as secure, pretty much anyone could get trained in a Sim with a few connections and $$$. They didn't need to take off or land just to be able to point the plane where they wanted it to go. The concept of the terrorists plans seemed simple enough to a point. Once the basic knowledge to control the Airliners was obtained it was only a matter of getting access to the cockpit which back then was easy compared to today. The B767 is a basic flying machine not much complicated about it for their purposes. I'd imagine that even the terrorists didn't expect the buildings to collapse, just hitting them would have achieved their objective, terror instilled into the American people and the free world, they achieved their mission with almost military precision! RIP to the inocent on a day that changed the world, forever!?

[old man emu]

In the Army we would say the strategic plan only gets you to the point of crossing the line of departure

 

A strategic plan gets a big boost if there is a huge dose of the Element of Surprise, which this operation had in Spades.

[Old Koreelah]

...they achieved their mission with almost military precision! RIP to the inocent on a day that changed the world, forever!?

But did they achieve their mission? I assume their main aim was to get American military, cultural and business interests out of the Islamic world. Instead, they precipitated more wars, more US involvement.